150g vs 130g

[BillFleming]

Thanks for sharing. Last I tried, I still couldn't throw mid ranges or putters with a power grip. I fan grip putters, with my Watt and/or Dart getting out to maybe 125-150' max. Form still sucks, but improving - hoping eventually it gets good enough I can throw them, but not holding my breath. What changes did you make to add 50' with your 5 speeds? Probably a change I will also need - one of many.

I use a modified fan grip. Learned this from a Paul Ulibarri video. Take the disc in your off hand, hold it in front of you vertically with the top facing you. With your throwing hand, pinch the disc between your pointer finger and thumb (the pointer should be off the rim). Let go of the disc with your off hand. Now add the other fingers (my 2nd and 3rd fingers point slightly backwards, little finger on the rim), but not tightly. Hold the disc out in front of you on the line you intend to throw. Press down with the thumb, slightly indenting the top of the disc.....I found this important....the pressure should come from the thumb, not the pointer finger. Make sure the wrist is straight to slightly bent inward. It should also be pointed slightly down. That is the position the wrist and disc need to be in upon release.

My biggest issue was making sure I followed through. I take a long x step stride, if I don't start from off the tee pad I run out of space and "abort" my walkup....which causes my weight to be all on my front leg and stops me from following through. Follow through and HOLD the follow through. Lastly, whether you walk-up or run-up....the timing of your legs, body, and throw all have to match. I can't do a run-up....if I do, I have no clue where the disc will go when it leaves my hand. For me there is a fine line of how fast I can do my walk up before things go bad.

I find that if I 'overthrow' the disc (either walk up too fast, or "pull" the disc through too fast), I actually lose distance. Finding that sweet spot of how fast to move the body and how fast to move the disc took me a bunch of field work with one disc (I used my Axiom Hex 5/5/-1/1). The hardest parts for me are making sure I go the right speed in my walk up (I want to go faster) and pulling the disc through at the proper speed. (Faster is further - right? Nope). I find the 'sweet' spot in the pull is if the disc moves slowly until it is in front of my chest and then speed up from there (but the speed up of the disc can't be too great of a difference...just a bit faster). Lag at the beginning and have a 'hit' in the middle.

Also, if you can film yourself from the back....watch your body during the walk/run up. My instructor told (and showed me on a video) that I start slightly bent over (in a hyzer throw position), but end up straight to slightly bent backwards (anhyzer throw position). Paying more attention to that has improved my accuracy.

Commit to using just 5 speeds and less and limit your molds. Let's say you have three 5 speeds, but one is overstable, one is neutral, and one is understable. They all need different types of throws. If thrown the same, they will fly differently so it can be difficult to work on consistency and form when you are using discs that don't fly the same. I played for a month with just three putters (one was a putt/approach for tee shots). I didn't care about the distance I was getting.....all I cared about was focusing on form. After a while, I realized my distance was increasing. I went to a field and did some measured throws and found that I was throwing further, so I added my 5 speeds into the mix with the same plan. Forget about how far they were going, just work on form and hitting my planned lines.

My 'control' holes have mandos. One is a double mando, the other a triple mando. If my form is correct, I make the mandos. If anything is off, I miss the mandos. When I am just playing for fun and on my own, if I miss the mando I rethink the shot and why I missed....then I rethrow correcting my mistake...that helps the muscle memory and just enforces the right way to make the throw.

 

[lee76007]

By the numbers, Orbital should be less stable than the Wave? Wave is -2/2, so slightly under stable to almost neutral? Orbital is -4.5/1, so it should be very under stable? For comparison, Mamba is -5/1, and I think it is one of the most under stable discs made by any manufacturer? I have thrown Mambas and Waves, but never threw an Orbital. I am just going off the flight numbers.

My comparison on stability was strictly between the mamba and orbital. but the orbital can out distance my wave I depend on the stability of the wave for more narrow Fairways such as a moderately wooded course for downwind. however last year's x-step I could turn the wave with more stability than a Mamba but more distance with a mamba and not really knowing where it was going to go with consistency. regardless what I can do with a disc and what you can do with a disc is going to be totally different, regardless of flight numbers, and that's with anybody.
I agree with ru4por people are too focused on distance. because the majority of my courses are wooded, I'm focused on course strategy. This morning I was x-stepping 6 and 7 speeds not concerned about distance, but more concerned about staying under canopy.

