Tryin' to make a livin' and doin' the best I canů
3 Helpful / 0 Not
Pros: Fort Zumwalt Park is actually a fairly fun disc golf course with some good shots. There is a nice variety of park-style and wooded hole. The course had good elevation changes for uphill/downhill shots, although it doesn't have any cool elevated tee-type shots. The pin placements are done really well; it's a rollaway waiting to happen. There are two tee pads and there is a big difference in the length of most of the pads. The course plays much easier from the short pads and can handle a good variety of skill levels because of it. The course leans to the technical, there are no open bomber holes. However some of the wooded shots are long for the type of hole they are. There is a good bit of challenge in the design. The park itself is very nicely maintained, and once you get past hole 6 there isn't much conflict with other park uses despite this being a muti-use park. Shot for shot, it's a nice disc golf course. None of the shots stand out to me as really notable, but most of them were pretty solid in design.
The park itself is well designed and well maintained. It's a really nice spot to spend an afternoon. The wooded holes were cleaned out very well, there wasn't a lot of punishing rough to contend with and finding your disc after it ricocheted crazily of a spindly little tree in the fairway was pretty straightforward. There were restrooms by hole one. The baskets were DISCatchers, and the long tee on each hole had a tee sign.
Cons: One of the limitations of designing a disc golf course in a multi-use park is that you sometimes have to chop up the course into sections and the flow isn't good. While I understand that, the flow here is atrocious. You play to hole 3 into a corner of the park, then wander across the street and up a hill searching for any sign of the next tee. After hole 5 you walk down the street hoping that you will eventually find another tee. The path to hole 7 is a long, meandering hike. You play 7-8, cross the road and throw hole 9, then you end up on a path that goes two directions and no indication of which way you should go. If you go left, you end up at the tee for 13. If you go right, you come out of the woods into a road/parking lot and start searching. The tee for hole ten is way over behind a building. There was one little "10" with an arrow on some sort of box along the way, otherwise no directional sign at all. You play holes 10-11, cross the street and backtrack to the tee for 12, head into the woods for holes 13-14, have to cross the road to find hole 15 and then...Aaargh! The next tee you come to is the tee for hole 17. Hole 16 is across the street. Even after you figure that out, the tee is wrapped way back around by the park entrance. The only redeeming part of the flow here is that you already walked past 17's tee so you know you have to go back across the road to get to it. All along this meandering nightmare of course flow, there was exactly one little directional sign on the whole course that I saw. The wandering meandering flow helps the quality of the golf, but if you are going to design a course this way it HAS to have directional signage to help people figure out where to go. This course does not have adequate signage, which makes it frustrating for a non-local to navigate.
Some of the shots don't really have a clear route that I could tell. I threw a lot of poke and pray shots. It was a fun layout, but it needed some more trees cleared out to be a fair design. Hole 7, 15 and 17 stood out to me as holes that should have been good, but were too pinballish. A couple of other holes (2 & 11) have the tee right behind some big trees for no good reason.
There is no parking lot, you park on the street. There isn't really any indication of where the course starts while you are on the road, so it's hard to know where to park. It turns out that it really doesn't matter because hole 18's pin is nowhere near hole 1's tee. The locals seemed to park by hole 7 to spilt the distance.
Hole 11 is marked as a double mando between two trees that are maybe 20' in front of the tee. There is no safety reason for a mando there, so I assume it's an attempt to make the hole harder. It's really, really dumb to have a mando right in front of a tee for no reason, and a double mando in front of a tee is double dumb. The signs do not look like park signs, so it may be the work of locals. I ignored it.
The tee signs show the A and B placement, but do not have a way to indicate which placement the pin is in. A lot of the shots are blind from the tee, so there is a lot of walking up to see where the basket is. There are also little arrows on the tee signs to direct you to the next tee...if you can remember where they were pointing to after you finished playing the hole. They were pretty ineffective in helping me find my way around.
Other Thoughts: The course I played right before Fort Zumwalt was The Canyons in Lockport, IL. The Canyons has a similar issue in that the park is multi-use and the course is chopped up in sections, but the flow is a non-issue at The Canyons because of the amount and effectiveness of the signage they use to get you from one hole to the next. To me it was a interesting study in directional signs done right/directional signs done wrong (or more accurately, not done at all.)
