22 Helpful / 4 Not
Pros: I had the chance to play the Selah Ranch and Trey courses in late October. I had all courses to myself both days I was there (which was a weird feeling). What an extraordinary experience it was at all of these courses. At the end of the day, Lakeside was the best of these courses. DISCLAIMER: This review is my experience after playing the long tees. Here are my pros at Lakeside:
Intro) I played Creekside first and then made the trek over to Lakeside. I have to say that I have never had more anticipation or excitement as I drove to a course. Its about a 5 minute cart drive from Creekside to Lakeside and it was PERFECT. That five minutes allowed me to reflect on what I was about to embark on and it actually really pumped me up. That cart drive, while probably not intentional, was great for just getting me even more excited. The best things in life are worth waiting for....and that 5 minutes of waiting as I drove from hole 18 at Creekside to hole 1 at Lakeside was pretty fun.
1) There's no point not to start with best part of this course, and that's the MANY signature holes. The course had multiple signature holes. Holes 4, 7 and 15 are simply some of the best holes in all of disc golf. Period. More on 7 below. These three holes are really not even signature holes --- they are holes you will never forget. These holes stack up with such holes as Hole 1 at Maple Hill, hole 3 at Flyboy, etc. These are transformational holes that transcend your imagination. Hole 15's inclusion may surprise some, but that teeshot on top of the hill is just breathtaking. Its one of the times when an option hole really works well (more on that below when it doesn't work). You can take the right gap, which is a little more open, and give up a chance at getting there in two and having a chance at eagle. Or you can go up in the middle and put yourself in the catbird's seat and have a chance at getting to the green in two and a chance for eagle. I took the harder gap, hit the gap and then threw a nice shot and gave myself an 80 foot putt for eagle. Hole 4 was just STUNNING. After throwing my drive (which, for most players, is probably a RH hyzer shot that will go out over the water and fade back) I stood at my second shot and just took pictures for five minutes staring out over the lake. I had a 1000 acre ranch to myself with literally no soul in sight. No one was at the B&B, the ranch manager had left and no other disc golfers were at the course. It was me and Selah. It was inspiring and breathtaking at the same time. It was peaceful and quiet. I couldn't help but stare at the lake. The day I played I had not one ounce of wind. Seeing the lake completely still was like looking at the world's biggest mirror and seeing the reflection that is the beauty around that lake was stunning....
2) Hole 7 deserves a place for its own, as stated above. This hole, in my opinion, is probably the third best hole in all of disc golf. Its that amazing. The teeshot is not spectacular, as the hole forces you to throw a shot that doesn't exceed 350 feet. Also, its a little scary to throw a RH hyzer shot off of the tee as that will fade towards the water so a right-handed player with a sidearm is the ideal shot with a throw that carries about 325 feet. The second shot becomes a little more breathtaking as the lake comes into play a little bit more........BUT its the third shot (unless you can throw 500 feet and go for the green on your second shot) that really is probably one of the most memorable shots you will have throw. I left myself about 350 feet to the famous island green and threw my shot to the right side about 25 feet from the basket. This shot is as intimidating as it gets. And I was lucky enough to have no wind that day. There is no shot in disc golf that gets your adrenaline going more than trying to hit an island green from 350 feet. Simply stunning. You can't help but smile. Getting up to the green really allows you to see the beauty of this hole even more. I am reminded of Kevin Costner in Tin Cup..."when a defining moment comes along you define the moment or let the moment define you." In a tournament round, this hole defines the moment. Not much more to say besides.....AMAZING
3) At first I was a little disappointed at the $40 cart fee but after playing two rounds I can tell you that it was worth....every.....dollar. Oh my goodness! It is completely amazing to play disc golf with carts, especially on a massive course such as Lakeside. It was a little bit of a bumpy ride, but who cares. Carts on a disc golf course!
4) Signs, signs everywhere signs! The signs were amazing. They were so detailed and really helped me as I was playing by myself. Every little detail is spelled out for you, from the preferred route to the out of bounds to the obstacles. A+ on the signs!
5) Concrete tees and baskets were great. The baskets are newer because its a newer course and I had no complaints on the tees whatsoever.
6) Navigation was actually a little tricky in a few spots, but this was 100% completely mitigated by the fact that the carts reduced my "finding the next hole" time by 90%. I do remember a few times getting lost (I had a tough time finding hole 15) but as I said, the carts make that so much easier.