 

[ChrisinFL]

I use a modified fan grip. Learned this from a Paul Ulibarri video. Take the disc in your off hand, hold it in front of you vertically with the top facing you. With your throwing hand, pinch the disc between your pointer finger and thumb (the pointer should be off the rim). Let go of the disc with your off hand. Now add the other fingers (my 2nd and 3rd fingers point slightly backwards, little finger on the rim), but not tightly. Hold the disc out in front of you on the line you intend to throw. Press down with the thumb, slightly indenting the top of the disc.....I found this important....the pressure should come from the thumb, not the pointer finger. Make sure the wrist is straight to slightly bent inward. It should also be pointed slightly down. That is the position the wrist and disc need to be in upon release.

My biggest issue was making sure I followed through. I take a long x step stride, if I don't start from off the tee pad I run out of space and "abort" my walkup....which causes my weight to be all on my front leg and stops me from following through. Follow through and HOLD the follow through. Lastly, whether you walk-up or run-up....the timing of your legs, body, and throw all have to match. I can't do a run-up....if I do, I have no clue where the disc will go when it leaves my hand. For me there is a fine line of how fast I can do my walk up before things go bad.

I find that if I 'overthrow' the disc (either walk up too fast, or "pull" the disc through too fast), I actually lose distance. Finding that sweet spot of how fast to move the body and how fast to move the disc took me a bunch of field work with one disc (I used my Axiom Hex 5/5/-1/1). The hardest parts for me are making sure I go the right speed in my walk up (I want to go faster) and pulling the disc through at the proper speed. (Faster is further - right? Nope). I find the 'sweet' spot in the pull is if the disc moves slowly until it is in front of my chest and then speed up from there (but the speed up of the disc can't be too great of a difference...just a bit faster). Lag at the beginning and have a 'hit' in the middle.

Also, if you can film yourself from the back....watch your body during the walk/run up. My instructor told (and showed me on a video) that I start slightly bent over (in a hyzer throw position), but end up straight to slightly bent backwards (anhyzer throw position). Paying more attention to that has improved my accuracy.

Commit to using just 5 speeds and less and limit your molds. Let's say you have three 5 speeds, but one is overstable, one is neutral, and one is understable. They all need different types of throws. If thrown the same, they will fly differently so it can be difficult to work on consistency and form when you are using discs that don't fly the same. I played for a month with just three putters (one was a putt/approach for tee shots). I didn't care about the distance I was getting.....all I cared about was focusing on form. After a while, I realized my distance was increasing. I went to a field and did some measured throws and found that I was throwing further, so I added my 5 speeds into the mix with the same plan. Forget about how far they were going, just work on form and hitting my planned lines.

My 'control' holes have mandos. One is a double mando, the other a triple mando. If my form is correct, I make the mandos. If anything is off, I miss the mandos. When I am just playing for fun and on my own, if I miss the mando I rethink the shot and why I missed....then I rethrow correcting my mistake...that helps the muscle memory and just enforces the right way to make the throw.

Thanks! I am doing or working on some of what you mention, but I have heard/read a few times about a couple things you mentioned where I know I need work. That throw speed, where it starts slow, gains speed at the right time, towards the middle or end of the throw - I got to work on that. Also, just the overall timing - not so much what to do, but when, and at what speed. I am making progress, but lots of work still ahead. I am improving, but I also still need more consistency at getting a flat release. Played an amazing nine holes with a friend tonight. I play best of two discs most of the time - only the normal one disc method now and then when somebody I play with wants to. My regular course, 1 disc, nine holes, my prior best round was 3 over par. Tonight, first round, nine holes - PAR!!! To be fair, it is the easiest course in town - beginner friendly, only 9 holes, and I play there often, plus, we played a second round, hurrying before dark, and that round I was 3 over on just 7 holes when we quit on account of dark… But, still, I did one round, 9 holes, of par golf! 2-3 months ago we were struggling to get to par throwing 2 discs each shot, and playing from the best one. Also, that was my best round, and I don't expect to repeat it any time soon, but I played great, it felt great, and it sure was progress!

