Garu bag advice on options.

[raceface59]

Hi. I've been playing since last September, with 2021 about to be my first real year. I caught the bug, went out and bought the pro bag and about 20 discs for different situations. Then I read Garu's thread on building a limited beginner bag and it made total sense. I have a bunch of options from what I've already bought and was wondering which to carry in the mid and driver positions.

Putter will be Pig since I like the thumb track and the plastic.

For mid I have a choice of Barham Tour Series Buzzz SS in Z, regular Buzzz in Z, and regular Buzzz in ESP. Or should I consider a Buzzz in a lower Pro-D or X plastic for beating in faster?

For drivers I have a choice of Undertaker in Pro-D, Avenger SS in Pro-D, Barry Schultz Champion Leopard, and Teebird 3 in a Star plastic.

I've noticed that over the last month or so, my shots are generally going straighter, especially my Buzzz, and not flying over to the left any more like they did when I started. I'm starting to experiment shot shaping with flips and flex shots a bit. Whatever you suggest as substitutions or additions will be appreciated. I intend to use this simplified bag for the year.Thanks.

 

[dmoore1998]

For very simplified bags, I like fairly straight discs because they're easier to shape in multiple ways for a beginner. For me, I'd go with the Regular Buzzz in ESP, and the Champion Leopard. Personally, I wouldn't really want a beat in Buzzz SS or Buzzz...they're already stable/understable, I wouldn't want them to get flippy.

Some of the driver stuff I'd worry more about where I typically play and what kind of speed I want to throw. Leopard is quite a bit slower than an Avenger...if you're just starting to throw straighter, I'd stick with the Leopard. The other drivers are a bit higher speed that you can probably work your way into.

 

[ray1970]

What he said.

I could play any of the courses in my area with that leopard and a regular Buzzz and probably shoot pretty well assuming it wasn't stupid windy.

That pig would be my go-to disc for most upshots but I wouldn't make it my primary putter. I have putted with a pig when the wind is really up but I prefer a much straighter disc for normal putting duties.

 

[armiller]

I wouldn't be surprised if all three of those mids fly similarly. The tour series Z discs generally fly more overstable than their typical Z or ESP counterparts. To be honest, if you have a bag that's large enough, I think it's still beneficial to have all three of them to compare. If your form is still developing, there's likely more variation between three throws than there is between the flight characteristics of those three particular Buzzz's.

...
Your goal as a beginner is to both improve technique and line shaping. Start with this:

Putter - 1 mold, preferably a stable, in most cases beaded putter in low end plastic that isn't flexible (e.g. S Wizard, KC Aviar, D Challenger, D Focus, S Voodoo, etc.)

Mid - 1 mold, neutral to slightly overstable (e.g. DX Roc, Buzzz, Shark, Cro, Element, there's like a million of them).

Driver* - 1 mold, slow, low end plastic, with some turn and some fade (e.g. DX Cheetah, M Polaris LS, DX Gazelle, D Cyclone, DX Eagle-X, etc.)

Overstable Driver - 1 mold, overstable by design, not because of speed (e.g. Banshee, Firebird, Predator, etc.)

...

Ideally, you'll be able to shape any line from pure hyzers to pure anhyzers and all sorts of 'S' and straight shots in between. Being able to control all of those discs on full power drives is important.

I'd recommend that setup for anyone who can't perform all shots with those four discs. If you have more molds it's OK to use them in field practice when fixing technique issues, but sticking to those four molds for rounds and for learning line shaping will make it a lot easier.

...

You'll notice I left off "Understable driver." IMO, beat control drivers and stable distance drivers are the best options for this spot. If you need a stop-gap solution for a tournament or something there are options, but once you get good with that first bag you'll both be good at forcing discs over (and "under" to make them hold hyzers) and you'll have beat up control drivers (remember how I said to buy the cheap plastic?).

I dont know exactly how the Undertaker and Avenger SS will fly. I'm suspicious they might be a little on the understable side, the Leopard a little overstable (mild turn but with significant end fade due to being in Champion), and that Teebird 3 being quite a bit more overstable than the Leopard.

That said, I don't think any of those are particularly BAD discs for form. Garublador's point, as above, is that you learn to shape throws with a limited number of discs without relying on different discs to do everything. But learning subtle (and not so subtle) differences between molds is big. And as I mentioned above, you may find early on that there's more variation from throw to throw than from disc to disc.