7) I have to talk about the design. The design was great (more on that below). You can really tell that an INCREDIBLE amount of thought was given to the design. Hole 2 is, in my opinion, the best example of a perfectly designed hole. From the long tees this hole measures in at 528 feet, which is hardly a par 4 for a fairly open hole. HOWEVER, what makes this hole completely amazing is that the long throw is not the best throw here. A clump of trees is essentially in the middle of the fairway about 350 feet from the tee and that extends about 100 feet towards the basket. The lake guards the right side, and going way left is a very tough shot. Unless you can throw a 550 foot hyzer around the trees and over the lake (and if you can, you deserve a chance at eagle) then you are a little perplexed as to what to do. Throwing a 400 foot hyzer puts you smack into the middle of the trees and risks your shot hitting a tree and dropping down in the water. This is why its a beautiful hole. Houck has forced you to "layup" off of the tee for the best possible chance at birdie. So I threw my Drone off of the tee about 215 feet. I had a 300 foot hyzer for my second shot that probably was more like 335 feet because of the curve required. I put myself just outside the circle and missed the putt. But I gave myself the best opportunity I could for birdie. Great hole and a beautiful design. Very thoughtful.
8) Wooded Par 4's - I thoroughly enjoyed the wooded par 4's and thought they used the terrain very well. I thought the lines were clean and really offered a nice challenge. A birdie on these holes felt like a true birdie. In particular I was a fan of number 10 and the second shot on this hole to a nicely protected green. Also, hole 9 had such a great and tight tee shot that required a tight hyzer that didn't go much further than 300 feet. It was a placement drive ALL the way, which was followed by a curve to the right going towards the green. It was a snaking fairway that really caught my attention.
9) I have to mention the B&B. I am a huge fan of architecture and this thing was stunning. One of the more beautiful buildings I have ever seen. It was insanely massive and I wish I could have stayed in it. If you are planning a trip here please make every effort to stay in the B&B. I was genuinely in awe.
Cons: I don't have many cons with Lakeside. Its one of the best courses in the world and the best courses in the world don't have a lot wrong with it. But I did have a few cons:
1) Hole 14 is a con all by itself. From the tee, this hole is absolutely marvelous. One of my favorite teeshots on the course. Having the ability to pick one of four or five or six or even seven gaps is pretty awesome. The issue with this hole is not the drive, but the second shot. Option holes are great, but they simply do not work for the second shot. Time and time again, option holes have proven to fail miserably when the designer forces options on the second shot. Option holes work great from the tee because you can define where the options are because the disc golfer is throwing from a defined location (teebox). The problem with option holes on second shots is that you can't define where someone will be throwing, and an extraordinary amount of luck will be involved on the second shot. I threw my drive on this hole and hit one of the left gaps perfectly with a RH sidearm shot. I got to my drive and had no shot to get to the basket. Having these tight option fairways on the second shot simply does not work. Trying to place the disc within an 8 foot circle from the tee is not possible; in fact, it invites luck. To prove the point, I went back and threw 5 more teeshots. Four of them hit various gaps, and 1 hit a tree. None of the shots that hit the original gap had a clean line to the basket. The lines are simply too tight and the landing zones are unfair. Opening up the lines and pushing the basket back would be a much better idea with this hole. Option holes are great, but don't work for second shots in my opinion.
2) The wooded par 3's were nice, but they were not entirely memorable. This is NOT the result of bad design or anything but this one fact: once you get away from the lake, the terrain is not that exciting. The terrain is pretty flat and doesn't really offer anything that is truly great. This is through no fault of the designer, but the terrain in the woods in Texas does not compare to the terrain in other parts of the country. To come up with a rating on a scale of 1 to 5, comparisons will be made that look at terrain versus other areas in the country. The lake holes are great but the terrain in the woods is above average, but not spectacular.
3) The course had one too many average holes to be considered a 5 star course. I think a 27 hole course can have more leeway with average holes and get a 5 rating, but for an 18 hole course I think having more than 4 or 5 average holes makes it tough to get that 5 star rating. Case in point: in my opinion, holes 3, 8, 11, 13 and 17 were pretty much average holes. There was nothing wrong with these holes by any means, but nothing about these holes stood out. Taking into account what I said about hole 14 and that means 1/3 of the course was average, at best. That may seem like a crude way to look at it, but its just a fact. Once again, you can't expect EVERY hole to be amazing and I get that. But the terrain in some areas of this complex simply didn't allow "GREAT" to happen. The terrain, while okay, was nothing spectacular.
Other Thoughts: Lakeside is a phenomenal course and I probably would give it a 4.75 if given the chance. Its one of the best courses in the country and is completely worth the trip and enthralling in so many ways. I would highly recommend playing the Trey Deuce courses as well and make it a worthwhile trip. Also, for those that think the cost is high...its not. This facility took A LOT of money to create and is worth every penny. The carts are an amazing feature and really add a ton of value. Support Selah Ranch!
22 of 26 people found this review helpful.
37 Helpful / 6 Not
Maybe I'm crazy?
Pros: Pro shop with a limited selection means that some discs can be replaced. I do not mean to sound like I'm damning this amenity with faint praise, given that most courses I've played over the years don't even have a pro shop. I just don't want people thinking they'll find hundreds of different molds available.
The challenge factor is high here despite the flatness of the area.
Baskets, teepads, etc are all in good shape.
There are many holes where water comes into play without having to carry over water. For me these holes are more intimidating as they tax the end of my shot rather than the beginning. Placement is more important than power, and I enjoy the pressure this causes.
