[Vs.] The Innova vs Discmania Beef

[Deuzzz]

I would argue the split between the two mentioned didn't go that well. 22 of November 2 new Innova molds got approved.

The Fairway Disc and the Xero. A FD copy (it even has it on its name) and a P2 copy (that has been already copied a ton of times alpaca/firefly).

I am eager to see how well the FD will sell as now we will have the Innova original FD and the Discmania's remade FD. Which one would you buy?

https://www.pdga.com/technical-standards/equipment-certification/discs?title=&field_disc_class_value=All&manufacturer=270681

 

[seedlings]

I would argue the split between the two mentioned didn't go that well. 22 of November 2 new Innova molds got approved.

The Fairway Disc and the Xero. A FD copy (it even has it on its name) and a P2 copy (that has been already copied a ton of times alpaca/firefly).

I am eager to see how well the FD will sell as now we will have the Innova original FD and the Discmania's remade FD. Which one would you buy?

https://www.pdga.com/technical-standards/equipment-certification/discs?title=&field_disc_class_value=All&manufacturer=270681

No one copies bad molds. I will throw either or both. Of the two, Discmania has at least come out with good words about Innova.

 

[Neil_Rankin]

I would argue the split between the two mentioned didn't go that well. 22 of November 2 new Innova molds got approved.

The Fairway Disc and the Xero. A FD copy (it even has it on its name) and a P2 copy (that has been already copied a ton of times alpaca/firefly).

I am eager to see how well the FD will sell as now we will have the Innova original FD and the Discmania's remade FD. Which one would you buy?

https://www.pdga.com/technical-standards/equipment-certification/discs?title=&field_disc_class_value=All&manufacturer=270681

It's not beef it's just business. Each respective company is doing what is in their own financial interests. It has to be that way. Is Innova supposed to say, "Oh well yeah man you guys are cool so we won't sell the disc that we designed, that we own, just so that you can profit from the name that you attached to it. And it's totally cool that you guys are now a direct competitor producing other discs with other companies." And what is Discmania going to do? "Oh yeah man I totally appreciate you contracting with us to design and manufacture a disc that we branded and marketed. We totally won't reverse engineer the design and profit from all of our hard marketing work."

Both companies are acting rationally and in their own self-interests. They're no more having beef than any other market competitors.

 

[Flick Maniac]

Fairway disc lol

Ran out of animals, huh? Last time your buddy wanted to name animal discs you freaked out.

I jest, i jest.

 

[discerdoo]

I'll buy FDs from Innova when they run them in color glow plastic, PDs too. I'll also see what DM comes up with for those molds.

 

[twistedraven]

Shoulda called it Favorite Disc.

 

[ian.w]

People will buy the innova versions because they will be 1000x easier to find and actually buy for retail prices.

 

[runningDoc]

Fairway Disc :clap: lol

maybe the new innova PD will be the.... Power Disc ? lol

either way the innova molded P2, FD, PD, PD2 are great discs that need to be continued.

if the new molds made by new discmania are good then kudos on discmania too.

hopefully this is a situation where both benefit from the breakup. if so who wins? we all do more great discs for everyone.

 

[Deuzzz]

It's not beef it's just business. Each respective company is doing what is in their own financial interests. It has to be that way. Is Innova supposed to say, "Oh well yeah man you guys are cool so we won't sell the disc that we designed, that we own, just so that you can profit from the name that you attached to it. And it's totally cool that you guys are now a direct competitor producing other discs with other companies." And what is Discmania going to do? "Oh yeah man I totally appreciate you contracting with us to design and manufacture a disc that we branded and marketed. We totally won't reverse engineer the design and profit from all of our hard marketing work."



Both companies are acting rationally and in their own self-interests. They're no more having beef than any other market competitors.

Well I can always argue with the marketing video Jussi made about the P2 referencing to the alpaca and omega4. Then innova marketed the firefly with a text "Nate wanted more p2's so we made these" and now making a disc with the FD mold and copying its name in a way too.

I'm not saying that the choices that have been made aren't obvious for business BUT the way they are currently doing it has a smell of beef in it.

It's totally understandable that innova re-uses the molds as they are awesome discs and Jussi reverse engineers his discs. Also, if you think back how much Innova was suppressing the DM productions (favoring infinite, millenium and their own line) its no surprise that the breakup didn't end clean. Probably Innova felt threatened and tried their best to keep them at bay...but who knows this is pure speculation.