Fort Zumwalt disc golf course ends up being a hard course for me to rate. It is in a very nice park, so that's a positive. The shots themselves were well designed INT/ADV-level shots. On the other hand, the course has a lot of issues. Flow is bad, signage is inadequate, the course doesn't end close to where it starts and there are a few too many poke and pray holes. I think it comes down to what kind of experience you want. If a pretty challenging INT/ADV-level technical course is your cup of tea, the issues probably won't matter to you. If you are local and know the layout, a lot of the frustrations with the flow become a moot point. If you're on a road trip and really don't want to waste your time trying to figure out a mind-boggling flow pattern, the shots are not good enough to override that. It's a good course, it just has limitations.
3 of 3 people found this review helpful.
Technical Course requiring a complete game
Pros: Requires a complete game. It might be the most technically challenging course I've ever played. No grip and rip but not a Pitch and Putt. Deceptive Distances - LOTS of trees in the fairways. On this course, I only pull out a DD (Tesla) on a handful of holes - the rest of the time, it's OS Fairway driver (Resistor), Mid-range(Axis), and a driving Putter (Atom).
I really enjoy this course. It makes me a better player. The first 5 can get your score down. After that, advanced players who don't know course well will find themselves fighting for a 4. #10, #12, #13, #15, and #18 are the highlights.
#10 is a raised gap shot with basket deep to the right. I throw a hyser flip with a tesla and hope I can get to ridge to the right. Out to the left leaves you with lots of trees in front of you.
#12 is a Flip Hyser to the right with road OB tight to left and tree row tight to right. One of the few holes I break out a DD on.
#13 is low pad with a narrow raised gap and a dirt hill defending. Past that is LOTS of narrow trees in fairway - both basket positions are deep requiring a very well placed drive and upshot. If you can get a flick out far to left, you can up with a Putter or Mid.
#15 is another elevated gap shot - this time across a gully to a steady climb through thick trees. On an open course, you'd go DD but trees won't allow it. Throw a mid to the right fairway. From here you can work your way up the right side or throw a backdoor shot. I like a FH backdoor avoiding the fairway completely. Watch out, #18's teepad is below the backdoor route.
Hole #18 is my favorite hole - a tight downhill tunnel shot with ace potential. There's few aceable holes on the back 9. This is one of them.
Every hole has 2 teepads - Unlike many dual teepad courses, the pro pads are not only longer, most of them are far more difficult to play due to the trees and terrain.
Cons: I really enjoy the course. There's only two holes that I'm not crazy about:
Hole #3 is filler. Even a bad drive to the left will net you a 3. To the right is an easy 2. It's not a bad hole, just not challenging.
Hole #6 is forced. The course needed a transition from the easier front 5 to the back 12 holes. This was the solution hole. I imagine a lot of discs are in the lake from all the trees / steep hillside.
Albeit required due to the shape of the park, walks from 5-6, 6-7, 8-9, 9-10, 13-14, and 15-16 can be confusing to first timers. Take a map or find a player to follow.
1 Helpful / 0 Not
Pros: The usual: Great concrete pads- both long and short. Signage was excellent- always located at the long tee pads. Multiple pin placement options- have played there more than once- so it's been a different look each time. Wooded, but not so wooded that you can't recover from a tree hit. (Not unless multiple throws strike a tree like I did on #2 today!!)
Different looks and lengths on each hole.
No overly memorable or signature hole, but absolutely no clunkers either.
Nice location in the middle of a community park.
Cons: The walk between a couple holes was long and disrupted the flow a bit. (2-3; 3-4; 5-6; 6-7; 9-10; 15-16)
Other Thoughts: Fort Zumalt and neighboring Quail Ridge are similar courses. I really enjoy Fort Zumalt compared to how I feel about QR (Read that review on the QR page)
To echo another reviewer or two.... thinning out a fairway or two would bring my score up to at least 3.5. But it is what it is... a good course, thus the 3.
1 of 1 people found this review helpful.
1 Helpful / 4 Not
Pros: Very well put together
Very easy to find way around course
Has a park
Cons: The only con that I have ever noticed is that occasionally people will walk through the course.
1 of 5 people found this review helpful.
1 Helpful / 0 Not
Fun golfing at The Fort
Pros: This course has excellent elevation changes with both uphill and downhill shots being accounted for here.
Multiple pin placements and multiple tees also add to the diversity here.
Very challenging lines on several holes.