Cons: The price. Let's be honest, this is the elephant in the room. $20 for all day access may be a little steep, but I could live with it. However, the course is designed in such a fashion that you almost have to pay the $40 cart rental fee, which is way over the top. I pay way less at a golf course to drive their cart farther. I'm not sure who came up with the price point on this one, but it really bothers me.
There is very little elevation change, although I didn't deduct for that as the designer cannot work with what he does not have.
For $60 a day I would really like to see some jugs of water out on the course the way one does on golf courses.
Other Thoughts: Maybe I'm nuts, but I enjoyed Creekside more than Lakeside. I waited until I'd played both courses several times and from both sets of tees to write this thinking I'd change my mind, but at the end of the day I'd really like to be able to rate this course a 4.5 and Creekside a 4.75, but working within the system we have I want to rate both courses fairly, but show my preference for Creekside.
Both Selah courses are quite good, but at the end of the day it feels like someone pulled out a checklist labled "Things a good disc golf course needs" and started building. The is kind of a sterile feel that is much more evident on Lakeside than Creekside. Maybe it's the gimmicky island green on 7, or maybe it's the way a couple holes feel forced to play near the lake when they would play better to a different location. I'm not sure what it is that turns me off so much about Lakeside, but at the end of the day I know I won't be dying to play here despite how technically excellent this course is.
37 of 43 people found this review helpful.
"Just" Excellent (or better)
25 Helpful / 9 Not
This course is, perhaps, the first private course that I have ever played that was set up to operate exclusively as a golf course. The pro shop has a limited selection of discs, new and used (no Innova discs). The used disc prices are reasonable.
There are bathrooms and showers in the same building. The shower and toilet access is exterior with separate doors for each shower or toilet. Camping is allowed on the premises, so the shower availability is very practical. As noted by everyone, there are carts.
The course is pay to play. $20 for all day access. Cart rental for all day is $40. I always count pay to play as a pro. The playing fee is perfectly reasonable and I certainly hope that Selah stays profitable. The course is currently for sale and when I mentioned it to the owner, he indicated that there are several potential deals, all of which will keep the course open. And as a private, pay-to-play course with a not insignificant playing fee, you generally won't have to deal with people who leave trash out on the course or are otherwise problematic or who aren't serious about disc golf.
The ownership, while super friendly and exceptionally helpful and nice (there's really not enough good things I can say about the owner), also doesn't tolerate trouble makers. Posted clearly inside and outside the pro shop are signs prohibiting diving for discs. The owner has a catalogued lost and found system and sells unmarked discs found in the pond for $5. The night before we arrived to play, the owner had found some disc golfers diving for discs. The morning that we arrived to play, those trespassers were the custody of the local sheriff. So keep that in mind if you are one of the idiots who think that you are entitled to do whatever you want on someone else's property. Also keep in mind that the owner apparently has night vision equipment and lives on the property.
The only amenities out on the course are the carts, period. No water, benches, trash cans or restrooms. The carts are a suitable replacement for everything but the restrooms. The carts also lessen fatigue to the point that I felt like I could have played all day. I was simply not tired after playing both courses, back-to-back on a 90 degree day.
The course has a significant variety of holes. Some along the shores of a small lake (or very large pond, depending on your perspective). Holes 1, 2, 4, 7 and 18 play along the shore. Hole 7 is a forced water carry from both tees no matter how you play it. It's a true island "green."
The remainder of the holes mostly wind through either heavily wooded or moderately wooded areas with some holes allowing open shots over water. There are few tight, tunnel holes. One notable exception is hole 14, which is apparently supposed to be an array of different tunnels, some straight, some hyzer and some anhyzer to a landing area then rinse and repeat.
Lakeside IS the more technical of the two courses on the property, but it is not overly technical. You need to be able to hit your lines fairly accurately on most holes, but the underbrush on most wooded holes is not overly punishing if you miss your line or hit a tree and go into the unmowed/uncleared areas. Additionally, the hole variety is blended well. The long holes are interspersed with shorter holes, just as the more open holes aren't all grouped together. There is no monotony and little to no repetition on this course.
There are some holes with significant elevation changes. The pro tees had more elevation changes. But there is nothing dramatic in the way of elevation. There are no top-of-the-world shots. The greatest elevation changes are near the lake/pond dam and around the baskets on two and tree. There is hidden elevation on hole 13, behind the basket. Frankly, the designer has apparently done what he can to negate elevation as a factor where it exists. Where there is a significant downhill throw, you will be confined to lanes to narrow to count on being able to hit.
To me the course plays shorter than the signs indicate, but a quick check on Google earth tends to corroborate the accuracy of the signs. The tee signs do a good job of letting you know where the basket is and they show the direction of the next tee. If you forget what was on the tee sign, there are other signs pointing to the next tee and you can "follow the beaten path" on most holes.
All tee boxes are concrete and of a suitable size. Holes have alternate tee locations with larger, trapezoidal tee boxes for the pro tees. Baskets are Innova DisCatchers and all are in perfect condition.
