Newbie disc weight question!

[geebob]

Maybe there is another aspect to this question as well. There is a sweet spot between US and OS properties of a disc to achieve the max distance. Max weight discs that are US tend to be flatter, a lower plh and tend to have a more convex lower side of the wing. OS discs on the opposite tend to have more dome (domey destroyers are OS af), a higher plh and a more concave lower side of the wing. Using lighter discs allow one to throw discs that are shaped like OS discs but because of the lighter weight they still fly understable.

I wanted to circle back to this after giving it some thought. I think your point is excellent and somewhat explains my experience with the Teebird. It was my absolute favorite disc for a long while and one of the few that I could throw consistently over 200'. When I decided to get more serious about my game, I took a few months off and just worked on rebuilding my throw. When I started throwing the Teebird again, it was one of my worst discs and I simply could not control it so I took it out of the bag.

Your post makes me think that what happened was that I was occasionally throwing that light Teebird with enough speed and spin to make it flip over and go way right. Then I'd correct by throwing with more hyzer which would make it crash way left. I'm going to pull out the Teebirds next time I do fieldwork and see how I throw them now. I've got two thar are around 150g and a few more around 165g.

 

[zontar]

good observations. also a good reason to keep discs around that you don't like. sometimes you can revisit them a year or two later and realize they work for you.

 

[Sheep]

good observations. also a good reason to keep discs around that you don't like. sometimes you can revisit them a year or two later and realize they work for you.

There are things that people don't account for when being a keyboard warrior on the internet or a player in general with poor brain function.

There are a lot of discs out there that I would put as a "beginner/expert" disc.
These discs generally get poo poo'ed by pea brained players and keyboard warriors because they don't understand a lot about what they are doing or talking about.
One of these discs is generally really good for newer players as it might be light and/or flippy. Which as our form develops, these discs start to turn into incontrollable discs for us. This is where the dumb dumb brain power comes in.
The macho in some people just talks trash about how good they are turning over so and so disc, blah blah, and ... it has absolutely nothing to do with that.

So there are 2 courses to go through at this point with these style discs, And this applies to light weight stuff, which is why I'm bringing it up.

You can continue to throw this suddenly "unthrowable" disc and master it now, or shelf it for a bit and get it back out when your form develops as well as your brain power.
With light weight discs, it's generally because we are over speeding the disc so much due to its weight and our better form, that we just burn the disc in some fashion while throwing it, late releases, whatever it is.

And here is the point that I'm bringing as per what ya'll mentioned.
When your form cleans up and you can start to control angles and control your spin, control your power more better gooder, these discs can come back out and be thrown. And learning to control these previously unthrowable discs will level up your game insane amounts as suddenly you're able to smooth these 150 discs with little effort and control them without trying to huck everything you throw.

Or throw the flippy stuff with good spin and snap and throw effortless hyzer flips, or hyzer pushes.

The problem with the keyboard warriors and the uneducated individuals who wanna trash talk people trying to properly learn over time as they continue to tell you how they "Turn over firebirds" and "throw destroyers 500 feet" when You've never seen them throw anything over 300 feet on their force annie flex chop forehand, or their atrociously spun out backhand arm shot that goes 250 feet.
I digress. I just really wanted to shit talk keyboard warriors.
But if you made it this far, the info I talked about above is true.

These crazy discs taht we suddenly struggle with at the start of golfing, they are great to get back out to see how great you can control your power and spin and other features of throwing.
Turning a disc over isn't some magical skill. The magical skill is taking an instant roller disc cause its so flippy and throwing controlled spike hyzers with it and not turning it over.

 

[Spectacledbear]

I threw alot of light weight discs this summer. I was never able to outthrow my max weight DX Teebird with them. Some were speed 7, some speed 9.

What i did learn was skipping 180g midranges, too heavy.

 

[mostlynorwegian]

Turning a disc over isn't some magical skill. The magical skill is taking an instant roller disc cause its so flippy and throwing controlled spike hyzers with it and not turning it over.

Getting a Mamba up and have it STAY straight and finish on hyzer is a beautiful thing. Sort of takes less power too.

