[Mids] Premium plastic mid lineups

[broomerang]

'Never' is perhaps too strong a word choice. I imagine the odds are stronger that he would click with at least one of them. :\

I'll concede to it being too strong a word, it was a pretty extreme set up to make a point. The sentiment applies though I think.

 

[jjmiller]

I didn't read through the entire thread, but I also gravitate towards different molds of mids in premium plastics vs a cycle. I like the idea of a Roc cycle, but I don't throw mids nearly as much as putters and drivers, so a cycle would take forever for me to develop.

Currently I'm bagging a Bio Verdict and Bio eMac Truth. Also have a Buzzz in the bag. It has a little different hand feel than the other two, but also has more HSS and maybe even less fade than the eMac. If I ever lose the Verdict or beat it out of its stability role, I'll probably replace it with a Hornet(snagged three when they went OOP) and just go Buzzz/Hornet. For me, the Hornet is to the Verdict about like the Buzzz is to the eMac- more HSS but otherwise pretty similar.

I picked up an X Comet that I think I like based on the very few throws I've made so far. If I didn't already have so many other mids, I'd be tempted to pick up a Z Comet and an Amber Gila and give that setup a whirl.

 

[BrotherDave]

I'll concede to it being too strong a word, it was a pretty extreme set up to make a point. The sentiment applies though I think.

I'm in your camp, I just don't think you helped your argument with the flair of hyperbole. But yeah, I don't think jugging molds is very beneficial for my game nor a great idea for folks cutting their teeth but some people can do it so I'm not really convinced there's a right or wrong way.

I prefer cycling when I can but these days I'm only playing about once or twice a week so the premium set up makes it a bit easier in case I lose a disc. I don't really play enough to season in backups.

 

[DanJon]

I have no problem with people who want to carry 20 different molds, more power to you.

Usually you see two types of those players.

Those who are skilled and developed a complete game and then decided to add a disc for every shot.

Then there are the novices who buy every new disc and constantly put the newest disc in their bags, but never really "learn" them.

The novices then often times wonder why they always hit a wall and never improve past a certain point. That is what some of us are repeatedly pointing out. It's fine if you want to stay where you are, but if you really want to improve, then carrying 20 molds as a newer player isn't the best option in my (and many other's) opinion.

 

[jakebake91]

Wouldnt a disc that holds its flight characteristics longer (premium plastics) be easier to learn since its gonna stay the same longer and not change after a dozen high speed tree hits?

 

[Casey 1988]

What do you bag PMantle? Evidence+Truth+Verdict?
I don't see how that is so far superior to a Meteor+Buzzz+Drone or a Mako+Roc+Gator lineup.

Now if I had to be completely objective... Buzzzes are awesome and Truths suck ass!

I must be way different from everybody else, I go with the Champion Shark 3 and Star/oop Pro Shark line up around 175 grams +/- 1. Impact 170-172 grams is flight is like a Wombat/Wombat 3, the discs I would use if I had to go all Innova. Wombat 3 at any weight between 170 -172 grams is the disc I would use as it is a tad longer more like a Impact distance.

 

[GripEnemy]

Wouldnt a disc that holds its flight characteristics longer (premium plastics) be easier to learn since its gonna stay the same longer and not change after a dozen high speed tree hits?

Yes.

It's also super difficult to bend the rim back into shape after a tree or rock it. Or roller. Never try it.

 

[BrotherDave]

Wouldnt a disc that holds its flight characteristics longer (premium plastics) be easier to learn since its gonna stay the same longer and not change after a dozen high speed tree hits?

Yeah but like DanJon just pointed out, if you're constantly swapping out your premium plastic for new flavors it doesn't do your development much good.

If I had a nickel for every time somebody tried a Comet or Roc or Buzzz or some other classic mold and hated it and then figured out how to throw later and then loved those discs.

 

[jakebake91]

Yeah but like DanJon just pointed out, if you're constantly swapping out your premium plastic for new flavors it doesn't do your development much good.

