7 Helpful / 8 Not
Pros: This course is on a fantastic piece of property and has a good mix of shots. The long pads are a beast of a course and have some great shots and plenty of challenge.
The grassy fairways and large mature trees throughout the course really make it feel like a 1 of a kind track.
Cons: The tree in front of hole 1's long pad has got to go. It is dead center of where you need to throw your drive and completely ruins the tee shot.
Hole 10 is not a good hole. Lots of potential but is ruined with too may trees and no clear fairway. Cut a fairway and create a line that people can actually throw instead of playing poke and hope to the dogleg.
Hole 13 is not very good. Blind par 3 over water. Its basically a bailout short and right so your not in danger of going in the water. Not a great design.
This course desperately needs distance markers especially on some of the longer par 4's and 5's.
Other Thoughts: I liked the course okay but feel that it is currently overrated. Im not saying the course is bad but I think the fact that it shares the same property with a really good course boosts peoples perception of this track. I have played several 3.5-4.5 star courses that blow Creekside out of the water and was underwhelmed with a course that gets so many 4.5-5 star reviews.
7 of 15 people found this review helpful.
Designer Response by: johnrhouck
David, thanks for your review. When I first read your Cons, I thought "What course was this guy playing? That tree on #1 can't possible have grown that much." But when I got to Selah for PDGA Amateur World Doubles, I found you were absolutely right. I had no idea. Here's the before photo: https://www.facebook.com/3255...3&theater
Here's how it looks today:https://www.facebook.com/3255...3&theater
And this is about what it took, lookng back at the tee: https://www.facebook.com/3255...3&theater
We have made major changes to #10 and #13 as well, plus major improvements to Lakeside #10 and #15. And needed improvements on almost every hole. Both courses now look 100% better. Sorry they weren't in better shape when you were there. If you could see the courses now, I think you'd know why so many reviewers give Selah five stars.
Lakeside's Big Brother
18 Helpful / 4 Not
Pros: From the pro tees, this course plays over 9,000 feet. As many have stated, it winds through some gentle hills near a creek that was mostly dry when I played in July. The holes are generally longer and more open than Lakeside and the course certainly feels more open and long.
The pro tee boxes are trapezoidal with the narrower part in the front (as it should be IMO). They offer plenty of room for my runup.
The first two holes are long holes that wind through large trees in a pasture-like setting. Hole 3 was a lot of fun and is probably my favorite hole on both courses. It calls for a backhand to a landing area by a pond followed by a RHFH or RHBH turnover over the pond to the basket.
Elevation is used very well on some holes, Hole 12 stands out. It calls for a right turning shot thrown uphill ending in a cluster of trees that were just past a number of large hay bales (not sure if the bales are permanent, but they definitely added to the hole). The holes through the more forested areas are very well thought out with the exception of 10.
The amenities at the pro shop are the best that I have encountered at any golf course with the exception of the selection of discs for sale. The carts eliminate the need for most amenities that are desired out on the course and they will let you play four rounds of golf without getting really tired from the hike.
Cons: There is more repetition on this course than Lakeside. An example of the repetitive feel are holes 4, 5, and 13. All of these holes are short (under 300 ft) with water very near the basket and on the left. They can all be reached with a midrange disc thrown on a hyzer RHBH. Hole 13 may "benefit" from the hyzer option only because of what looks like recent trimming - I could not tell for sure, but the option is definitely there.
Another thing that kind of feels repetitive for me is the fact that there are only eight par 3s on this course. Only two of those are longer than 300' (301' and 318'). Aside from the Par 3s, there are no holes under 500 feet! There isn't one hole in the mid 300s or any hole in the 400s from the pro tees. So, if you are not trying to park the hole with a mid or fairway driver, you are trying to lay up somewhere. Many of my favorite holes are longer par 3s that call for shaping a line with a driver off the tee in an attempt to get in birdie position. This course really doesn't have that. This is subjective, of course, and Creekside doesn't really seem as long as its 9176 feet would suggest (partly because two holes use 2000 of those feet), but there is little opportunity to park a long drive for birdie. It is also true that this requires you to "think ahead" to landing zones that allow a shot at the pin (or another landing zone), but this is also something required on almost every hole that isn't reachable with a putter or mid.
The last three holes finish with what are essentially forced water carries. You must carry 300 ft off the tee over water to the first landing area from the pro tees on 16, then lay up (by hyzering over the water), then throw over the water again to get to the basket. Another water carry greets you on 17, although it is very short and you can cheat to the left if you don't want to risk your disc. Finally, 18 requires a 318' throw over water with water to the front, right and left of the basket. This hole could easily take several discs, especially on a windy day.