 

[Sheep]

Getting a Mamba up and have it STAY straight and finish on hyzer is a beautiful thing. Sort of takes less power too.

The overall point that should be made in this thread isn't really about disc weights, though it sort of is.

The biggest thing to throw good is realizing that you need to try and match weight/flight to your current form.

If you're struggling to get the speed on some discs, you need to lighten the weight up and find a disc that gives you the flights to get the distance.

The argument that "oh my max weigh blah blah goes the furthest"
It has absolutely nothing to do with the weight, but your ability to get that disc flying fast enough to perform in a fashion that allows it to fly the furthest for you.

And that's really just it.

Keeping discs matched to your skill/power level that allow you to achieve the greatest flights of the disc at that time.

Were not pro golfers.
We should be changing discs more because we are constantly evolving with our forms, and its best for us to keep a consistent form, and adjust with discs to help with flights, vs trying to push discs around and mess up our not solidified form.

It's just ... well.
Dumb anyways.

The best advice is "throw the disc that performs the best for you."

If its a nuke ss, then whatever.
I can think youre stupid all day, but if its what works, its what works.

It depends on how you want to advance playing disc golf and in what fashion.
Are you happy wehre you're at? cool, keep throwing the nuke.
Do you wanna get better? Then we need to hvae a talk about disc selection and how you're throwing.

 

[ChrisinFL]

I threw alot of light weight discs this summer. I was never able to outthrow my max weight DX Teebird with them. Some were speed 7, some speed 9.

What i did learn was skipping 180g midranges, too heavy.

How far are you throwing the Teebird? I am still a newer player, and I only max at 265', but I have played with light weight discs a lot. My 150g River and Escape do nothing for me. At light weight, I don't think they cut through the air enough to go real far. To get max distance with a light weight disc, use a much faster disc. Try a light weight 13-14 speed, vary the weights and stability, and you might find one you can bomb with less effort than a max weight Teebird? Also, I think light weight discs mostly provide benefit up to a certain point - if you bomb the max weight Teebird 400', light weight discs might not get you further (you know, unless you throw a Boss in 100 mph wind for max distance with no concern about control). I think a lot of the benefit of light weight discs is more distance for slower arms, but for faster arms, maybe just getting similar distances without having to put quite as much effort into the throws - not have to put herculean effort into every distance throw.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Fwiw I tried the river back in the day, looked good on paper but I didn't like it. Didn't do what I thought it should, one of my friends with way less arm than me loves it. I gave him my pink one because I was tired of looking for his brown one. Haha. He's still got it.

If SB is getting max distance on a max weight DX teebird that's awesome. Probably most likely to advance their game more than searching for a magic speed 14. That's a sign of progression a LA sheep's discertation.

I'm a believer that mixing up the bag can help learn stuff, especially when it comes to "feeling the heavy disc". Adding a few heavy to my bag this year made me remember things I've forgotten over the last couple "light" years. The scorpion definitely makes me think hard before I throw it... 186g.. wooomph.

Haha I like throwing a Mayhem bag of different weights/stabilities, 155 fission envys, some glitches, max weight envys, toss in a tempo or Entropy, maybe a whitler. Round out the mids with a 165 uplink and some 180gs, toss in a few 186 scorpions and see how I adjust for the conceived differences in flights. Not something I would usually do on game/league day.

 

[Spectacledbear]

How far are you throwing the Teebird? I am still a newer player, and I only max at 265', but I have played with light weight discs a lot. My 150g River and Escape do nothing for me. At light weight, I don't think they cut through the air enough to go real far. To get max distance with a light weight disc, use a much faster disc. Try a light weight 13-14 speed, vary the weights and stability, and you might find one you can bomb with less effort than a max weight Teebird? Also, I think light weight discs mostly provide benefit up to a certain point - if you bomb the max weight Teebird 400', light weight discs might not get you further (you know, unless you throw a Boss in 100 mph wind for max distance with no concern about control). I think a lot of the benefit of light weight discs is more distance for slower arms, but for faster arms, maybe just getting similar distances without having to put quite as much effort into the throws - not have to put herculean effort into every distance throw.

