Surviving the 'Chuckers' Stereotype

[superberry]

Not so much, you should bother reading all the posts so you can make a better argument. I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST NOOBS. Unless they litter, vandalize, etc, etc - then they are scumbags who may need to be reformed, but they may be too saturated with it in their blood that it is too late. I don't know becuase I don't understand people who crap where they play.

 

[truk]

Uh...ok. Personal attack much? I haven't actually played a round with superberry, but we've met briefly, and I've seen first hand the amazing work he does at his home course, and I can assure you he would be a joy to play a round with.

I'm sorry you've had such a bad time on this message board - I'd say there's a lot of varying opinions, but I don't think I've ever seen anybody actively discouraging other members from playing. IRL, I have had run-ins with local "pro's" (old guys carting around 200 discs and a case of beers...each) where I felt like I you've described, but they're vastly in the minority, just like I'd think anybody on this board being condecending to new players would be.

It IS all about stereotypes though, and maybe the 75% number is skewed high...but at the end of the day, someone is still going around trashing our courses and I think this topic is perfectly warranted to get us talking about it and hopefully fixing it.

Gee ... you sound like a joy to play a round with ...

The stereotype gathered from this board is more like "Folks who play disc golf like to lord over others if they've been playing for more than a year, perpetuate stereotypes about new people, hate others who dare to play the same course, and lie about picking up trash."

 

[DSmith]

Ok, had a chance to mull this topic over and got to go enjoy Memorial Day up at Idlewild and Banklick.

To answer a point brought up about calling the cops;
I don't have a huge issue with drinking and smoking on the course but, If you are doing so and throwing your trash all over and or smashing up stuff, breaking trees etc. then I do believe you should have the cops called on you and they should bust you for P.I. Vandalism and Littering. One of the reasons that it's against the law to drink and smoke on park property is because of the high probability that this will lead to "public nuisance" behavior.

Once again it's a Joe Public issue in which if they see that we, disc golfers, can care less about what other disc golfers do at the park, then why allow us to keep the course. Joe Public votes and attends city counsel meetings etc.
Do we?
Like I said when you sell a course to the city on the grounds that it'll stem this bad behavior, yet when it goes in it only makes it worse, it doesn't make us look too good.






Anyway, here's another observation on littering.
I do major course prep before our tournaments. One of which is picking up all of the trash on the course the day before and a walk through right before. What boggles my mind is that no less than an hour after the tournament is over and the casual players hit the course again, does the trash reappear.
It's almost like they are thinking "Wow! Look how great the course looks (chucks beer bottle in the middle of the fairway). :wall:

Ah well what can you do though right?

I use to think it was the sight of trash that made it ok in their mind that that's where trash goes. But like others have said I think its just bad habits.

and finally I'll say that I don't pick up other peoples trash all the time. Does this make me a bad person? I just believe that we need to hit the problem at the source rather than at the outcome. I do educate new players, run leagues, tournaments etc. So I am working on it at the base level.

Are you guys?

You want to sit here and argue over semantics and how we are preaching to the choir and all but are you guys actually willing to take action and turn this around?

 

[jasonc]

Gee ... you sound like a joy to play a round with ...

The stereotype gathered from this board is more like "Folks who play disc golf like to lord over others if they've been playing for more than a year, perpetuate stereotypes about new people, hate others who dare to play the same course, and lie about picking up trash."

I'm sorry, but I believe you are missing the point of this thread.

If and/or when chuckers stop littering, vandalizing, and destroying property that does not belong to them on the disc golf courses, this type of discussion will also cease to exist.

New people AKA n00bs are not the problem. This has already been stated several times in this thread. Please read the entire thread before jumping to conclusions with your stereotype statements.

Think about what you just posted for just a minute. Now answer the following questions:

1) When you were younger, did you learn to wipe your crack on your own or did someone teach you how to do it?

2) Are you going to learn how to play disc golf on your own or do you want someone to teach you how to do it?

You certainly do not need to go to college for 4 years to learn how to perform either activity properly. However, a little guidance from someone with experience goes a long way.

 

[kzoomofo13]

I would rather they make one of the local courses a pay to play it would really keep out the "chuckers" out and make the course a place i actually want to play instead of traveling out of town. I hate chuckers to the fullest, i have no problem yelling at them when i see it happen. I even bring a trash bag with me to tornys, the ppl in my groups see what im doing and start to help. by the end of first round its full and i pull out another one for the second round. even if courses charges $2 I tink it would bring the Chuckers numbers down and make the course a better place.