Hole 8 is over 1000' and just felt long for the sake of being long. Three drivers thrown backhand and putt. Hole 10 is nearly as long through woods around a creek. It also felt long for the sake of being long with the added complication of being a trek through a moderate to heavily wooded bottom land around a creek. I'd have to play it several times just to get an idea of how to approach the first two shots. It could have been divided up into two better holes IMO.
Carts/Amenities. If you don't pay $40 for a cart, you will find yourself on a very long course that has no water, no bathrooms, no garbage cans and no benches. The carts make up for this and have other benefits, but their number is also limited. I highly recommend a cart and to make sure that you reserve one in advance if you will be playing on a weekend.
UPDATE Aug., 2015: Having gone back and played this course from the short tees, I have to say that they are certainly a bit less than challenging. On the short par 3s, some of the tees are a little too short for experienced players. Frankly, I would only recommend the short tees to beginners.
Other Thoughts: This course offers stretches of great holes separated by some headscratchers and then ends on three holes with water carries. It is a fun course, and combined with Lakeside, it was definitely worth the 3.5 hour drive from home, but if I only had time to play one of these courses, I would go with Lakeside.
UPDATE: Having played both courses just recently and having finished up with time to play another round, my friend and I both chose Lakeside. It's just a more fun course IMO.
18 of 22 people found this review helpful.
16 Helpful / 1 Not
Pros: While Lakeside meanders in and out of the woods, Creekside primarily wends its way through the fields and meadows. The holes are noticeably longer, and after starting the course with three straight 600'+ holes, you know your arm will be tested. It isn't an all out grip-and-rip course, though; placement is still important.
The other half of the challenge comes from the water carries. Contrary to what the names might imply, Creekside has more throws over lakes than Lakeside, and the creek only comes into play on two holes. There is certainly a peaceful feeling as you hop between the three ponds.
My favorite hole was 10, a 630-foot mission through my favorite kind of woods: moderate to heavy trees with virtually no rough, creating dozens of possible paths to the basket. It would take me many rounds to settle on a preferred path, and I like holes like that. The basket is deep on a peninsula surrounded by the namesake creek with danger behind.
Hole 12 was another fun one, an uphill shot with the bales of hay acting like a bunker off to one side. I never ended up in them, but I could see some fun, awkward shots resulting if you did.
Like Lakeside, nearly all of the holes have concrete pads (with a few rubber tees where the cart path is) and dual tees. The signs are my favorite kind, showing the numerous paths to the basket (as applicable). Navigation was good for the most part.
Cons: There are a couple holes with mild elevation changes, but mostly it's pretty flat.
As mentioned above, the challenge comes from the length and the water carries. From the long tees, the water carries offer a lot more risk than reward for my taste. Hole 3 has basically no route if you can't throw a turnover or forehand as a RHBH. Hole 5 is a nice looking short turnover/forehand shot to a peninsula green, but the green is pretty tight and sloped toward the water. I can't imagine playing this hole 5 times and not losing a disc.
Holes 16 and 18 are rough from the long tees. Hole 16 offers very little bailout option, so you'd better feel comfortable with a long shot over water. Hole 18 is worse, offering no option at all other than a 300-foot shot over water There is a peninsula (a nice theme at Selah) right in front of the tee, but for some reason it's OB. I think water is underused in disc golf in general, but it's a little overused on this course.
At times the length can get old. Hole 8 is a 1000-foot straight hole that felt more like a ball golf hole.
For the most part, the holes on Creekside just don't have the magic of Lakeside. On Lakeside I often stood at the tee and enjoyed thinking through the multiple options, not wanting to waste a drive. On Creekside, there was usually a pretty clear choice. This doesn't mean they are bad holes at all, but they are a notch below.
Hole 11 is kind of odd from the short tees, offering a worse look at the fairway than the blue tee.
Other Thoughts: The carts aren't strictly necessary, but I would recommend them if you plan to play multiple rounds between the two courses. I played four rounds before I had to leave mid afternoon and didn't feel all that tired, and the carts saved my legs.
I played the reds on Creekside and enjoyed them more than the blues. As an intermediate player, I found the blues a little much on some of the water holes. This is as opposed to Lakeside (and most other top courses I've played), where the blue tees feature a lot of risk/reward shots that I can appreciate even though I can't execute them, rather than just shots that favor a big arm.
A quick note on the rankings (there is a reason you clicked on this review, right?). This course is the Scottie Pippen of courses. If you tell me that Scottie is a great player, I'm right there with you. If you start telling me he's the #2 or #3 player, I'm going to assume you are a little blinded by the greatness of his teammate. This is definitely a great course. But it's also not in my personal top 10.
That said, are you going to go out of your way to get to a property with a 5.0 and a 4.0 course? Yeah, me too. When I found out I'd be in Dallas, I made sure to drive the two hours to get here. I'll do it again.