If I had a nickel for every time somebody tried a Comet or Roc or Buzzz or some other classic mold and hated it and then figured out how to throw later and then loved those discs.

Okay, Im with ya there. As a not so awesome player myself, i carry only 2 mids. A neutral one and a more os one, both premium plastic. Personally no intention myself of swapping anything until i have dang good reason to.

 

[Casey 1988]

Yes.

It's also super difficult to bend the rim back into shape after a tree or rock it. Or roller. Never try it.

I agree, exception to that is some of the Z FLX and ESP FLX discs. Those you could bend back to shape fairly easy if you had pliers with you. G Star I bet about the same but that is a tad bit stiffer premium plastic then the FLX discs.

 

[Putt for D'oh]

But yeah, I don't think jugging molds is very beneficial for my game nor a great idea for folks cutting their teeth but some people can do it so I'm not really convinced there's a right or wrong way.

See I think this is a bit of the point of the argument that pro-cycling people want to say things like "juggling molds". That makes it sound way complicated. Maybe I approached my disc selection different than other noobs, and the more I throw 5 or 6 disc rounds at my home course the more I can see how these are wearing and would like to carry a fresh and worn disc of a few molds, but... trilogy's mid lineup... in premium plastic can have OS to US in discs that feel near identical to each other and in the middle of the stability have one that is higher HSS and little fade and retains fade but gains a bit of turn in HSS area. Basically they feel as much like the same disc worn into different flights without needing to break them in... and being able to kinda select the flight more or less off the shelf (after a bit of beating the new off).

 

[Casey 1988]

I have no problem with people who want to carry 20 different molds, more power to you.

Usually you see two types of those players.

Those who are skilled and developed a complete game and then decided to add a disc for every shot.

Then there are the novices who buy every new disc and constantly put the newest disc in their bags, but never really "learn" them.

The novices then often times wonder why they always hit a wall and never improve past a certain point. That is what some of us are repeatedly pointing out. It's fine if you want to stay where you are, but if you really want to improve, then carrying 20 molds as a newer player isn't the best option in my (and many other's) opinion.

Third is a player who sets up bag exactly like favorite pro from the brand of discs they like most, even if the setup is not even close to the kind of game they play. Some even go as far some to using the same bag as the Sponsored Pro.

 

[GripEnemy]

I agree, exception to that is some of the Z FLX and ESP FLX discs. Those you could bend back to shape fairly easy if you had pliers with you. G Star I bet about the same but that is a tad bit stiffer premium plastic then the FLX discs.

Sarcasm my friend. It's SUPER easy to bend a DX disc back to shape:doh: Let alone any more premium plastic.

 

[Casey 1988]

Sarcasm my friend. It's SUPER easy to bend a DX disc back to shape:doh: Let alone any more premium plastic.

Hard to tell Sarcasm over the Internet.

 

[GripEnemy]

Hard to tell Sarcasm over the Internet.

Yes, but it's easy to realize I was lying about DX being difficult to bend. You talk about all these old Magnets and what not that you used to throw yet you've never tuned a disc before? Smh

 

[Alexplz]

Without worrying about which style would actually result in strokes saved at the end of the day, I can say that the biggest turnoff for cycling a classic mold is the patience and determination it requires. Starting down the path of a cycle as a newer player, that is, one without a massive stack of backup 5/10 rocs in the garage, looks something like this:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: non-roc disc of choice
US: non-roc disc of choice

A few months in, we're looking at:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: Rancho Roc in DX or KC
US: non-roc disc of choice

Oh no, you lost that Roc that it took a couple of months to beat to neutral, because you're a noob who only plays at best a couple times a month and you hucked it in the drink? That's OK, back to start!:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: non-roc disc of choice
US: non-roc disc of choice

In a month or two, you might be to the point where rocs are covering all your midrange shots. Now, worry about developing a system to decide when to shelve your sweet spot rocs as backups. Also, continue to fuss over how many tree hits your go-to roc has sustained when maybe the one above it in stability is a tad too fresh and you have no backups because surprise, you throw your go-to rocs the most and therefore lose them more often.