So, practically, I wouldn't hold it against you if you bag all of the mids/fairways you mentioned above. During casual/practice rounds, pick the disc you think is best for the shot and try to make it. (e.g. with the ESP Buzzz) Then, try to make the same shot with the Z Buzzz and the Buzzz SS. You'll learn how the discs fly, and you'll also be able to correct for some common mistakes, such as nose up release, over or underpowering the throw, wrong hyzer angle, etc. I think the repetition in throws is more beneficial to your form and game than detrimental to you game by changing up the discs. And as your form gets better and better, you'll learn and be able to take advantage of the differences in disc flight and how to use them on the course.

Hope that helps.

 

[raceface59]

Many thanks. As far as putter choices then, here's my entire bag.


PUTTERS

Gateway Wizard
Gateway Wizard SSSS
Gateway Shaman
Innova Pig
Discraft Challenger
Discraft Challenger SS
Discraft Fierce
Discmania Sensei
Dynamic Discs Deputy
Daredevil Discs Woodchuck (winter)

MIDS

Discraft Barham Tour Buzzz SS
Discraft Buzzz Z
Discraft Buzzz ESP
Discraft Drone
Gateway Mystic
Daredevil Discs Walrus (winter)

DRIVERS

Innova Barry Shultz Champion Leopard
Innova Teebird 3
Discraft Avenger SS
Discraft Undertaker
Latitude 64 Diamond
Daredevil Discs Ogopogo (winter)

 

[armiller]

Gateway Wizard
Gateway Wizard SSSS
Gateway Shaman
Innova Pig
Discraft Challenger
Discraft Challenger SS
Discraft Fierce
Discmania Sensei
Dynamic Discs Deputy
Daredevil Discs Woodchuck (winter)

I'm not familiar with all of those, but you've got plenty of excellent throwing putters. You may want to save one for putting only (totally a matter of personal preference), but the Wizards, Challengers, and Fierce are likely excellent and baggable throwing putters unless they happen to be freakishly overstable or glideless (this seems to happen to some putters in premium plastics). I'm not familiar with the Shaman, Sensei, Deputy, or Woodchuck but I'm sure they're decent too...

You'll find most of us have some extra putters lying around that we've 1) tried as a throwing or putting putter, or 2) use for throwing/putting practice. Methinks you're working on decent collection already.

 

[zontar]

damn. I'd recommend throwing that Leopard a lot to start with. welcome and have fun!

 

[lines]

2 wizards
2 Buzzz
Leopard
TB3

I could rip this all day.

 

[raceface59]

Thanks for everyone's help. When the dust settled I went with:

DX Leopard 3
Star Teebird 3
Lat 64 Compass in Retro base plastic (loved the thin flat shape and plastic)
ESP Buzzz
R-Pro Pig
MVP Anode in Electron plastic (felt "right")

 

[Meillo]

Thanks for everyone's help. When the dust settled I went with:

DX Leopard 3
Star Teebird 3
Lat 64 Compass in Retro base plastic (loved the thin flat shape and plastic)
ESP Buzzz
R-Pro Pig
MVP Anode in Electron plastic (felt "right")

Looks good.

After some time, you could choose to drop either the Compass or the Buzzz, because they both are pretty similar (unless the Retro plastic would beat in quickly). But anyways, this is a great bag that you can play well and competatively with for a long time. Later you'll probably start to feel a wish to add a noticably more overstable disc than the Teebird3. This more overstable driver is part of the Garu bag. You don't so much need it in the beginning, as the Star Teebird3 will likely be enough overstable for you now.

Try to stay away from faster drivers. They add less to (the potential of) your game than exploring all angles with the discs you already have.

Congrats to your bag!

 

[raceface59]

Thanks. I stuck the Teebird 3 in there because, with my inexperience, when I threw it the fade took over and it went very left lol.

 

[Meillo]

Thanks. I stuck the Teebird 3 in there because, with my inexperience, when I threw it the fade took over and it went very left lol.

That's normal. Later it will be a straight-stable driver for you: going straight for most of the flight, with some fade at the end. Partly you'll learn to throw faster and thus Teebirds won't be overstable for you anymore, and partly this specific disc wi'll season and lose some of it's fade.

For now, play with your bag; it provides all you need for quite some time.