345 or so. Now its better form or stay at this distance, which i honestly dont mind that much.

 

[Spectacledbear]

Fwiw I tried the river back in the day, looked good on paper but I didn't like it. Didn't do what I thought it should, one of my friends with way less arm than me loves it. I gave him my pink one because I was tired of looking for his brown one. Haha. He's still got it.

If SB is getting max distance on a max weight DX teebird that's awesome. Probably most likely to advance their game more than searching for a magic speed 14. That's a sign of progression a LA sheep's discertation.

I'm a believer that mixing up the bag can help learn stuff, especially when it comes to "feeling the heavy disc". Adding a few heavy to my bag this year made me remember things I've forgotten over the last couple "light" years. The scorpion definitely makes me think hard before I throw it... 186g.. wooomph.

Haha I like throwing a Mayhem bag of different weights/stabilities, 155 fission envys, some glitches, max weight envys, toss in a tempo or Entropy, maybe a whitler. Round out the mids with a 165 uplink and some 180gs, toss in a few 186 scorpions and see how I adjust for the conceived differences in flights. Not something I would usually do on game/league day.

Hah, i actually got a Condor a couple of years ago, but its just sitting there collecting dust. Almost 200 grams. Time for a Condor only round.

 

[Skervoy]

How far are you throwing the Teebird? I am still a newer player, and I only max at 265', but I have played with light weight discs a lot. My 150g River and Escape do nothing for me. At light weight, I don't think they cut through the air enough to go real far. To get max distance with a light weight disc, use a much faster disc. Try a light weight 13-14 speed, vary the weights and stability, and you might find one you can bomb with less effort than a max weight Teebird? Also, I think light weight discs mostly provide benefit up to a certain point - if you bomb the max weight Teebird 400', light weight discs might not get you further (you know, unless you throw a Boss in 100 mph wind for max distance with no concern about control). I think a lot of the benefit of light weight discs is more distance for slower arms, but for faster arms, maybe just getting similar distances without having to put quite as much effort into the throws - not have to put herculean effort into every distance throw.

Yepp, The inhereint distance capacity for a long thrower is more or less the same light vs heavy discs.

The light accelerates faster The heavy has more momentum to push late in the flight.

A river is fairly understable as it is so most men would be able even with fairly bad form to get it flying as it should. So dropping the weight isnt as beneficial. A lighter river for a girl can be a pretty good option to get some easy controlable distance.

 

[ChrisinFL]

345 or so. Now its better form or stay at this distance, which i honestly dont mind that much.

I wish I could throw anything 345'! Not sure if a light weight disc will get you much more than that in a controllable throw, but if so, definitely thinking you want to try 13-14 speed, probably high glide, and try a few different weights and stabilities. With my slow arm, 145-150g seems best. Lighter than that is just too floaty, and heavier distance drivers I can't get up to a useful speed yet. Katana? Boss? I recommend you try one - if nothing else, they are just fun to throw. You can probably dial back the power some, and still bomb them a very long ways. Do an Innova F2 Friday deal, and you can order 3 light weight F2s to try out for pretty cheap. Then, if you love one, you can always order a pretty version later if that is a thing for you. My favorite discs are mostly all F2s - I care a lot more about how they fly and price, and a lot less about looks (although I do prefer easy to find colors)! Order 5 and get 10% off, or order 10 and get 20% off.

 

[Sheep]

Hah, i actually got a Condor a couple of years ago, but its just sitting there collecting dust. Almost 200 grams. Time for a Condor only round.

I've got a whole bag of super class discs.
They are so much more fun to throw.

 

[Sheep]

I wish I could throw anything 345'! Not sure if a light weight disc will get you much more than that in a controllable throw, but if so, definitely thinking you want to try 13-14 speed, probably high glide, and try a few different weights and stabilities. With my slow arm, 145-150g seems best. Lighter than that is just too floaty, and heavier distance drivers I can't get up to a useful speed yet. Katana? Boss? I recommend you try one - if nothing else, they are just fun to throw. You can probably dial back the power some, and still bomb them a very long ways. Do an Innova F2 Friday deal, and you can order 3 light weight F2s to try out for pretty cheap. Then, if you love one, you can always order a pretty version later if that is a thing for you. My favorite discs are mostly all F2s - I care a lot more about how they fly and price, and a lot less about looks (although I do prefer easy to find colors)! Order 5 and get 10% off, or order 10 and get 20% off.

