[Axiom] Axiom Envy

[wolfmandragon]

wow, really? I haven't thrown Eclipse yet. I like the idea of more turn and more fade though.

I will give this caveat, I do throw with less speed and more spin.. so ymmv.

I think of an Neutron Envy having a hybrid Wasp/Polecat flight, a Electron Envy having a beat in Wasp/Polecat flight and the Eclipse Envy having a Roc/Polecat flight.

I don't know if that makes any sense or not.

 

[aphilso1]

I feel like the Eclipse molds up a little deeper than the other plastics. Just a touch slower/glidier. It throws a bit more like a traditional putter, and stays straight maybe a tad longer than a Neutron, but I still definitely got a 0 turn unless I was throwing it hard into a headwind. Eclipse actually was my stable driving putter of choice until I lost it.

On a somewhat related note, I have terrible luck with losing Envies. Lost two in 2019 alone. Seems like they all take a bad tree kick off a cliff, or get lost in waist-high grass inside the circle, or other similar horror stories. And every time I think "how in the world do you lose a putter???.

 

[aphilso1]

Again, the only Envy I've thrown that had noticeable turn was a max weight Neutron Soft. All the others are a true 0 turn out of the box, with Electrons beating in relatively quickly while the other plastics are all practically Teflon. I'm actually bagging a fresh Electron right now for grip reasons due to the snow. It's definitely a 0 turn/strong fade throwing putter.

 

[wolfmandragon]

It had been a few months since I had thrown my Eclipse Envy, so I took it out for a bit of field work here at lunch.

The mixture of slick and somewhat flexible plastic reminded me real quick like why it is in my glow bag instead of my regular bag. I normally throw with 0 OAT, but flexible plastics come out of my hand all wobbly on backhands. That very well might be why I am seeing turn on it. It still had a bit of turn on the flick as well though.

It also reminded me why I no longer buy MVP in anything other than Cosmic Electron Firm and Plasma and why so many of my molds have switched to Discraft. I hate flexible plastic.

 

[aphilso1]

I normally throw with 0 OAT, but flexible plastics come out of my hand all wobbly on backhands.

I don't have this problem with the Eclipse plastic, but this could be why I turnover my Neutron Soft Envy. It might just come out of my hand with torque due to the floppiness of the plastic. That's an interesting thought. Regardless of the reason, I don't like the flight that I personally get from the N Soft.

 

[discerdoo]

I don't have this problem with the Eclipse plastic, but this could be why I turnover my Neutron Soft Envy. It might just come out of my hand with torque due to the floppiness of the plastic. That's an interesting thought. Regardless of the reason, I don't like the flight that I personally get from the N Soft.

I'm loving the grip and firmness of my Eclipse. Gonna get a backup or two 165ish. I dig the lighter weight and nice stability, great thrower for me.

 

[aphilso1]

Losing my Eclipse Envy has actually made me rethink whether I want to carry an Envy in the bag (blasphemy, I know). Electrons are only a temporary solution since they beat in quick and I don't like N Softs, so I either need to restock Eclipses/Protons/Neutrons or move on from the mold.
I'm probably going to try to move on, since I find I'm more accurate inside 225' when using a slower traditional putter rather than Envy/Proxy. 225'-250' is where gyro putters really shine for me, but I can muscle up on a Judge or smooth out a mid to cover that range. And that's a distance that I don't see very often anyway. I still firmly believe Envies are the best driving putter ever made...but do I really want to carry a dedicated driving putter, or am I better off using the other molds in my bag more often? To further complicate matters, it seems I toss my other putters better when I'm not oscillating back and forth with an Envy. Quite the conundrum.

 

[TheirTheir]

Recently put my Eclipse Envy back in the bag and am loving it. I use it for a myriad of reasons off the tee but my favorite being mild flex lines when I need to control the angle it hits the green.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

I'm loving the grip and firmness of my Eclipse. Gonna get a backup or two 165ish. I dig the lighter weight and nice stability, great thrower for me.

I feel the same way, already have a couple Halloween ones as backups. It feels like a grip proton and flies nice. I think the dome WMD mentioned is the key to it. I find it kind of mellow and different (no not really different), almost has some neutron Atom action in the flight..