But that's OK - you'll be down at the local brick n mortar often enough searching for rocs with just the right parameters to suit your needs (thanks innova) that you'll be able to pick up some used beaters as backups, assuming your local bnm deals in used discs, you lucky duck.

Rest assured, in return for working so hard for your mids, they will work hard for you - it's got to be worth it, right? Just make sure you don't forget to feel pity for (look down upon) those poor shlubs spraying some variant of Z buzzz all over the course. They never are able to click with their discs! And when they lose one, they have to make the walk of shame out to their mailbox to retrieve the Z buzzz they bought online that flies exactly like the one they lost, rather than selecting a lovingly curated, 68-tree-hit 2004 vintage 11x out of the garage hoard.

 

[SD86]

Hard to tell Sarcasm over the Internet.

Yes, but it's easy to realize I was lying about DX being difficult to bend.... Smh

Might not be easy for others reading these posts to know it was sarcasm. One of these would've helped: :\ :|

 

[jakebake91]

Without worrying about which style would actually result in strokes saved at the end of the day, I can say that the biggest turnoff for cycling a classic mold is the patience and determination it requires. Starting down the path of a cycle as a newer player, that is, one without a massive stack of backup 5/10 rocs in the garage, looks something like this:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: non-roc disc of choice
US: non-roc disc of choice

A few months in, we're looking at:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: Rancho Roc in DX or KC
US: non-roc disc of choice

Oh no, you lost that Roc that it took a couple of months to beat to neutral, because you're a noob who only plays at best a couple times a month and you hucked it in the drink? That's OK, back to start!:

OS and/or stable slots: Rancho Rocs in DX or KC
Neutral: non-roc disc of choice
US: non-roc disc of choice

In a month or two, you might be to the point where rocs are covering all your midrange shots. Now, worry about developing a system to decide when to shelve your sweet spot rocs as backups. Also, continue to fuss over how many tree hits your go-to roc has sustained when maybe the one above it in stability is a tad too fresh and you have no backups because surprise, you throw your go-to rocs the most and therefore lose them more often.

But that's OK - you'll be down at the local brick n mortar often enough searching for rocs with just the right parameters to suit your needs (thanks innova) that you'll be able to pick up some used beaters as backups, assuming your local bnm deals in used discs, you lucky duck.

Rest assured, in return for working so hard for your mids, they will work hard for you - it's got to be worth it, right? Just make sure you don't forget to feel pity for (look down upon) those poor shlubs spraying some variant of Z buzzz all over the course. They never are able to click with their discs! And when they lose one, they have to make the walk of shame out to their mailbox to retrieve the Z buzzz they bought online that flies exactly like the one they lost, rather than selecting a lovingly curated, 68-tree-hit 2004 vintage 11x out of the garage hoard.

Exactly this!!

 

[Beener]

I play several times a week (on MN wooded courses) so a premium plastic mid lineup works well:

171g VIP Warship: 4+ year old super beat straight to turnover.
171g VIP Warship: Fresh version of above strait to slight fade.
174g VIP Pine: ~1 year old slightly beat straight to slight fade.
174g VIP Pine: Fresh version of above straight to strong fade.

I used to bag a VIP Tursas, then a TP Warship as the turnover disc until my VIP Warship seasoned in. If I lost my seasoned Warship, the TP would come back into the bag until the fresh VIP seasons. The Pines are effectively a "wind tolerant" Warship with fade so replacing a seasoned Pine with a fresh one is no problem. And if more radical US or OS lines are required, I disc up to a Fairway driver (Maul or Spark, respectively) for more flexibility...

 

[GripEnemy]

Might not be easy for others reading these posts to know it was sarcasm. One of these would've helped: :\ :|

You're not wrong, however anyone that's on this website has held a disc before regardless of plastic type.

The average human can't bend even the stiffest of Champion plastic? My almost 8yo daughter sure can. Now think DX...even easier to bend.


/derail