 

[BillFleming]

One other suggestion I have for distance. Don't forget that gravity exists. I have to keep reminding myself of that. For example: when my form is on, I can throw my Axiom Hex (5/5/-1/1) 250 feet. Now imagine being on a tee pad and the basket is straight ahead 250 feet from the tee pad. I should be able to park that basket without any trouble. But....here is where gravity comes in. If I aim slightly right of the basket (to account for the slight fade I know I get with the Hex) and throw level to the ground (about 5 foot of the ground), my disc will fall short because gravity pulls it down. I have to imagine a one storey house behind the basket with the basket at the front door. Then I aim to throw the disc on the roof to the right of the door. That height at 250 feet will get my disc parked or, if all goes well, even slightly past the basket. For a farther basket, I might have to envision a two storey building and throw it through a second storey window. Go to a field and practice this. Measure out 250 feet and put a marker of some kind there (cone, disc, whatever). Now make throws adjusting the height you throw at. See where the disc lands and what distance you are getting at each height. There will be a height that will be too much and the disc loses distance due to gravity and the wind/air getting under the flight plate too much and knocking it down.

 

[ChrisinFL]

One other suggestion I have for distance. Don't forget that gravity exists. I have to keep reminding myself of that. For example: when my form is on, I can throw my Axiom Hex (5/5/-1/1) 250 feet. Now imagine being on a tee pad and the basket is straight ahead 250 feet from the tee pad. I should be able to park that basket without any trouble. But....here is where gravity comes in. If I aim slightly right of the basket (to account for the slight fade I know I get with the Hex) and throw level to the ground (about 5 foot of the ground), my disc will fall short because gravity pulls it down. I have to imagine a one storey house behind the basket with the basket at the front door. Then I aim to throw the disc on the roof to the right of the door. That height at 250 feet will get my disc parked or, if all goes well, even slightly past the basket. For a farther basket, I might have to envision a two storey building and throw it through a second storey window. Go to a field and practice this. Measure out 250 feet and put a marker of some kind there (cone, disc, whatever). Now make throws adjusting the height you throw at. See where the disc lands and what distance you are getting at each height. There will be a height that will be too much and the disc loses distance due to gravity and the wind/air getting under the flight plate too much and knocking it down.

Hmmm…. So far, I have definitely got my best distance keeping my throws fairly flat. I suspect that would be because any height I got was probably from nose up (bad). Guessing what you are referring to would be getting my throw slightly up (arm/disc), but with nose down? I suspect that is something for me to work on in the near future - but I have made a few changes in the past month and week, and I would probably be best served trying to cement this form progress a bit more before trying to change something else? I recently fixed throwing before or as I plant, so now I try to focus on planting before I start my throw. I also adjusted my x-step, so my final step is to a wider stance, both allowing me to get a better body turn and reach back, and fixing my issue where my final step, ending with a stance very perpendicular to the basket, was causing me to turn my hips too soon (as I stepped), so I was not transferring any hip twitch power to my throw at all. These two changes added about 20' each to my distance. Also, while focusing on those two changes so I keep doing them, I am wanting to work on getting my arm to start slower, lag behind my hips and shoulders, stay loose, so I can get a whip effect, accelerating later in the throw, instead of strong arming the disc. Pretty sure I was strong arming almost completely, and those two changes helped add some distance/speed from my body, but I still have work to do, to stop throwing with my arm, and let my body turn my arm into the whip. Does it seem like I am on the right track here? Feels like I have fixed some things, and my max distance went from 225', to 245', to 265', and gradually at each new max, it seems to start as one rare throw, then happens a little more, and hopefully soon 265' is my new normal. Hopefully! Oh, and I forgot, just in my last two sessions, something I have went back and forth on in the past: it seems like adding a wrist flick at the end of my throws has given me an added benefit of helping to bring my disc out flat/level more consistently - fewer accidental hyzers. Does that make sense at all??? Or is it just coincidence, and more practice with the form changes is making me better? Seriously, with form fixes, this is like trying to drink from a fire hydrant!!! Too many things I want to fix all at once, any one of which can really mess with my form/throw by itself, and require time to get used to, to not feel like it is day one again, with a brand new throw/form! But, at least I can't say it's boring!!! "How hard can it be? You just throw the frisbee towards the hole a few times!". Lol - yeah right!

 

[Ilkka_Sinisalo]

Of course everyone should be looking at form.
Of course everyone wants more D.