Lightweight boss's and Terns seem to be oddballs when it comes to weight/speed/distance for some players.

A guy I play with can throw with fair power, but he really enjoys lightweight stuff the most. and Generally throws 140-150something boss's a lot and he can throw them very well. But you get heavier stuff in his hands and if its a big driver, it goes nowhere.


There used to be a dumb formula we used on disc speed vs distance, and I cannot think of what it is anymore. Where you throw your whole bag and take the average distance of the flights, then do something and you'd have a fair recommended max disc speed to throw.


If you're really struggling to hit over 300 and get up to 350. A lot of it has to do with 2 basic factors.

Disc choice and nose angle when thrown.

There are a few other basic factors on throwing as well. Players generally stuck in the 250-280 range are throwing with their arm, not their body.
And players stuck at 300 generally are throwing nose up.

I'm generally stuck in the 300-330 range throwing myself because I throw nose up. On a good day when I manage to do something I cannot remember what I'm doing the next day, and get that nose down. With out any difference in what I'm doing, I'm 430+ on my throws just from 1 or 2 degree of nose angle difference.

I do not throw hard, I'm lazy and heavily injured. So it doesn't take super man to throw 450.
It really just takes disc choice and nose angle.

And for any reference, I'm throwing 150 class defy's 450.

 

[ChrisinFL]

Lightweight boss's and Terns seem to be oddballs when it comes to weight/speed/distance for some players.

A guy I play with can throw with fair power, but he really enjoys lightweight stuff the most. and Generally throws 140-150something boss's a lot and he can throw them very well. But you get heavier stuff in his hands and if its a big driver, it goes nowhere.


There used to be a dumb formula we used on disc speed vs distance, and I cannot think of what it is anymore. Where you throw your whole bag and take the average distance of the flights, then do something and you'd have a fair recommended max disc speed to throw.


If you're really struggling to hit over 300 and get up to 350. A lot of it has to do with 2 basic factors.

Disc choice and nose angle when thrown.

There are a few other basic factors on throwing as well. Players generally stuck in the 250-280 range are throwing with their arm, not their body.
And players stuck at 300 generally are throwing nose up.

I'm generally stuck in the 300-330 range throwing myself because I throw nose up. On a good day when I manage to do something I cannot remember what I'm doing the next day, and get that nose down. With out any difference in what I'm doing, I'm 430+ on my throws just from 1 or 2 degree of nose angle difference.

I do not throw hard, I'm lazy and heavily injured. So it doesn't take super man to throw 450.
It really just takes disc choice and nose angle.

And for any reference, I'm throwing 150 class defy's 450.

I love Terns - have a bunch of F2 Terns, and more on the way. My first 145-150g F2 Boss is on the way now too, though I figure there is a fair chance I won't be able to throw it decent yet. I am sure I throw mostly arm and very little body - 5 months playing, making somewhat small steady gains. I just rewatched some videos last night, and have two tips I am anxious to try out for that very reason - try to get more from my body into my throw! My battle to improve my form/technique is always ongoing! The two tips: one, on reach back, focus instead on my left shoulder, to get better curl and try to keep my right (throwing) arm more relaxed. I did that once a long time ago, and it seemed to help, but it didn't stick. Two, on the last step of my x-step, slide my plant foot forward (no lift), and keep my weight more over my back foot longer. Come on, give me some improvement! On the light weight discs, I also find Fission Wave, Katana and Corvette do well for me.

 

[Kennets]

Must. Resist. Urge.

20 grams is NOT gonna make any difference for people that throw in the 150-300 range, that's a basic form issue.

As sheep stated, its more of a disc (not the weight of it) and nose angle issue, along with understanding the basic mechanics of a throw.

If you guys like throwing max or light weight, fine - but stop advocating for it like it's something miraculous cure to sort out our baby arms, it isn't.