 

[Mind Expansi0n]

My point was this: when you act like an elitist (and claim that 3/4's of all other players are scumbags) - you perpetuate a stereotype. I actually haven't "had such a bad time on this message board" (interesting angle you threw in there). Playing a round with a guy doesn't make him a saint - particularly when he just told us 75% of other players are scum.

Uh...ok. Personal attack much? I haven't actually played a round with superberry, but we've met briefly, and I've seen first hand the amazing work he does at his home course, and I can assure you he would be a joy to play a round with.

I'm sorry you've had such a bad time on this message board - I'd say there's a lot of varying opinions, but I don't think I've ever seen anybody actively discouraging other members from playing. IRL, I have had run-ins with local "pro's" (old guys carting around 200 discs and a case of beers...each) where I felt like I you've described, but they're vastly in the minority, just like I'd think anybody on this board being condecending to new players would be.

It IS all about stereotypes though, and maybe the 75% number is skewed high...but at the end of the day, someone is still going around trashing our courses and I think this topic is perfectly warranted to get us talking about it and hopefully fixing it.

 

[Mind Expansi0n]

If that "experienced person" is telling me 3/4's of all other players are "scumbags" ... I know I'm playing with the lonely loser of DG, and I'll probably laugh and move on like most others clearly have. :thmbup:

I'm sorry, but I believe you are missing the point of this thread.

If and/or when chuckers stop littering, vandalizing, and destroying property that does not belong to them on the disc golf courses, this type of discussion will also cease to exist.

New people AKA n00bs are not the problem. This has already been stated several times in this thread. Please read the entire thread before jumping to conclusions with your stereotype statements.

Think about what you just posted for just a minute. Now answer the following questions:

1) When you were younger, did you learn to wipe your crack on your own or did someone teach you how to do it?

2) Are you going to learn how to play disc golf on your own or do you want someone to teach you how to do it?

You certainly do not need to go to college for 4 years to learn how to perform either activity properly. However, a little guidance from someone with experience goes a long way.

 

[scarpfish]

I don't profess to know where the litter on my home course comes from. All I know is that it doesn't get there by itself, or get back to the dumpster by itself, so I bought some trash bags at Dollar General a few months ago and commit to cleaning up the course during a "trash round" about once a month. Its cheap and easy to complain and bitch about littering, but its quite another to go out and do something about it. Adds about 30-60 minutes to my round, but it sure as hell beats the alternative.

That being said, along a few holes of the home course is a fence which boundaries the shoulder of a four lane highway. Occasionally, I've had to go over that fence to retrieve a disc. One thing that I can definitely conclude is even at the most littered condition I've ever seen it, the disc golf course is saintly clean compared to that highway shoulder.

 

[thrembo]

Sometimes if my kids are with me, and don't want to play I pay them to pick up cans and bottles. It gives them a little pocket money, and hopefuly instills in them what a county park can and should look like.

 

[jasonc]

If that "experienced person" is telling me 3/4's of all other players are "scumbags" ... I know I'm playing with the lonely loser of DG, and I'll probably laugh and move on like most others clearly have. :thmbup:

It may be a good idea to keep in mind the fact that he is speaking from his Point of View only.

Maybe the percentage is different in your neck of the woods, but there is a very good chance that a number of chuckers do exist in most places where there is a disc golf course.

For ANY person that is able to walk and throw plastic, there should be no reason whatsoever for that person to also include littering, vandalism, or destruction of disc golf course property while at a park. How could you argue against that?

You should certainly keep laughing and move on...assuming that you do not vandalize the courses along the way.

 

[superberry]

My point was this: when you act like an elitist (and claim that 3/4's of all other players are scumbags) - you perpetuate a stereotype. I actually haven't "had such a bad time on this message board" (interesting angle you threw in there). Playing a round with a guy doesn't make him a saint - particularly when he just told us 75% of other players are scum.

