Cam Todd Pro Basket Prototype

[loki the trickster]

If/when the baskets get harder say bye bye to the growth of disc golf.

Beacuse the tribes of people that live in th amazon or the people in affrica cry every night not having the internet???? :wall::wall::wall:

If the basket gets harder (smaller) the new people to this sport will never know.

 

[Smigles]

If basket size ever had any bearing at all on the growth of disc golf, Steady Ed would have made the basket huge. I don't see it as relevant to this discussion. Here's a case where size doesn't matter in terms of growth.

Disagree.

Making baskets smaller would basically bring us closer to ball golf. It makes the game more frustrating and does not bring anything more exciting on the other hand. Unless you find 3-putting exciting.

Ball golf is in a huge decline. And i think the two main reasons for it are that it's too elitist and too frustrating. People prefer cheaper games that dont take 5 hours to finish one round while you have to walk around the course in a dress code. And people also prefer easy to learn games where you quickly get a feeling of success.

 

[Puckstopper]

Par does not matter though. It's just a number. It's not like in real golf where it is actually used for a handicap system and stuff.

Actually, score is used for handicap, not par. That and two measures of course difficulty (slope and course rating). Plus, in traditional golf a handicap only applies to one course. I've developed a fairly workable, if somewhat labor intensive, cross course handicap system for my group where skill levels vary widely. I'm still working the kinks out, but it seems to be a good equalizer. It would be far more precise if I calculated the handicap for each course, but we play a variety, and it's much easier to just lump them all in together. If I had something better than a rough version of the PDGA's SSA formula to work with I think I could do a better job making numbers perfect, but that's a work in progress too.

If/when the baskets get harder say bye bye to the growth of disc golf.

Doubtful. Maybe the drunken chuckers won't play, but who would miss them?

 

[BionicRib]

Ball golf is declining cuz its too expensive....

 

[Matthew_Armeni]

I think the current basket size, specifically the how far out the chains are, could be a little smaller. What I find frustrating about putting are the times when it spits out and rolls away, giving me a comeback that's further than my original putt. If our discs didn't roll away I'd be all about having a smaller basket.

 

[jjpitt29]

Ball golf is declining cuz its too expensive....

Very very true. But I think the time and frustration is a big part of it. Especially with the younger crowd today. Almost every sport is looking at how to speed up the game. Baseball is looking at a pitch clock.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Disagree.

Making baskets smaller would basically bring us closer to ball golf. It makes the game more frustrating and does not bring anything more exciting on the other hand. Unless you find 3-putting exciting.

Ball golf is in a huge decline. And i think the two main reasons for it are that it's too elitist and too frustrating. People prefer cheaper games that dont take 5 hours to finish one round while you have to walk around the course in a dress code. And people also prefer easy to learn games where you quickly get a feeling of success.

You can disagree but no facts to back it up. The fact our history indicates growth and popularity throwing against poles, homemade baskets and now over 30 Championship models and 60 or more approved models indicates the basket design doesn't matter for interest in rec play.

 

[Karl]

Disagree.

Making baskets smaller would basically bring us closer to ball golf. It makes the game more frustrating and does not bring anything more exciting on the other hand. Unless you find 3-putting exciting.

Ball golf is in a huge decline. And i think the two main reasons for it are that it's too elitist and too frustrating. People prefer cheaper games that dont take 5 hours to finish one round while you have to walk around the course in a dress code. And people also prefer easy to learn games where you quickly get a feeling of success.

Sami,
What you and most of the other people "discussing" here fail to bring up in the argument is that gravity was initially designed (for BOTH types of golf) to be the "end all". Drive (disc or ball) hard, Approach (disc or ball) with 'moderate aggression', and Putt (disc or ball) softly / with 'touch'. And, in both cases, the disc/ball will "cease motion" in the bottom of the hole/basket (for ball/disc respectively). But somewhere in the last 20 years or so, disc golf has morphed into "drive hard, putt harder!" If, as I believe Herr West was alluding to, we threw 30 ft putts SOFTLY into a basket which, oh by the way, happened to have some deflector devise (which the chains were SUPPOSED to be initially), it would be MUCH more challenging (due to wind, etc.), much more like ball golf (which our sport IS based on - love it or not), and introduce a 'lost aspect' of sports (at least lost in OUR sport...that of "feel"). Spit out occur for one reason and one reason only, the putt was going too hard on the wrong trajectory (for maximum "make-ability")! Slow the putt down to make more putts. We have ALL had spit-outs but I NEVER blame the basket; I blame ME - for I putted it too hard / at the wrong angle. If I took a little off and "aimed for the basket's bottom (for the putt to end THERE instead of "in the chains") I might have made it.
Karl

 

[Smigles]

You can disagree but no facts to back it up. The fact our history indicates growth and popularity throwing against poles, homemade baskets and now over 30 Championship models and 60 or more approved models indicates the basket design doesn't matter for interest in rec play.