I would bet my left nut, that discing down would be 100% more beneficial for 90% of the "average" players..

Arg... Me hulk, me smash..

I'm sorry..

Form will always be superior and reduce the risk of getting an injury, than 20 grams of reduced weight.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Lightweight boss's and Terns seem to be oddballs when it comes to weight/speed/distance for some players.

A guy I play with can throw with fair power, but he really enjoys lightweight stuff the most. and Generally throws 140-150something boss's a lot and he can throw them very well. But you get heavier stuff in his hands and if its a big driver, it goes nowhere.
..........

There are a few other basic factors on throwing as well. Players generally stuck in the 250-280 range are throwing with their arm, not their body.
And players stuck at 300 generally are throwing nose up.
......

Must. Resist. Urge.

20 grams is NOT gonna make any difference for people that throw in the 150-300 range, that's a basic form issue.

As sheep stated, its more of a disc (not the weight of it) and nose angle issue, along with understanding the basic mechanics of a throw.

If you guys like throwing max or light weight, fine - but stop advocating for it like it's something miraculous cure to sort out our baby arms, it isn't.

I would bet my left nut, that discing down would be 100% more beneficial for 90% of the "average" players..

Arg... Me hulk, me smash..

I'm sorry..

Form will always be superior and reduce the risk of getting an injury, than 20 grams of reduced weight.

Hmmm well I tried to slice and dice and respond to the quotes but I'm having trouble with the new platform haha.

You both have good points.. Sheep said something about his friend and a 150 boss and that he is broken but can toss a 150 defy 450'.... sounds right to me. The 150 boss is a fickle beast, with good form and or a solid FH they can hum, if you try to cheat it with too much anhyzer then they dive to roller, the MVP fission 155 octane is similar.

Sheep also said the 250-280' folks are throwing mostly with arm. I believe that to be mostly correct. That's where I'm at these days, lack of leg motion has cost me at least 50' of distance.

Kennets can keep his left nut, he's right most people would benefit from discing down rather than finding a light max speed disc they are just barely getting up to speed.

20g however is a massive difference in weight. Good form is more likely to prevent injury than disc weight, but if 90 percent of us have poor form and are throwing arm heavy in the sub 300' range then a light disc should be easier on the arm. I support a good rant and Hulk Smash is pretty on point haha.

If weight doesn't make a difference let me ask you this... Do you enjoy throwing 180g mids? Can you throw a 174g mid cleaner than a 180g? That's only 6g.

Personally my preferred comet weight is 174-176, Buzzz I used to use a 170 and a 174g. Hex/Reactor/wasp 170g or the 155 fission reactor. The only mid at 180g that I really click with is the soft uplink with -3 turn, that baby hums as far as a fairway driver.

When I'm curious what the MVP pros are bagging I'm checking the ladies lighter bags, not the dudes.

 

[Kennets]

Hmmm well I tried to slice and dice and respond to the quotes but I'm having trouble with the new platform haha.

You both have good points.. Sheep said something about his friend and a 150 boss and that he is broken but can toss a 150 defy 450'.... sounds right to me. The 150 boss is a fickle beast, with good form and or a solid FH they can hum, if you try to cheat it with too much anhyzer then they dive to roller, the MVP fission 155 octane is similar.

Sheep also said the 250-280' folks are throwing mostly with arm. I believe that to be mostly correct. That's where I'm at these days, lack of leg motion has cost me at least 50' of distance.

Kennets can keep his left nut, he's right most people would benefit from discing down rather than finding a light max speed disc they are just barely getting up to speed.

20g however is a massive difference in weight. Good form is more likely to prevent injury than disc weight, but if 90 percent of us have poor form and are throwing arm heavy in the sub 300' range then a light disc should be easier on the arm. I support a good rant and Hulk Smash is pretty on point haha.

If weight doesn't make a difference let me ask you this... Do you enjoy throwing 180g mids? Can you throw a 174g mid cleaner than a 180g? That's only 6g.

Personally my preferred comet weight is 174-176, Buzzz I used to use a 170 and a 174g. Hex/Reactor/wasp 170g or the 155 fission reactor. The only mid at 180g that I really click with is the soft uplink with -3 turn, that baby hums as far as a fairway driver.

