Old 10-20-2013, 03:04 PM
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Default Pro Strategy on Hole 3 @ Winthrop Gold (USDGC)

I watched a good bit of the USDGC coverage, and I was struck by the fact that most pros took the white route. Very few took the black route, but I'm curious why.

The white route saw people who yanked their discs to the right and caught early trees. It saw people whose discs didn't hyzer out as much and hit the trees long. It saw people who skipped near the basket and landed in the OB/hazard area.

I'd be tempted to take the black route. A flat throw with something mildly understable as it would turn a bit, then fade back to relatively straight. If it turned too much I'd be in the trees, pin-high and to the right. It seems to me a better play, with a little more wiggle room. Throw it at the basket and you're certain it'll turn some. It won't be likely to skip. I think the black line has fewer "bad" cases from throws that aren't too far from good.

So my question is why do the better players take the hyzer (white) route? What are they doing that I don't get? Is it simply easier to range the hyzer than the slight flex shot? It's a short fairway driver or even a mid hole, right? 389, open air, elevated tee… Is it that under stable discs are tougher to control? Why is a hyzer "the shot" to play on this hole?
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Old 10-20-2013, 03:07 PM
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Halcón Halcón is offline
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Hyzer for life, bra.
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Old 10-20-2013, 03:11 PM
mullethead326 mullethead326 is offline
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In some respects, this is a similar discussion to the triple-mando hole-- even some pros don't feel comfortable with straight shots. It is definitely easier to range the hyzer, and let the fade of the disc dictate where it finishes.

In this instance, with the hazard area fairly close, it may be that most players felt they could guarantee a 2 or 3 playing to the right, so that if they hit trees or finished short, they're pitching up on their second shot, or putting for 2, instead of the possibility of sailing long or left and having a long putt for the 3.
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Old 10-20-2013, 03:16 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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The primary reason to take the white route is to keep the disc inbounds. Even if it gets knocked down by the trees, and up-and-down for three is fairly routine for most of those guys.

Meanwhile, taking the black route puts you dangerously close to the hazard area. If you end up in the hazard, a par 3 becomes a much more difficult proposition since being anywhere within the hazard assures you of being outside the 10-meter circle when attempting your third shot.

Also, it is what you allude to...the hyzer line is the more comfortable one to throw in terms of control and "range". Any disc that you are intentionally trying to get to turn over or anhyzer is subject to more variables and requires a bit more touch to get right. A disc that stays anhyzered or turned over longer than desired is also going to glide further than desired (and bring the hazard long into play). A disc that comes out of its turn too quickly is going to fall off into the hazard well short of the target.

Something else to keep in mind is the hazard areas are not cut as low and close as the inbounds areas, so while a shot can skip into the hazard from inbounds, a disc is less likely to skip out of the hazard into an inbounds area, so LHBH and RHFH shots also carry some danger if they are flying over the hazard area.

Bottom line is the less the disc flies near or over a hazard or OB area, the better chance the shot has of getting a good result. Thus you see more players carrying shots wider to the right on that hole than flirting with the left side.

Re: disc selection. That is a mid or even a stable putter off the tee for most of the top players. They use those because a) they minimize the skip and b) downhill throw they don't need anything faster than that to get there. Rule of thumb tends to always be to throw the slowest disc possible that will still get where you want to go.

Last edited by JC17393; 10-20-2013 at 03:20 PM.
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Old 10-20-2013, 11:43 PM
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Star Shark Star Shark is offline
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If you're throwing a moderately overstable mid or putter, you can thow at the left edge of the foliage and let your shot fade back towards the basket. Keep in mind that 99% of the guys are playing for a parkjob and not ace running it as that play brings the back of the green OB into play.
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Old 10-21-2013, 10:55 AM
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From the videos by McFlySoHigh, I compiled this. By "straight" I mean something that starts inside the tree line near the basket, and by "right" I mean something that if it flew straight would finish well into the tree line to the right of the basket.

Round 1
Feldberg - Right - Didn't fade, Trees (3)
Baldwin - Right - Parked (2)
Doss - Right - Parked (2)
Reading - Right - Flipped a bit, Trees (3)

Round 2
Schultz - Right - IN but faded left of basket (2)
Wiggins - Straight - Turned into trees (3)
Doss - Right - Parked (2)
Brinster - Right - Faded into OB (3)

Round 3
Doss - Right - Faded into OB (4)
Brinster - Right - Faded near OB (3)
Rico - Straight - Faded into OB (4)
Schusterick - Right - Never faded, Trees (3)

Round 4
Brinster - Right - Trees (3)
Doss - Right - Faded near OB (3)
Rico - Straight - Finished just right/long (2)
Schusterick - Straight - Finished just right (2)

Right - 12 throws (avg: 2.75)
Birdies - 4
Pars - 7
Bogeys - 1

Straight - 4 throws (avg: 2.75)
Birdies - 2
Pars - 1
Bogeys - 1

Now, that's a ridiculously small sample size, and little things like Rico's birdie in round 4 or the two par saves from OB can throw things off, but at least my memory wasn't totally off. At least there's some reason to ask the question, I mean. Of the 12 players who played right, four found the trees costing them a birdie, two finished OB, and a few more were really close to fading or skipping into OB.

In watching some of the playback it seems the best play is actually to throw a relatively straight disc but one that will be guaranteed to fade a little (i.e. maybe throwing a straight disc on a hyzer angle) just into the trees on the right. Some people favored a start line too far right and caught trees, and others who started the disc too straight had the disc fade out too much and go OB or near to it.
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:06 AM
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notroman notroman is online now
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The reason so many throw the right side is because usually there is wind blowing off the lake on that hole (left to right) and throwing the straight shot with a mid is too touchy when there is a crosswind present. You want to throw a neutral mid for that shot so that you don't hyzer out OB at the end, but at the same time you want to make sure you don't burn out into the woods since you're throwing downhill. If there's any crosswind that shot becomes a lot more difficult than the hyzer with a stable/overstable mid.

At this year's UDSGC the wind wasn't really much of a factor so you saw some people go straight at it.
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:15 AM
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CarRamRod CarRamRod is offline
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I played the Performance Flight this year, i'm a decent played 988 rated I play Open. I threw a shot basically right between those with my stable QMS. If thrown flat and hard it goes dead straight with a slow fade at the end of the flight. My thought was to get something to flight straight and land flat, i saw a lot of people throwing the hyzer that had the disc skip into the hazard.

I birdied it 2 of the 4 rounds the 2 rounds i didn't i missed putts from about 30'.
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:58 AM
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Tpro Tpro is offline
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I threw a beat ching straight at it during the doubles.. landed 4 feet right. Easy hole.. Most guys throw the Hyzer when they can because its comfortable.
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:59 AM
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Horsman Horsman is offline
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Theres an easy reason for the hyzer. Its predictable. Less factors to worry about.
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