All we have as fact is that the baskets are improving (= making putting easier) and the player numbers are growing. Do you have specific numbers for growth rate while playing on tone poles compared to growth rates now?

 

[Smigles]

But somewhere in the last 20 years or so, disc golf has morphed into "drive hard, putt harder!"

Spit out occur for one reason and one reason only, the putt was going too hard on the wrong trajectory

Hi Karl,

(are you crazy overhead karl that sometimes comes to Basel, btw? )

I dont know about you, but I am a Feldberg style pitch/loft putter, and what you are saying definitly does not apply to me. IMO the main benefit from a Feldberg style putt is that you dont go far off when you miss. So I try to give my putts just enugh energy to get to the chains.

Which can result in its own kind of push outs from putting too soft. But that's like way off topic ^^

 

[Cgkdisc]

All we have as fact is that the baskets are improving (= making putting easier) and the player numbers are growing. Do you have specific numbers for growth rate while playing on tone poles compared to growth rates now?

The sport went from zero to something when objects were used. And jumped further when baskets came online. No question that any baskets are better than posts but no indication different baskets have any connection with growth. If it did matter, the argument could be made that we should swap smaller tougher baskets into our pitch and putt courses to reduce the overcrowding in some areas.

 

[Karl]

Hi Karl,

(are you crazy overhead karl that sometimes comes to Basel, btw? )

I dont know about you, but I am a Feldberg style pitch/loft putter, and what you are saying definitly does not apply to me. IMO the main benefit from a Feldberg style putt is that you dont go far off when you miss. So I try to give my putts just enugh energy to get to the chains.

Which can result in its own kind of push outs from putting too soft. But that's like way off topic ^^

Yes sir, sure am!
I think you're smart putting in such a way so as not to miss TOO long (if you do miss). But a LOT of players DO putt too hard, miss (or cut through), and then grip.
And I do agree with the "too soft" push back out - a case of where the chains are actually too HARD. This would be helped by softer chains and or no chains.

Karl
Ps: Say "Hi" to Martin, Luc, Lucas, and all the rest of guys there for me!

 

[Smigles]

Yes sir, sure am!

Ps: Say "Hi" to Martin, Luc, Lucas, and all the rest of guys there for me!

Ha, great Hi Karl

We miss your crazy overheads over here ^^

Btw I met Collin too, who said he knows you. He's been around town 3-4 times too now. Even played our tournament in march

 

[treehorn]

Not a fan either... I've been playing for a little over 3 years and I still struggle from time to time outside of 20' and I practice almost everyday.

The smaller basket would make my already average game worse and I know I can speak for a lot of the locals I play with and they would not be interested in this.

I guess the same theory would be making the ball golf hole smaller "does that make sense"?

 

[BENFTS]

Personally I love the idea.

 

[DanJon]

The future of disc golf lies in Youth Programs and school sponsored teams/events.

Not the Touring Pro Circuit.

 

[JTdisc]

I'm all for innovation, and making holes a little harder at the highest level of competition. Right now though, things are just fine for average joes like me.

To the point though, I'm completely unimpressed with that basket.
1. Nice angled sharp edges to chew up the disc.
2. Top goes down, which is awkward. Bottom should go up.
3. There are plenty of baskets already installed. Replacing baskets isn't going to happen. Come up with a way to alter the current baskets or something.

 

[whentherainscome]

Well, I've seen some courses with pretty unique baskets. These seem to have less material and could be significantly cheaper. They'd certainly make a 9-hole pitch-n-putt course more interesting, and could be mixed with normal baskets on courses w/multiple positions for Challenge Mode layouts.

 

[AndyJB]

The future of disc golf lies in Youth Programs and school sponsored teams/events.

Not the Touring Pro Circuit.

Oh my God, so much this. THANK YOU, DanJon.

If we could get a Little League/Pee Wee Disc Golf thing going, the game and sport sides of disc golf would erupt. I personally also feel that disc golf should be included in the Special Olympics.

 

[Tpro]

Ive spoken with Cam about this before and to kind of some it up with out exactly quoting.... Any body (super pros) can "hack" a drive 450+ and hit a putt inside 60. That's not exciting for him or them really.. He used to be known as the best putter in the world and apparently he thought putting was just to easy and thought it should be made harder. Here is the out come... Unfortunately I think if you really wanted to make it hard just put different tops of the baskets. Leave the bucket and pole the same. Then every A tier NT or whatever stop can be modified easily.. Boom problems solved