There are some very fun holes. To me, 4, 8, 10 and 15 stand out from the rest.
Cons: Carts. I played with a friend who I play with regularly. We routinely finish 18 in about 1.5 hours. The carts did not speed up play for us. $40 is a lot to pay for a cart for 3 hours of golf. It makes more sense if you play all day and if you split it with a partner. But the course is arguably built for carts. If you want to play on foot, there are no benches, water or restrooms. While a cart can carry all the water and extra discs that you want and you won't need a rest if you are constantly riding in them. But, if you don't have $40 to spend on the cart and are on foot, you need to pack your water in with you.
There is a lot of bare dirt on this course and it seems the carts seem to be exacerbating that to some extent. While the dirt can lead to added distance from skipping, the dew on the grass in the morning round made for some very dirty discs that were still slightly wet when they landed and kicked up dirt and dust that then stuck to the disc. Mud may also tend to be a problem after rains.
There are some less than memorable holes and at least one hole that is memorable for not so good reasons. 14 is actually kind of nonsensical and rewards either luck or insane accuracy. 3 and 17 seem to just move you along to the next hole. Almost all courses have holes like this and Lakeside is no exception.
There is no single hole that really awed me on this course. 7 is a unique hole, but coming from golf, island and peninsula greens have lost their novelty value for me. You either hit the green or lose a disc - you have virtually no choice. It would be easy to lose multiple discs and rack up many penalty strokes trying to hole out on 7. For a little perspective, I'm the kind of person who does not like artificially elevated baskets, hanging baskets and other such gimmicks. Honestly, I liked several other holes better and think 4 is a better water hole.
Perhaps the biggest con for me however was the lack of par 3 holes with a reasonable chance to birdie with a driver/putter combination. Some of the holes that are most enjoyable to me are holes with a reasonable line to the basket that lie in the 320' to 370' range and that reward a skillful, full-strength or nearly full-strength drive off the tee with a chance at a birdie putt. Of the 18 holes on this course, only seven (7) are designated par 3 and, of those, none even approach 250'. Of the par 4 holes, only two holes (holes 2 and 10) are reachable from the Am tees with a long drive, but 2 is guarded so well in the front by water and in the back by a steep drop that an aggressive approach is foolhardy. I enjoy shaping midrange and putter shots off the tee, but many of my favorite holes are par 3s that fall in the 300-400 foot range and this course has not one such hole. This is one reason that I really liked hole 10.
The par designations seemed generous to me. My PDGA rating is under 900 but I shot 5 under from the Am tees on this course, including an eagle on hole 1. My scorecard app scored this as an 889 rated round.
Other Thoughts: It is difficult to not have high expectations when one of the reasons that you are playing the course is that it is ranked as the best in the world. I tried to keep my expectations tempered knowing that I would be reviewing it because I review all the courses that I play. But honestly, this course had no wow factor for me.
Lakeside is not in my top 5 most fun courses to play. From the Am tees it isn't in the top five of the most difficult or challenging courses. It doesn't require every shot in your bag though it does require a lot of shot shaping. It is a very nice course, but not the best that I have played IMO.
Lakeside is an excellent course. Is it best of the best? Not in my opinion, though it is extraordinarily good. I certainly look forward to playing it again and playing from the pro tees. I also recommend it to everyone who finds themselves in northeast Texas. This is easily worth the trip from anywhere nearby.
UPDATE: Having now played this course multiple times, from all tees, I really can't bring myself to change much about my review. One of the things I commented on as a negative was the cost of the carts. However, the carts are actually a really big positive. I just think that they are a bit overpriced. These carts save you from one of the most uncomfortably hot places in North America during the summer. I've played in 110 degree heat in Arizona and Nevada and I'll gladly take that, any day, over 98 degrees and 80% humidity.
Also, one of the best ways to play this course is by mixing tees and even holes from Creekside. I highly recommend skipping 17 and 18, both very forgettable holes and finishing out on Creekside starting at hole 14.
25 of 34 people found this review helpful.
5 Helpful / 13 Not
Truly the Best of the Best!
Pros: This course brings the need for a solid mental game to the table if you want to shoot well. The water carries that are possible can provide very realistic gut checks as you play. Even though there is the possibility to throw large water carries here, the course is designed in such a way that every hole may be completed with no more that 100' of water carry. This allows this course to be enjoyable for varying levels of skill.
The baskets here are all Innova DisCatchers and are in great condition.
Tee pads are large, smooth, and level concrete pads.
The fairways are kept very neatly mowed. This allows for a distinguishable "rough" on the open holes that does make a slight difference in shot selection due to the difference in footing.
This course keeps you honest and quickly smacks you down if you attempt to play too aggressively, as it is a very tough, but fair course that requires just about every shot in the book and then some.
Selah Ranch offers an atmosphere unlike any other, as you can hear wildlife all around you while you play through a breath-taking scenic landscape.