16 of 17 people found this review helpful.
13 Helpful / 4 Not
- Wide variety of shot shapes and lines required. Never felt repetitious.
- The scenery. Such a beautiful piece of property, very peaceful and picturesque.
- Multiple concrete teepads on each hole, each giving a very distinct challenge.
- Extremely challenging without feeling obnoxious, or intentionally annoying.
- Due to the cost and location, I'd imagine it's never crowded.
- Not free ($20/day).
- Not really walkable, and golf carts are $40/day and only have two seats and are loud.
- Not much elevation change.
- Nitpicking here, but the course is a little raw, not manicured like a nice city course.
Great compliment to Lakeside, but without a signature hole. Still some very memorable, challenging holes though. The obscure locale of these courses is negated by the fact that they're on the same property, thus giving you 36 of the most challenging, unique disc golf holes anywhere.
13 of 17 people found this review helpful.
22 Helpful / 1 Not
Pros: This course is set on some amazing and beautiful land! The land makes use of a few rolling hills, a creek, some ponds, and weaves its way in and around beautiful trees. The course flows amazingly, and it is obvious that a professional designed this course. It offers anywhere from 180 foot holes to 1019 foot holes. The shot variety is great. There are also some very creative holes on this course like the hole where you throw over hay bales. There is risk/reward on this course as well, especially on the pond and creek holes. Nothing makes you want to stay in bounds more than water. You never get bored playing this course, and it always leaves you wanting more after each hole.
Cons: This course has so much to live up to as it is on the same piece of property with the best course in the world. This course doesn't offer as much elevation or technical shots as I would want in a 4.5 or 5.0 course. A lot of the shots, especially in the middle half of the course, are longer holes that have some trees and are quite flat. To be fair, they are some of the better long flat holes I ever played, but they aren't as interesting as elevated holes with more technique. Because of this, some of the holes blend together in my mind, which would never happen with a perfect course. To be fair, my buddy and I did play this course from the red pins, the shorter pins as we were tired after lakeside. One final con is hole 7. Instead of two tee pads, there is only one tee pad and one basket on this hole, but somehow it is both a par 4 and a par 5. This really confused me.
Other Thoughts: This course was quite generous with their pars, which is a really nice change from monotonous par 3's at other courses. This is an excellent course, don't get me wrong. I really enjoyed playing it, but it is not the best of the best, and there are not enough wooded and elevated holes to make it phenomenal. This is the best 4.0 course I have ever played.
22 of 23 people found this review helpful.
34 Helpful / 0 Not
Long and tough
Pros: The Creekside course offers a different feel, and a nice contrast to the Lakeside course. There is more distance and more open shots on this side. It's fun to have the chance to air out some long drives while still having rough and water lurking to punish poorly placed shots. Water is in play on many shots, with some smaller ponds and the creek offering some water carries, tricky greens and drives along the edge of water with wind to deal with.
There are a few holes that play a little more technical, offering some protected greens and a couple holes where you have to hit tighter gaps. Overall the course felt pretty balanced, with some holes favoring righties and some where the lefty shot offered an easier line.
The amenities here are fantastic, they're not a big part of my ratings but I still love to see courses with this amount of work put in to the extras. The tees are excellent, with two large concrete pads on most holes, often offering different lines and a very different level of challenge. The signs are top notch, I love the Houck signs, and having distance and hole layout is nice with long and sometimes blind shots. It's obvious that a lot of time and effort goes into the maintenance here, the couple wet spots or places where grass was long were mentioned in the pro shop along with reasons and a timetable for taking care of them.
Cons: I'm not a fan of long grass rough, and it's pretty prevalent on this course. A few too many of the Creekside holes play really open with a few scattered trees and only tall grass to contend with on a missed drive. It adds frustration without really providing much of a disc golf challenge. Through no fault of the designer, there's not a lot of elevation here, something I like to see on challenging courses like this. There are some long transitions between holes, though that's not a huge deal with good course maps and carts.
Other Thoughts: Beginners may find this course a bit much. There is a lot of length and the water is lurking on several shots. The shorter tees are a great challenge for intermediate to advanced players, and the longs will challenge even the best players. You'll need distance and accuracy to be successful here, hitting fairways on distance drives is one of the major tests on this layout.
The design here is top notch, I had a blast. Lakeside is the better of the two courses, but having two phenomenal courses on one property makes this an excellent destination overall. The carts are a nice touch, I wouldn't want to use one everywhere, but for a special treat they're fun. I understand the amount of time and work that has gone into this place, so I didn't mind the relatively high fees to play, but it is on the high side compared to other pay to play courses at this point.
34 of 34 people found this review helpful.
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