First 3 holes are very birdieable and maybe even Aceable.
Hole 4 will let you air out a drive.
Good signage and the tees are plenty ample and grippy.
Has both dogleg L/R holes.
Course is well maintained and the grass was nice and green upon our visit.
Good mix of open and wooded holes.
You will need a multitude of shots in order to score well on this course.
Some holes have protected baskets to add to the challenge of your round.
Cons: Walks between some of the holes tend to slow the pace of the round down a bit. 3's basket to 4's tee, 6's basket to 7's tee, 9's basket to 10's tee, and 15's basket to 16's tee. On some of these holes you will have to cross the street so please pay attention to oncoming traffic.
Finding your disc during the fall on the wooded holes could be very challenging so keep and eye on where your disc lands.
Some of the hard pack areas can become slick after a good soaking rain.
Holes 3-5 may have people playing soccer or throwing football/baseball, etc, so pay attention before you throw.
There might be a stump or two on the wooded holes that aren't flush with the ground so pay attention so you don't twist your ankle.
This course will get a lot of traffic so please be patient.
Other Thoughts: Overall this is a very beautiful course in a very nice park. The course is getting a lot of play and judging by the quality of golf here I can see why. This course will test your accuracy on the wooded holes but will still provide you with the opportunity to improve your overall game. There are a few holes where you can air out a driver or two but this is mostly a technical course that will help you sharpen your short game.
You will need to place shots in places that will allow you to get to the basket on next shot.
For me this is a quality course that has good balance. Play this course if you are in the area and if you have time visit Quail Ridge in Wentzville. Both of these courses partner up well together IMO.
Enjoy your round at The Fort.
1 of 1 people found this review helpful.
3 Helpful / 0 Not
Fun Beginner/Intermediate Course
Pros: I played this course yesterday and had a lot of fun.
Overall this course will be challenging for newer players and a nice easy course for more experience players. All holes reviewed as RHBH
Hole 1 - Short par three. Used a DX Leopard to fade left to right. Cleared the trees (luckily) and was able to drop in for a birdie. Nice hole.
Hole 2 - Par 3. One of the more open holes. Need a nice drive and low to get past the trees. Can't remember what disc I used, but I did hit the tree and had to pitch and putt in for par.
Hole 3 - Short par 3 again. Need to either fade in left to right (DX Leopard again) or a side arm. Easily birdie with a good drive.
Hole 4 - Par 3... Here's your chance for a long bomb. Open and hole position in a pretty good spot. Echostar driver put me nice and close.
Hole 5 - Par 3 - Pretty annoying.... A lot of trees... Good luck Threw Discmania Fever low and skipper
Hole 6 - Par 3 - Short and wooded on a hill... Innova Roc hit a tree. Threw it again and got lucky on a bounce. Dropped in for par.
Hole 7 - Can't remember anything about this hole except it is wooded.
Hole 8 - Side arm hole... Used my trusty Champion Boss and chucked it down the hill. Fun hole. Technical but managable.
Hole 9 - Hyzer time! Used my Echostar Destroyer for a nice drive.
Hole 10/11 - Parallel to one another. Long with trees intermixed with the fairway. Destroyer again.
Hole 12 - My least favorite. Filler to round off the course. Slight turn to the left. Sidearm or fade... Chose the fade with the Leopard but I don't have that kind of range with that disc. Ended up with a pitch and putt for par.
Hole 13 - Got really lucky. Wooded and long. Destroyer flew through the trees and gave me a nice putt for bird opportunity.
Hole 14 - Short and technical. Very nasty with the trees. Used my Roc on a gentle flip to get some nice glide right to left. Overshot the hole though.
Hole 15 - Side arm and up hill through the tree. Very fun if you can get out of the woods
Hole 16 - Long hole that turns left. Side armers will be able to get down into the hole w/ little difficulty.
Hole 17 - Throwing from the open into the trees. Players have to try to thread through again.
Hole 18. Technical and tight with alleys for both RHBH to throw backhand or sidearm. I elected sidearm as there seems to be a larger window. Short enough that if you hit a tree you can recover
Cons: There are some holes, the very wooded ones, that require exceptionally technical holes that almost all players will run the risk of hitting a tree.
It can be frustrating as these holes seem 'unfair' and require mostly luck...