Other Thoughts: Selah Ranch has an extremely prestigious reputation and the courses live up to that reputation completely. The quality of experience that is presented by Lakeside and Selah Ranch in general is not something that can be accurately passed on through words; you need to experience it to fully understand.
5 of 18 people found this review helpful.
19 Helpful / 0 Not
There's a Reason People Obsess Over This Course
Pros: Selah Lakeside met and surpassed my impossible expectations for it by combining huge variety, an obsessive attention to detail, pervasive risk versus reward, beautiful scenery, through-the-roof amenities, and the most amazingly sophisticated mental game of any course I've ever played. As I alluded to in my review of Creekside, so many shots required a level of forethought more akin to playing chess than throwing a disc. Here, your chessboard is nature, the pieces in play continually change, and your opponent is dozens of acres of land that will chew you up and spit you out in the most impossibly enjoyable way. Lucky you.
Lakeside doesn't have "it all" in a literal sense, but it sure can fool you into feeling that way. Thick woods, open shots, tight lanes, winding lines, interesting water, rolling hills, drastic elevation shifts - the entire range of disc golf possibility is present and employed. I can't think of a significant terrain, feature, or hole type that isn't encompassed in some fashion, be it by the birdie run hyzer at a shielded pin on 17 to the spider web lanes across hills on 14 to the daunting, tree-studded fairways and threatening water on 4 to the ultimate play-it-safe-or-go-for-the-glory island hole 7. The balance is impeccable, and so is the flow. Lakeside knows when to throw you to the wolves and when to throw you a bone. The difficulty here is astutely calibrated to engage but not punish. You're never ground down, and you're never, ever bored. It helps that holes frequently have multiple routes, placing the choice for safety or danger in your hands more often than not, even though sometimes, oftentimes, every choice has its own challenges. I can't rave enough about Lakeside's sophisticated mental game.
The famous holes 7 and 14 have a level of intrigue, challenge, and beauty that merit the hype they generate, but what impressed me is how many equals they're among. At least six of the holes (4, 5, 7, 14, 15, 18) strike me as having top tier signature qualities, in that they'd be the premiere hole on most any other course I've played. Nearly all the remaining holes were distinct in some way, contributing a needed change of pace to the magnitude of their complements: for example, 1 is a perfect opener that's well-paced, starting open enough to ease you into your round but piquing your interest with a dangerous approach towards water on a slight downward slope; 13 starts tight and then opens up, with the gradually sloping terrain making an aggressive birdie run risk ending long in the woods; 16 rewards you hitting an early window with an opportunity for a wide open run at the guarded pin for a plausible birdie 3. The level of nuance and character here is simply through the roof.
Selah Lakeside wraps it all together on a beautiful piece of property that seems expertly groomed; it's a small slice of disc golf heaven.
Cons: 3 is the only hole that doesn't seem artfully designed and situated: an open shot at a hillside pin, with only the threat of a roll away adding intrigue. The hole seems so out of place to me relative to the caliber of the other 17 that I'm genuinely confused by its presence. As amazing as Lakeside is, it's not batting 1.000. Oh well; there are worse things in life.
Really, beyond that, I have a hard time coming up with even the most nit-picky cons. And this is from a guy who likes to critique.
I can see true beginners not getting a very large portion of what Selah has to offer, more so than most courses; its sophistication takes some experience to engage with and appreciate, and there's a lot of opportunity for lost discs as well. But a beginner likely isn't traveling to Talco, Texas and dropping $20 plus cart fees on a round unless they know what they're getting into.
There's the occasional possibility to have to combat the rough, depending on the status of grooming: for instance, if a headwind swings your hyzer wide on 17, you could end up with a bit of a search in the tall grass for your disc. But this is the essence of minutiae, folks.
You need the cart, for Lakeside even more than Creekside, given its distance away from the parking lot. That extra $40 is all but mandatory in my book; otherwise you'll be doing a ton of walking, especially considering the need to scout ahead on many par 4s and 5s. But it makes for a unique experience, so I'm not really complaining.
Bathrooms are relatively inaccessible on the course, even with the cart handy. There's woods aplenty, though.
The golf itself is so transcendent that I truly can't poke another hole.
Other Thoughts: Selah Lakeside was for me an apex I'd previously only imagined. The complexity of the holes and their accompanying mental game provided an experience I've rarely paralleled and never equaled. The scenery, the terrain, the varied shots, it's all as good as advertised, and likely then some. If you don't consider this an amazing disc golf course, then well, we need to talk.
Find a way to play here. It's more than worth it.
19 of 19 people found this review helpful.
12 Helpful / 0 Not
Believe the Hype
Pros: Pulling down to the lake while riding in the cart, my excitement grew by the second as we got closer to the first tee. I have never been so stunned by the beauty of the land that a course was on as I was when we first started playing Lakeside. Honestly, this is one of the most beautiful pieces of property that I have ever been on, and being coupled with perhaps the best designed disc golf course in the world makes this a destination course in every sense. Jack, the course manager, was very helpful in giving us insights about the courses and warning us about any holes where rough or high water was the worst. He said that the conditions of the courses were the worst they have ever been, and they were still in pristine shape.