I say this because I have one long downhill tunnel shot about 240', a 12' gap and I can thread it with the eclipse fairly well. It stretches a tight S better than my other Envies and doesn't fade as fast, it still has all the stability.
Most of my other ones stable out faster, except a soft electron but it flies more of hint of hyzer line.

 

[ViolaBouquet]

New Envy help

Does anyone know the flight different between the
Neutron
Proton
Glow-Proton plastic?

I lost my favorite Neutron Envy which flow dead straight 250' with a bit of fade

I just got a new one and it flies like a beat in Proxy (although it is a bit light at 162g). I'm debating getting a heavier Neutron, but I'm also looking at a glow instead.

I have a neutron and proton Proxy. The proton is a bit less stable so I am assuming that would be the case.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Just quick answer since I'm working the neutron will beat into a straight flyer like you know. Proton will be a little bit more resistant to turn but as it breaks in it will develop into a fairly straight one as well but I would say that on average there bit more beefy and then the eclipse is like a slightly more mellow proton so I would consider getting a glow one

 

[ViolaBouquet]

So in a nutshell from Less stable to more
Neutron<Glow<Proton?

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Pretty much with the caveat that as the proton is more stable it's also straighter and a tick faster as it breaks in but still holding more stability than a broken in neutron... it gets straighter on the front and back end but keeps the fade. I guess what I'm trying to say is the lateral movement on the HSS and the LSS end is less.

Just generally the proton and eclipse is straighter and less "S" see. Neutron tends to wander a bit and soft neutron even more so, especially with LSS.... plasma is weirdly LSS even though it starts with less HSS than a neutron. I always felt like a harder disc like proton was faster, farther and more true to a mold. Forgetting about grip...

I have a stack of plasma's, they are no where near as straight as my OG neutron I traded for a Whitler... that neutron was straight when I broke it in, just friggin straight. Like heading for Comet country straight.

My eclipses are the SE Halloween ones.. Most of my stack is 165-167. Even those 5 grams will make a difference to your 162 that's a freak weight.. Not as big of a hop from 167 to 172 in stability. As it gets warmer out your disc also becomes less stable, I often add 2-3g in summer to all my discs.

I shoulda stopped at the "thumbs up" but I'm all for ramblin when I'm two beer in.. I think try an Eclipse Envy, it's a straight stable ride in all the right places and if you play at night then that's enough right there.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

So in a nutshell from Less stable to more
Neutron<Glow<Proton?

Timed out... your 162 neutron is somewhat of a rarity a 167 should give you a bunch more of what you want, and so might a 167 Eclipse.. +/- 2g

Or a heavier one in any flavour

 

[ViolaBouquet]

Thank you. I got a 174 glow and a 174 proton with a cherry red center/white rim. I like using these as a driver. I can't wait to try them out. Thank you for your help!

 

[wolfmandragon]

I found my Eclipse(glow) Envy to have the most turn... even more than Electron...

 

[Alexplz]

So in a nutshell from Less stable to more
Neutron<Glow<Proton?

I'll say the Proton Envy I gave a buddy was not appreciably more stable than my Neutrons, maybe even less so.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

I dunno, it's like protons might turn a bit more on an anny but it's tough to say on the flat. I think it depends on your throw a bit. I'm not disputing it I just don't know how to fully describe it. I really enjoy my eclipse SE's, they seem to fight a turn better and fade a little straighter. My protons are early runs and and even my first proton hasn't changed stability as much as my neutron, but I'm outta neutrons now except the soft Marm-O's.

It's kinda weird jumping plastics in the Envy, or many of the MVP/Axioms, I'm not always able to predict it, plasma Tesla bah hahahaha. What a brick!

 

[aphilso1]

I always found my Neutron Soft Envy to be the least Envy-like, meaning it showed significant turn and fade. I didn't really care for it.
Envies in Eclipse and Neutron plastic both give me a baby Teebird flight -- lots of HSS with a reasonable/controllable amount of LSS. Eclipses seem to have a touch of dome and maybe just a smidgen of turn, but are still basically the same disc as a Neutron. I never bagged a Proton or Plasma so can't really give input there.

 

[ray1970]

Played with a guy that I seldom play with.

Placed a shot up under a basket with my electron Envy and he picked it up for me and tossed it to me. He asked me what disc it was and said he really liked the way it felt in his hand.

I guess he envied my Envy.