Other Thoughts: Almost all of these holes are forgiving in the fact that if you hit a tree on the drive you can recover. Fun course that's not too long that it wears out your arm and not so wooded you feel like you are always frustrated.
This course is pretty good for the area and with the exception of some unreasonable wooded holes, a very fun and relaxing course.
3 of 3 people found this review helpful.
6 Helpful / 1 Not
Pros: I waited several months to see if the holes that have virtually no fairway would be cleaned up a bit - well it has been in for a long while, and I think what you see is what you get with this one. I want to give less than 3.0, but in reality this course is about 5 or 6 holes away from a great course, so I'm giving it a 3, which = Good - per the rating scale.
Most of this course is GREAT. Excellent use of the land and some really great holes.
It is a typical Gateway/Dave Mac design requiring good placement shots and some good risk/reward - with the exception of the holes I list below.
Cons: If it were not for the handful of TERRIBLE gimmicky holes that have a gauntlet of trees and good shots are about 90% dependent on good luck we would have a true gem.
All off the comments below reflect the long tees. I have not played the shorts, so please take that into consideration.
Hole 2 - Tee Pad is positioned behind a group of old growth trees. There are several gaps to hit - all of which are not a true shot shape and are too small to consider fair. After that it is wide open and the basket is tucked into the tree line on the right. This may have been an attempt at Risk/Reward but was a failed attempt. When it comes to competition this is the kind of hole that players dread because skill is not the key factor here. I have resorted to throwing a little forehand roller off the tee, then a putter upshot, and treat it like a 300 FT PAR 4. Yes, I have aired out a perfect backhand and parked the hole - but the idea of Risk/Reward is conceptually about a player having to decide - any experience player knows you don't go for this type of hole in competition because the risk is just silly. The gaps that you actually have to hit to shape a true shot shape become about 3 feet wide or less (when factoring in the trees closer/farther).
Hole 7 - Another PAR 3 distance hole that is best treated as a PAR 4 if you don't want to deal with the 40 or so 4 inch diameter trees spread throughout the fairway. There is a legit side arm gap that you can hit on the left side of the fairway, but because of the curve of the left tree line and numerous trees that eventually interrupt the line, a lay up is best. Once again - this shot can be parked - but it is completely dependent on luck and going for it means risking hitting a small tree and shooting into the rough. Remove some trees and create a fairway here and this hole is great - it has a really cool shape and green down toward a pond. As it is right now - TRASH
Hole 8 B - OK, hole 8 A is a great tunnel shot - tight but fair - more recently I noticed they put in another position up to the right - so you have a clean tunnel for 200 feet, then just a bunch of skinny trees before you reach the basket - for this position - best shot is a straight up the middle and then try to make a 50 footer. There is a clean gap, but it's a 90 degree turn at the end of the short tunnel so...... - STUPID
Hole 11 - Again, more huge trees just off the tee pad and an EXTREMELY LOW ceiling. Problem is, if you hit the first gap, you are heading right for more giant trees. Once again, it is really close to an excellent hole with moving the tee pad over and creating a tight and risky line to go for it, or lay up. Not sure what they were thinking here. Great green, I especially like the long position. For me RHBH - I throw a low skip hyzer towards 10s fairway - typically hit a tree and land somewhere in the middle and putter up shot.
Hole 14 - No comment - this is simply a waste of life and makes me want to puke. Everyone try to hit the little S turn 150ft side arm gap that turns out to be about 3 foot side when you factor in the early/late trees.
Hole 15 - Dear God, who did this???? What really gets me is this should be the best hole on the course. I guess they figured they could make it a PAR 5 by delegitimizing the fairway - from the long pad you have a low ceiling and your aiming point is a large tree directly in the middle of the fairway about 200 FT away (first mistake). The landing area given is small, but worst of all - ITS NOT A GOOD PLACE TO LAND. If you throw a nice touch shot about 100 feet in front of the am pad (this is the only shot that negates throwing through the woods and crossing your fingers) and land dead center of the mulch - well, you have no good 2nd shot. The shape of the first fairway - s turn through the woods, does not allow for a 2nd shot to at least get you out to the open - this means you are actually better off when your tee shot lands off the fairway and you may have a chance to get out and maybe get an Eagle putt pending everything lines up OK. I hate to play lucky golf so I throw the touch shot off the tee, then a gimmicky little forehand or putter back hand another 150 feet up the fairway or so, and then try to nut my 3rd shot on the really cool sloping and guarded green. What I hate most is that with the removal of some trees, this could be one of those memorable holes, but as it stands, it is just a gimmick one again based on luck rather than skill.