All of the amenities are the best of the best, with plenty of clean bathrooms and showers near the pro shop, elaborate course maps and tee signs at every tee, very big concrete tees, and DISCatcher baskets in great shape. The two tee positions do a great job of offering completely different looks and distances for almost every hole. This is the best design of making both tee placements unique but challenging in their own way that I have ever experienced.
I don't know if there could be a better designed course out there in terms of specific hole design and the layout and flow of the course. Hole 1 is a great way of kicking off the round with the awesome view of the lake, multiple different lanes, elevation change, and scary pin position with the basket on a downward slope and the lake behind. It is a good representation of what you pretty much experience on every hole here: multiple options, risk/reward play but not in an overused sense, and beauty. The majority of the holes allow you to be creative in how you approach the hole - and how risky you want to play it - while requiring you to eventually hit the necessary landing zones. I think that holes 4, 7, 14, and 15 are the best examples of this as they offer numerous different routes, but eventually you will have to hit a certain landing zone to make a quality upshot. What is amazing is that these holes all give completely different looks at this aspect of design.
Lakeside truly offers completely varied levels of woodenness in and out of the woods, and does a great job incorporating the land's elevation changes. I was pleasantly surprised of the amount and use of elevation throughout this course, whether it was holes 1-3's sloping pin position, 15's raised tee pad and constant sloping levels of its fairway, 14's shot over the ravine, 16's constant upward sloping, etc. While there is no extreme elevation here, I was amazed how pretty much every hole incorporated elevation in some way.
The course's flow is remarkably designed, constantly moving from playing near the lake to in the woods, back and forth many times. The progression of the course is constructed so that nothing ever seems repetitive, constantly offering you completely different kinds of holes. In between the daunting holes 4 and 7 are some tight lines in the woods. Following 7, you head back into the woods for a few holes, and so on. The course flow at Lakeside is truly unparalleled. Navigation also flows very well and there are directional signs pointing you to the right path when needed.
The course offers a tremendous variety of distances and pars with 7 par 4's and 4 par 5's. These are true, accurate pars, but they are definitely attainable by even the 830 level player like myself if you play it well.
The rough is hardly a factor at all. Even in the thick woods, I never had to search hard for a disc when I didn't hit my line. The course maintenance is top of the line and resort quality.
Cons: -The only real negative that I can think of is that the cart costs $40 to use, but it is worth paying the money in my eyes. Because of the steep cost, it adds up if you live nearby and would play this course with the cart regularly. However, for the destination purposes of these courses, it does not take away from the extremely positive experience.
-I guess another negative aspect of this course is that there are a few chances to lose discs in the water, but at least there are used discs for sale at the pro shop.
Other Thoughts: I definitely recommend getting a cart, even though it costs $40. There is plenty of room in the back to hold bags, coolers, etc. Also, it is worth getting for the drive down to Lakeside alone, not to mention being able to drive up to see the landing zones and pin positions on some of the very long holes. I also recommend buying a few of the $5 used discs, as they have a huge selection of discs that are in great condition.
Just to throw my 2 cents in about hole 14, I really don't see the problem with it. It's extremely tight to the pin, of course, but I am a low-mid 800 level player and par'd it twice. Moreover, I played it the same exact way both times and still was able to do this. I drove through the second lane from the right, landing about halfway up the hill. I played up the hill still through the second row from the right, and then parked my Buzzz hyzering through the thin trees. It's a hard and very tight hole, but I don't think it is out of line or poke and pray. I actually really enjoyed this hole, and it is also important to note that it has a different feel than any other hole on the course, adding to the variety. It's not like John put several holes with this level of tightness on the course.
I can't stress enough how amazing this course is. I had very high expectations, was ready to point out any flaw it might have, and I was still blown away by how amazing of a course it is - it exceeded all my expectations. Being on one of the most beautiful pieces of property, combined with being one of the best designed courses, makes me wonder if there can possibly be a better course out there or designed in the future.
12 of 12 people found this review helpful.
8 Helpful / 0 Not
Disc Golf Resort
Pros: --Excellent design with plenty of variations in shot length and shot shape.
--Good blend of Par 3, 4 and 5 holes.
--Even the woods holes have different options off the tee.
--The four obvious water holes--2, 4, 7 and 18--are truly amazing. These holes define the course.....but there are plenty more excellent holes.
--Two distinct sets of tees.
--The short tees still provide plenty of challenge for the 900+ rated player.
--Great variety of wooded and more open holes.
--You can find a break from the wind on the wooded holes.
--This course allows you to be as aggressive or conservative as you want to be.
--Course infrastructure is all top of the line......tees, baskets, scorecards, tee and directional signs, carts, bathrooms open, course manager cell phone posted on pro shop door.