 

[wims]

"Fairway Disc" okay lol

 

[aphilso1]

Is the Innova Fairway Driver literally the same mold as the original Discmania FD? I ask because there are quite a few differences in the specs per the PDGA approvals. Not sure how much of that can be attributed to variance in plastic cooling, imprecise hand measurements, etc.

Fairway Disc from Innova Champion Discs
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.6cm
Rim Depth: 1.2cm
Rim Thickness: 1.8cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.5cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.7%
Rim Configuration: 35.75
Flexibility: 11.48kg

FD (Jackal, Fairway Driver) from Discmania
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.8cm
Rim Depth: 1.1cm
Rim Thickness: 1.8cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.5cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.2%
Rim Configuration: 34.75
Flexibility: 9.53kg

FD (new) from Discmania
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.4cm
Rim Depth: 1.1cm
Rim Thickness: 1.7cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.7cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.2%
Rim Configuration: 39.00
Flexibility: 9.89kg

 

[autocrosscrx]

I was all like, "Never heard of the Discmania Beef. What a terrible name!"

 

[jmdaire27]

I'm sure if the name "Fairway Disc" sticks, there might be a new (well, not new thanks to DM and Prodigy) naming convention coming that they will market. Maybe an easy to throw scheme with a fairway, midrange, putter "disc." Or maybe they are just out of ideas.

And molds have been copied, reused, recycled, etc, forever. I'm sure it just seems like there is beef because innova wasn't really helping DM out in the end. Too busy making Infinite molds…. Maybe the partnership between DM and Lat64 made Innova jealous? Idk, and, really, idc. I have been digging the Enigma, so there's that.

 

[seedlings]

Is the Innova Fairway Driver literally the same mold as the original Discmania FD? I ask because there are quite a few differences in the specs per the PDGA approvals. Not sure how much of that can be attributed to variance in plastic cooling, imprecise hand measurements, etc.

Fairway Disc from Innova Champion Discs
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.6cm
Rim Depth: 1.2cm
Rim Thickness: 1.8cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.5cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.7%
Rim Configuration: 35.75
Flexibility: 11.48kg

FD (Jackal, Fairway Driver) from Discmania
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.8cm
Rim Depth: 1.1cm
Rim Thickness: 1.8cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.5cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.2%
Rim Configuration: 34.75
Flexibility: 9.53kg

FD (new) from Discmania
Max Weight: 176.0gr
Diameter: 21.2cm
Height: 1.4cm
Rim Depth: 1.1cm
Rim Thickness: 1.7cm
Inside Rim Diameter: 17.7cm
Rim Depth / Diameter Ratio: 5.2%
Rim Configuration: 39.00
Flexibility: 9.89kg

I bet those are all variance within ONE RUN of just about any disc. That could fly like anything from a Teebird, Eagle to an an FD, to a Leopard3, or an Essence.

Edit: would be interesting if PDGA ever adds a tolerance % to the measurements, to determine when one mold is.. a different mold.

 

[chevis]

I was all like, "Never heard of the Discmania Beef. What a terrible name!"

i'd throw it... well, if it was made by innova

 

[BogeyNoMore]

I was all like, "Never heard of the Discmania Beef. What a terrible name!"

I dunno. People use the term "beefy" to describe a disc that's pretty OS, and I describe my Drone as "pure beef."

So Beef would probs be a good name for a super overstable wind fighter.


Then again... might not appeal to vegetarians/vegans. :\

 

[BillFleming]

Wendy's should support a disc....like Arby's does every now and then.

Wendy's logo on a disc with the words "Where's the beef?".

 

[seedlings]

Wendy's should support a disc....like Arby's does every now and then.

Wendy's logo on a disc with the words "Where's the beef?".

Turns out I have a beef disc. It's a cousin to new Discmania

 

[dehaas]

Not sure if it's necessarily beef on Innova's end, or if they're just wanting it to be crystal clear that this disc is the FD mold so it sells, as opposed to giving it some generic animal name and it getting lost among leopards, teebirds, and eagles.

Sure the name sounds super generic and silly, but if it truly is the FD they are sure getting the point across.

Xero is weird…because Latitude has zero plastic already. Xero is also also one letter short of xerox…who is a copy company obviously…so P2? I would've preferred Putter Too…

Did we ever determine what the Innova Tech is?

 

[wims]

I thought Innova Tech was supposed to be the P2
EDIT: The IT has an 18mm rim, I suppose it's not the P2