When I'm curious what the MVP pros are bagging I'm checking the ladies lighter bags, not the dudes.

Thanks for supporting my rant again, I'm not here to tell people what to throw, you do you!

I have no doubt that lighter discs can be beneficial for some people and definitely yield more distance, but, so could form and an either slower disc or more understable disc.

Wouldn't you rather switch up the form to be less arm heavy, than to delay a possible injury with a lighter disc?

If one had decent form compared to age, injuries etc, by all means, throw whatever you want, how far you can - but I'm almost certain that it's not the issue with most people.

Me personally, I possibly would benefit from it, since I'm a chronic pain patient (neck and back) and rarely throws these days. My bag is mostly in the 169-175 range, I have a D1 and a sword in the 15x range ish. I use the D1 for open max distance shots or a Mamba with my backhand. Before my injury I had pretty decent FH distance and any lightweight disc would be too Flippy (despite me throwing hyzer flips most of the time).

I haven't played around with a full bag of lighter discs, but I might do at some point and possibly eat all of my words.

 

[ChrisinFL]

Thanks for supporting my rant again, I'm not here to tell people what to throw, you do you!

I have no doubt that lighter discs can be beneficial for some people and definitely yield more distance, but, so could form and an either slower disc or more understable disc.

Wouldn't you rather switch up the form to be less arm heavy, than to delay a possible injury with a lighter disc?

If one had decent form compared to age, injuries etc, by all means, throw whatever you want, how far you can - but I'm almost certain that it's not the issue with most people.

Me personally, I possibly would benefit from it, since I'm a chronic pain patient (neck and back) and rarely throws these days. My bag is mostly in the 169-175 range, I have a D1 and a sword in the 15x range ish. I use the D1 for open max distance shots or a Mamba with my backhand. Before my injury I had pretty decent FH distance and any lightweight disc would be too Flippy (despite me throwing hyzer flips most of the time).

I haven't played around with a full bag of lighter discs, but I might do at some point and possibly eat all of my words.

I get it. I hear over and over, form, form, form. I just don't think the people saying that are paying much attention to the fact that I am working diligently and consistently on form. I do field practice 2-3 times a week, play 2-4 times a week, and practice putting 2-4 times a week. I study here, and UTube videos, to learn correct form, and I have my son video my throw and I analyze it almost every week. I go frame by frame trying to find what needs to be corrected the most, work on that, then the next thing. I am not trying to hulk smash - if anything, the opposite - I go slower and easier and try to get my form right. I am 54 years old, playing for fun, so I want minimum risk of injury, and for now I have more fun and throw better with 145-150g distance drivers. As I improve, that may change, but right now, I do BOTH. I work on improving my form, and I throw light weight drivers. Sorry you hate that, but it works for me. I have not once said the light weight discs are a miracle fix, nor do I use them to replace form work - I do both. Rant done.

 

[Kennets]

I get it. I hear over and over, form, form, form. I just don't think the people saying that are paying much attention to the fact that I am working diligently and consistently on form. I do field practice 2-3 times a week, play 2-4 times a week, and practice putting 2-4 times a week. I study here, and UTube videos, to learn correct form, and I have my son video my throw and I analyze it almost every week. I go frame by frame trying to find what needs to be corrected the most, work on that, then the next thing. I am not trying to hulk smash - if anything, the opposite - I go slower and easier and try to get my form right. I am 54 years old, playing for fun, so I want minimum risk of injury, and for now I have more fun and throw better with 145-150g distance drivers. As I improve, that may change, but right now, I do BOTH. I work on improving my form, and I throw light weight drivers. Sorry you hate that, but it works for me. I have not once said the light weight discs are a miracle fix, nor do I use them to replace form work - I do both. Rant done.

if you were to read my rant(s) again (mind my English), you would probably realise that it wasn't meant for you in general and that i merely told people to get better form as a way of preventing injuries..

you absolutely need to chill buddy. I've been nothing but kind and understanding towards your "ways", even though I don't agree on the "drivers".