--It is pretty tough for me to pick a favorite hole on this course. 4 and 7 come to mind quickly. But, there are two or three others I could pick.
Cons: I don't believe there is a legitimate "Con" here at Selah.
Hole 14 has gotten a lot of criticism. John seems to be ready to defend it to the end. I guess I don't get it, yet.
Other Thoughts: --This is a First Class Golf Destination.
--The lodging on-site is really good and reasonably priced. I have been to Selah in March for two consecutive years. The Corral House is great for a "Guys' Trip".
--We called the course manager due to a lack of a "fire pit grill". He had one to us in 15 minutes.
--The course rental carts were a more all terrain model in 2014 vs. 2013.....but the cart that comes with the Corral House rental is the light duty electric version that you need to plug in for a bit at least once a day between rounds. We played at least 3 rounds a day for 4 days and never ran out of juice in the electric.
--Check out Daysi's in Mt Vernon for the best breakfast burrito $3.50 can buy. No need to order two.
--I've been traveling to Texas on a spring disc golf trip for 18 years now......Austin, Wimberley, San Saba. Last year I was a little down on Selah due to my familiarity with the Meadow and Hill at Wimberley and also the CR2 San Saba courses. But really, Selah is absolutely the best combination of everything that I have experienced. I couldn't imagine going back to the original trip of staying in a hotel and driving around to different city courses.
--The pro shop has several bins of discs for sale. But, not a huge selection.
--I travel to Texas every spring for the sole purpose of hanging out with my best friends and playing some great disc golf. Selah is the perfect spot.
8 of 8 people found this review helpful.
15 Helpful / 0 Not
Pros: As you round the bend on the road to Lakeside, you come over a small hill and see a beautiful landscape in front of you. The road continues straight ahead down the hill. On the right side is a peaceful lake with the Selah Inn perched above. On the left side of the path are the shores where your adventure begins.
There is not a bad hole on the course. Every hole will make you think about where you want your drive to end up and your second round will have you reconsidering what you did the first time you played it.
Most of the holes give you multiple ways to attack the hole with varying degrees of risk/reward. Hole 2 forces a RHBH hyzer to a landing area where you need to decide whether you'll test the water carry (with a shot at par) or take the safe route away from the lake where even a bogey is not assured. Holes 4 and 7 are similar in spirit but mirror images. On both you want to keep as close to the shore as possible to have an open look at the basket, but the lake is on opposite sides for each hole. On hole 4 I repeatedly wimped out and ended up in the trees where the fairway was tougher and it took more shots to get a clean look at the basket. And on hole 7, one of more famous holes in the game, I lost a couple discs. On this beast of a hole you have to maneuver between several landing areas on peninsulas (or play it safe through the trees and probably take a 9 on the hole). Even the final, scenic shot onto the island green is fraught. Despite throwing one of my better rounds, I collapsed on this hole, failing to execute an easy 150-foot hyzer to the pin. The water is only on five holes, but it gets in your head.
My favorite hole was 15. The tee shot features a downhill drive through several gaps in the trees to a meadow on the other side. From here you'll have one to three lanes to the basket, depending on where you end up. I loved the "Choose Your Own Adventure" feel. Take the wider turnover route over the mound? Turn to page 4. Take the tighter hyzer route? Turn to page 12. This was 831 feet of fun.
There are two tees on nearly every hole. I'm an intermediate player and still loved the blue tees. They force more interesting lines. I played the reds once and had a good time with a quick round.
The tee signs here are the best in the game. The various suggested paths to the hole are depicted, and even when the basket isn't visible, it isn't tough to tell where you're going.
The golf carts were fun and worth the cost. There were times when it felt odd to hop in the cart and drive 75 feet after a bad shot hit a tree up the fairway, but mostly they saved time, particularly if you're going between the two courses. That would be a very long walk. At the end of my day I had an hour left and managed to play a speed round from the red tees in about 50 minutes.
Cons: Bring some plastic that you don't mind losing. Just like the poker player who didn't come to fold, you didn't come to play it safe. Dig out those old discs, or buy some of the $5 lost and found discs at the pro shop (I got several good Star plastic discs). But losing a couple discs is probably inevitable.
There is not much elevation here. That is my biggest knock on the course. The elevation that is there is used well, but it's about as flat as you'd expect from a course in Texas.
Hole 14 is a hole with some controversy as to whether it's fair. I liked the first half of the hole with several lanes to choose from. The second half, an uphill climb to the basket (see, there is a little elevation!), features a couple pretty tight gaps. The kind that you drive the cart through pretty slowly so you don't clip a tree. I tend to agree with a lot of people that removing two or three trees would make for a couple clearer gaps that would still be very challenging. But I could be persuaded otherwise.
Finally, I don't spend a lot of time thinking about par, but the pars on some of the signs seemed generous. Hole 11 was 213 feet and was called a par 4. I put my drive 15 feet away my first time, so this seemed like an odd par 4.