I see, you're upset that I said 75% of the players out there were chuckers. Who cares about the actual percentage? My point is that I firmly believe there are more chuckers out there and they are the majority of players. My experiences, number of courses played, and types of courses played backs it up. As everyone else had said the percentage varies by the location, but the problem is simply that there is a percentage anywhere! Places like Highbridge Hills, Aspen Mountain, Winter Park (Kewaunee or Colorado) are all amazing courses and I still see litter, vandalism, graffiti, etc at every single course I go to. I admit all the exceptions are possible - just dumb kids (non-players)hanging out tagging things or breaking things, litter blowing in from elsewhere, hell even storm damage - but there is still a problem on our courses (and yes society in general). I think it is very foolish of you so just not except that there is a problem, even if it's a small problem. Is a beautiful, peaceful, scenic course that is litter, graffiti, and vandalism free something that you have no interest in?? I'd like to think not. So if I have come across, due to some percentages stated in an effort to prove a point, as an elitist, it's not my intention. If my desire to keep garbage off the courses, both the physical and human kind, is elitist, then I'll go ahead and stand on that pedestal and preach. Believe me, there is no glass house, so go ahead and cast stones.

 

[Skunk]

Sometimes if my kids are with me, and don't want to play I pay them to pick up cans and bottles. It gives them a little pocket money, and hopefuly instills in them what a county park can and should look like.

Hmm, I wonder what the child labor laws are like in Florida?

My kids don't want to play out on the course...only in the back yard for some reason.

 

[jhgonzo]

One depressing fact about the chuckers is that a lot of them aren't very receptive to even friendly/polite reminders of their douchebaggery, so if I'm out throwing my usual solo round and I see a group like this, no matter how much I'd love to say something, in most cases you can tell--yeah, those guys will just laugh me off if I tell them not to litter, or worse they'll want to start a fight. 'Cause kicking someone's ass gives them TWO stories to bring home from the course ("I drew an awesome penis on the events board, and then some guy told me not to litter so I kicked his ass! Yearrgh! High five!" *cracks Keystone Light*). As bad and incorrect as stereotypical thinking is, the chuckers are quite obvious even from a distance...they have a certain smell about them, too.

 

[Skunk]

...they have a certain smell about them, too.

This is true. I can smell them when they are at least 5 holes away!

 

[superberry]

...and hear them from even further away!

 

[Mind Expansi0n]

Where did I say that I supported littering? I did say that I don't support elitists who call other players scumbags. :thmbup:

It may be a good idea to keep in mind the fact that he is speaking from his Point of View only.

Maybe the percentage is different in your neck of the woods, but there is a very good chance that a number of chuckers do exist in most places where there is a disc golf course.

For ANY person that is able to walk and throw plastic, there should be no reason whatsoever for that person to also include littering, vandalism, or destruction of disc golf course property while at a park. How could you argue against that?

You should certainly keep laughing and move on...assuming that you do not vandalize the courses along the way.

 

[superberry]

I just call scumbags, scumbags. Just because someone plays disc golf, doesn't necessarily make them a 'player', and doesn't disqualify them from being a scumbag. It's my opinion that of the entire population of disc golfers out there, the majority have a problem with littering, tagging, vandalism, etc. It's a negative perception based on recent events and an overall negativity on my part. The fact that anyone who chooses to play disc golf and then do these things is a problem, be it 75% or 1% of those 'players' on the course.

 

[Scarps]

best show ever

 

[Scarps]

i think that a generally free sport is going to attract all kinds of people.whether it be avid golfers,young and old couples,or the "chuckers". i feel the best option is to continually set examples on the course of how things do and should work.personally i think its its an obligation at the courses i frequent.i hate picking up trash and getting thrown on by a group of college kids but lets face it its going to happen,its up to us how we handle it out there.as far as parks closing due to this type of problem,that sucks.i am currently in the process convincing my park to put a couple trash cans out there and a posted rules/courtesy list on the first tee.hopefully this will turn around whats beginning to happen to one of my favorite courses already(opened 2010).

 

[Matthew boals]

What I've noticed about trash on a course is the following. First,if the trash can is a 55 gallon drum,with no lid, little woodland animals and the wind will be a factor of trash outside the trash can. Second,if there are no trash cans,on or near the course, but a road is near, a great majority of the trash comes from people throwing their trash out of the car. Third, if no road by the park, but there are houses the day after trash pick up is the worst day for trash flying around. I believe because people DON'T actually Put extra trash into the trash BAGS that are in the trash CANS. Just my .02 you CAN tell when a DG'er left trash, it's usually between the tee and pole hole. And also only water bottles, sport drinks,and yes, beer cans. I've never seen a DG'er eat Fast food while playing. So, out of ALL the trash I pick-up I'd say 1/4 to 1/3 of it comes from DB DG'ers. IMHO