But this thread alone shows the variety in individual molds, runs, plastic and weight.

Finding a distance driver for your current arm speed - still gives you 30 feet. For all of us at 260-275 - that gets us to 300 and brings some holes into birdie range - plain and simple.

Going out to look for distance or throwing anny flexes with speed 13s is still form practice. Especially with a disc that fits your arm speed.

I'm a 7,8,9 speed guy but if you think learning a tailwind open field bomber line with a mamba or a blizz katana doesn't improve scoring - I have the cards to show folks. It helps on the right holes.

Last thought. There's nothing wrong with all of the above, working on Form, throws, angles, accuracy AND distance.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

"Don't forget that gravity exists"

One thing about lighter discs is that they can be accelerated to a more full flight with less power, the downside is that they decelerate faster.

If im throwing a steep uphill I will use something lighter and less stable (160 fizz rhythm). If im going steep downhill I will go heavy. (172 N rhythm or a 180 uplink)

I can get just as much distance out of my heavy 180g uplink mid on a steep downhill as any of my fairways. It will shape a fairly straight line and it kind of accelerates for the first portion of the throw and as it loses spin it doesn't fade as quickly or harshly as a driver.
Point is Gravity can help you.

 

[ChrisinFL]

Of course everyone should be looking at form.
Of course everyone wants more D.

But this thread alone shows the variety in individual molds, runs, plastic and weight.

Finding a distance driver for your current arm speed - still gives you 30 feet. For all of us at 260-275 - that gets us to 300 and brings some holes into birdie range - plain and simple.

Going out to look for distance or throwing anny flexes with speed 13s is still form practice. Especially with a disc that fits your arm speed.

I'm a 7,8,9 speed guy but if you think learning a tailwind open field bomber line with a mamba or a blizz katana doesn't improve scoring - I have the cards to show folks. It helps on the right holes.

Last thought. There's nothing wrong with all of the above, working on Form, throws, angles, accuracy AND distance.

Pretty sure I do that more than most would recommend. 4-5 months playing, over 100 discs already, and my best DDs right now are 148-150g Fission Waves (2) and Pro Terns (4-5). I have other light weight DDs, mainly ones recommended for beginners (from memory: Katana, Thrasher, 2 Beasts, Valkyrie, 4-5 Mambas, Shryke, Corvette, Sapphire, and 137-139g Star Terns), but my 148-150g Waves and Pro Terns work best for me, at least for now. Experienced players here say don't buy distance, work on your form. Well, I confess, I am doing both!

 

[Joecuzzi]

The best annys in distance competitions are thrown on a hyzer release lol. I would like to add that there is something satisfying about throwing a lightweight Flippy destroyer into a head wind as long as you have the right release angle. I had a blazing headwind on a hole where the basket is to the right but you gotta throw to the left because there is a line of trees from the teepad to the basket, so I threw Flippy 150g destroyer on a very steep hyzer angle to the far left side of the fairway and the disc flew a perfect anny line after flipping and went about 45ft pass the 275ft basket. Other golfers were looking at me like that's the line and how is that possible lol. I'm not saying to do that in a tournament but sometimes you just wanna have fun throwing Frisbee Discs

 

[wims]

I also went down the light disc rabbit hole when I was developing my technique. In the end I concluded that the (very marginal / non existent) distance gains I got from a lighter, but faster disc was not worth it. My accuracy and consistency is significantly worse with a wide rimmed disc, it's also really bad when I'm mixing light and heavy discs. Heavy discs release early, light discs grip lock badly.

After I learned this my scores improved dramatically. For my slow arm (about 300ft these days) a Leopard3 at 170-175g is pretty much the best distance driver. Perhaps 1 out of 10 shots with a Mamba gives me better distance, but most of the time it doesn't, in fact, it just ends up way left my intended landing spot due to me not being able to throw the disc at the speed it was designed for.

So instead of chasing these low weights I would recommend you to instead chase slow speed, medium weight discs. Your scores will for sure improve. Another added bonus is that heavier discs tends to hold their stability (much) longer than very light weight discs. They are just more consistent across the board, be it stability, predictability and durability

 

[Joecuzzi]

Being able to throw lightweight fairways with control is really good form practice too. 150g eagle L is one of the straightest disc once you learn to control it... besides a luster JLS(just long&str8)