Other Thoughts: Like probably everyone who saw this course come out of nowhere to be #1, I wondered if it belonged. The answer is an unequivocal yes. While it's not my personal #1, it belongs near the top. It may be the best-designed course I have played.
Quick note on the lodging: I stayed in one of the cabins near the Selah Inn. It wasn't cheap, but it is a great rustic cabin, feeling almost like something you'd find at a ski resort in the Rockies. This is the kind of lodging you wouldn't feel bad bringing your girlfriend to.
When you're standing at the tee considering your options with the water lapping against the shore and the cattle lowing somewhere beyond the trees, you'll know you've come somewhere special.
15 of 15 people found this review helpful.
11 Helpful / 0 Not
Pros: This is absolutely one of the top courses in the world. While not actually a player himself Jack the "Course Manager" was more than happy to give us some warnings on various holes based on course conditions. This was very helpful and something that is somewhat rare in the disc golf world.
7 - This hole is its own 17 at Sawgrass. There are many attempts at this hole design including 18 on the creekside of this courses on site partner but actually doing it is a special thing. Its a massive par 5 that really forces most average players to lay up twice and its still a risky throw across the water even from the red tees. From blue its a true par 5.
This is the more visually spectacular of the two courses for sure. The lake views are very nice to look at while playing.
Course variety is also good from hole to hole. There is a good change from hole to hole. Every hole minus 14 offers fair risk reward that gives strokes and quickly takes them away.
18 - Good view and a good hole design. Go through the keyhole trees to get the normal RHBH hyzer to work or turn it over and go with the more open left side of the trees. The turnover has additional benefits for throw 2. The pad closer to the lake is much more open and a cleaner mid range throw with fewer trees.
Cons: Hole 14 - The on pad map has all sorts of "lanes" to throw through to get to the hole. I'm all about skill shots and tough holes but this is a bit ridiculous. I agree with many of the reviewers that I just don't get this hole. Given the skill and variety required in the rest of the course this particular hole seems more punitive than positive. There are several tree threading holes on this course besides this one.
Other Thoughts: The courses pars make this a course that, if you can shoot with a consistent level of precision, you can get a very low score. Most of the 5s are doable in 4 and for many people 3 (these are very hard throws but we had an eagle on the course). Its a lot of precision though. This is a hard fair course. Expect to win a few and lose a few. Example: you can have a drive at the green on the island on 7 with shot two but for most people this would be a pair of 300+ drives with small pads to land on.
This was not my groups favorite of the two courses. I debated hard between giving this course a 4.5 because of the 2 courses it was the only one with a hole I truly didn't like the build on. In the end I cannot argue that this is a premier course and frankly my one small beef cannot overtake what is an excellently designed course that was a ton of fun to play. I walked away feeling like I could play this course another 10 times and still not have a set shot selection for the course.
If you're going to play for a whole day I would invest in the carts. The fitness level to play these courses all day is high enough without having to walk the basic distances more than twice. We played them as many times as we could during our day. I would definitely go back and play this course again. This course absolutely competes with the other great courses I've played.
11 of 11 people found this review helpful.
10 Helpful / 1 Not
No Hype Just Results
Pros: I made a special trip here from Minnesota while visiting my brother in OKC. We drove the 4 hours with others that don't normally play anything other than recreational disc golf besides myself.
We stayed in the cowboy room in the lodge, which was great. Rented a cart (the electric carts are 4 seaters if you need one that can only last 1.5 rounds), and hit up the course.
Above all in disc golf I believe that a course layout is only as good as someones ability to hit the line. This course provided the most intelligent layout I've ever seen in spades. Don't get me wrong it was far from easy, but there were enough birdie holes to keep you from feeling defeated on some of the more potentially dangerous holes.
I hate to re-iterate others feelings, but I will.
#7 is the most mentally interesting and taxing hole I've ever played and I've seen some doozies having played all of the top courses in the midwest. I think its the best hole in disc golf for Advanced-Pro players. I can see what am's could get frustrated by it though.
#14- Having played both red & blue tees I'm still not sure where the "2nd" lane is. There is a lane, but seems a little too random. Its the only spot I felt that even a perfect tee shot could put you in a place where you were still scratching your head. I tried to find the virtue, but this hole would get a "B" in my book.
Otherwise this whole course was without a doubt better than anything in the midwest. Sure the elevation was a little limited, but trust me you won't mind unless you are hung up on that exclusively.
If you can drive to play here and are serious about disc golf you have to come for a couple days. If not you are simply not getting the best that disc golf can offer you.
Cons: I don't really have a con for this course. Carts are really needed, but don't hurt to have either. If you are not a fan of shooting over water this course is not for you. This course is simply not meant for those who don't play disc golf at a fairly high level. You will only truly enjoy this course if you can afford to take the risk reward shots.
Other Thoughts: I hope someday to find another course I like this much. I like a lot of courses, but this is the best physical and intellectually challenging disc golf course I've ever seen.
Selah is the best!
10 of 11 people found this review helpful.
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