Hole 17 - this hole is not as bad as the ones above - but I'm adding it because 90% of the golfers are going to throw straight up the gut - and when the long position is in, this is pretty much a poke and hope halfway there . I throw a huge spike hyzer up and around, but this is a big shot and the majority of casual players cannot execute this.
Other Thoughts: I love challenging holes. I especially love Risk/Reward. What I am describing above is challenging by gimmickry, not by good design. When I first played, I just assumed it was a work in progress, then pads went in, tape came off trees, and it's going to take 10 or 15 years to make fairways via tree smacks.
So far, it is the worst Gateway design I've played - and I consider Dave to be a premier designer.
**Keep in mind there are a lot of politics in course design and every removal of a tree requires permission - for all I know, this was not the final plan, but ended up being so. I don't have those details, so I'm giving an honest review as is. **
I sincerely appreciate all the hard work that went into it, and this area has been begging for a disc golf course for many years.
I have 7 holes listed above, but one is jus a pin placement and the other is really not that bad. Meaning there are only 5 throw away holes and 13 really good ones.
My 3 rating is being nice because 5 holes is a lot, and this is perhaps one of the worst courses for tournament play due to the high luck factor on some of these holes. I assure you many high level players echo my thoughts here.
I know there are golfers out there that like this type of gold - it certainly does level the playing field and allow average Joes to out shoot above average Joes with a couple of bad breaks.
All the holes are fixable by creating true fairways and removing some trees.
Make no mistake, I'm not all about cutting down the forest - but if you cannot create a reasonable fairway, then don't put in a permanent tee pad - bottom line.
The most frustrating part about it is that my scoring spread here is always based on if I get shafted on one of the above mentioned holes or note. I think 54 is really solid here.
I look forward to seeing the course in another 10 years or so.....
6 of 7 people found this review helpful.
1 Helpful / 0 Not
Nice course, very pretty landscape
Pros: I (had) to play 'the fort' before it closed for the holiday season. I plan to visit next spring, for sure!
All 18 holes are short-ish. Very fair, lots of righty shots, threading of needles, down hill, uphill.
All set in a beautiful chunk of woods.
There is nicely maintained turf, great woods and a clean lake. (not in play except for a few holes at most).
Tee pads are concrete.
baskets are perfect
Laid back atmosphere, can feel secluded in spots.
Cons: Take a map first outing. I was lucky and buddied up with a few regulars. It helped navigate, but the course flows well. (Only a few tees are across a street or out of view from the last basket).
A little muddy the day I played, I could imagine that in summer it would offer some great skips.
Not much wrong here, be ready to throw short, accurate shots. And avoid tree trunks. There is a lot more air than there is tree trunks, so it should be easy, right? ;>
Other Thoughts: I can certainly see how game management is important here. You may want to lay up to stay out of the woods, or avoid hitting a tree squarely, and to get into putting range with minimal throws. Easy to park, seems like the other park goers are aware of flying discs and the course, generally. Nice and clean grounds.
1 of 1 people found this review helpful.
Pros: Really pretty park. Excellent tees and baskets. Forced to throw different types of shots(one of my fav parts of disc golf).
Cons: Layout was a bit confusing, even with a black and white map. Print a color one. The wooded holes are too a bit to tight for my liking. We played the short tees on most of them cuz the likelihood of getting through the lines wasn't worth the risk of plinking a tree from the pro tee and not making it to the short tree.
Update from a year later...between my improvement and more of the brush and small trees being cleared, I found this a much more fun and manageable course. Looking forward to playing it again.
Other Thoughts: I really liked about half the holes of the course. The park is great and if you know the layout, it's a nice walk.
A very fun course when you execute your shots.
0 Helpful / 1 Not
Decent, But Needs Work
Pros: Very tidy course
Good mix of long and short tees
Bright, easy to find baskets
Tees are constructed well
Cons: Not well laid out
No bridges over some creeks
Practice basket in bad location
Other Thoughts: Pretty good for a new course. I've been playing disc golf for about 4 years now, and I find this course tough because it's overgrown and worn out. Once it's more well known, I think the course will get a lot better.
0 of 1 people found this review helpful.
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