XxInnovaxX
Double Eagle Member
lol once again thanks for the info
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[Innova] CHAMPION VS STAR
- Thread starter XxInnovaxX
- Start date
lol once again thanks for the info
Rbuzz9
Eagle Member
i thought champ was more overstable but i dont have any one disc in both plastics.
same question but different company - is Z more overstable than ESP right out of the box?
same question but different company - is Z more overstable than ESP right out of the box?
I know that irregardless is not a word (it is nonstandard anyway) sorry Threeputt, just trying to keep you humble.
We'd be lost w/o your disc golf knowledge.
kerplunk
Double Eagle Member
On a similar and related topic, a friend and I have noticed champ discs seem to be slightly larger diameter than star. anyone else notice this?
I know the dx discs are always smaller, they shrink more when they cool. If I'm not mistaken, star plastic has some dx in it, so it would make sense that there's some shrinkage there too.
Champ is the densest plastic. It fills out the mold best. As the plastic gets "cheaper" (for lack of a better term) it shrinks more. So as you move from Champ to Star to Pro to DX, you could see small changes in the diameter as you go. There are some molds where the changes are really noticeable.
I always heard Star was a mix of Champ and Pro. I've been wrong before, though.
I've really been trying to work the non-word "irregardless" into this post for BrotherDave, but I have failed. I will post it irregardless.
kerplunk
Double Eagle Member
I second that. I have tried star and champ wraiths and star way flippy. Champ and star boss, not as bad but star it more flippy.
I've really been trying to work the non-word "irregardless" into this post for BrotherDave, but I have failed. I will post it irregardless.
Damn you Three Putt! You foiled me this bout, but it won't be the last time you see me!
I need to stop watching TCM.
Rameka
Par Member
As much as I respect you and love reading your posts, I'm going to have to disagree with some of what you've said.
A higher dome means that there is a larger pressure gradient between the top and the bottom of the disc. This means a disc with a dome will act more understable. The air over the top of the disc will differ in speed from port to starboard; the air over the top surface of port (for a RHBH throw) will be going faster relative to the surface of the disc than the air over starboard. Since the air on the underside of the disc won't differ much from port to starboard (the inside pocket under a disc is what creates the vacuum that produces lift), the dramatic difference in speed won't cancel out (The common, and incorrect, counter argument here is that since there's a ratio between the air going over the top surface and the bottom surface, it won't matter if the air going over/under the port surface differs from the air going over/under the starboard surface because their ratios cancel out...kinda like how 1/2 = 2/4. However, this is incorrect because of the vacuum I mentioned.). So, the domier disc will be more understable. A dome will always have that effect. If you've experienced otherwise, it would have to be for some other reason than dominess: perhaps some other aspect of the geometry of your discs. This seems strange to me, because I'm aware of the fact that you've thrown hundreds of discs. It's confusing to me that you noticed such a trend...
Champ is the densest plastic. It fills out the mold best. As the plastic gets "cheaper" (for lack of a better term) it shrinks more. So as you move from Champ to Star to Pro to DX, you could see small changes in the diameter as you go. There are some molds where the changes are really noticeable.
I always heard Star was a mix of Champ and Pro. I've been wrong before, though.
I've really been trying to work the non-word "irregardless" into this post for BrotherDave, but I have failed. I will post it irregardless.
That's correct. The chart would go like so:
Most understable
DX and Pro-D
Pro and X
Star and ESP (Star is a blend of Champ and Pro; ESP is a blend of Z and X)
Champ and Z
Most overstable
The reason for this, like you mentioned, is because the more expensive plastics are more dense. Since they are more dense, they are obviously less porous. Porous plastics will act more understable because, in layman's terms, they will "ride the wind" better. Just like how golf balls can fly far because of the fact that they have dimples, a more porous plastic will hold less wake turbulence. This will cause it to slow down...slower. This is also the most likely reason that discs in base plastics reportedly fly further; they have less wake turbulence.
First off, no he didn't *snaps fingers*. Secondly, if the premium plastic is less porous than why is it so much easier to get sharpie off of DX than Champ?
I think that it depends on the disc. It seems to me that Star plastic wears in more quickly than champion plastic and will become more understable more quickly.
Rameka
Par Member
I will ponder your question until I find the answer. Please stand by...
My theory on that is that the clear champ plastic just shows the residue better than the opaque plastics after you've taken most of the ink off.
Rameka
Par Member
Good crack but I don't think that's it at all...most people would be able to tell an ink stain, I think, despite the translucence of the champ/Z plastic.
I mean, I can get sharpie clean off DX with a pencil eraser where as with champ and star your best best is the dry erase marker trick but only if the sharpie hasn't been on there long.
Rameka
Par Member
Yeah, I feel you. I just conducted a test myself to see if you were bull****ting me and your claim proved true. I can rub ink off my Glo Roc with my thumb, but trying to get it off my ESP Crush takes a good scratching.
It may be that because the base plastic is so porous, there are microscopic bubbles of air that don't get filled with ink, and so the layer of ink is covering a dispersion of small air pockets. Precisely how that happens I don't know, and then you're getting into the chemistry of ink and I know nothing about that, despite being a chem student. That's one thought, though. I'll think about it a bit more...
Yeah, I feel you. I just conducted a test myself to see if you were bull****ting me and your claim proved true. I can rub ink off my Glo Roc with my thumb, but trying to get it off my ESP Crush takes a good scratching.
It may be that because the base plastic is so porous, there are microscopic bubbles of air that don't get filled with ink, and so the layer of ink is covering a dispersion of small air pockets. Precisely how that happens I don't know, and then you're getting into the chemistry of ink and I know nothing about that, despite being a chem student. That's one thought, though. I'll think about it a bit more...
air pockets? Now who is bull****ting who here?
I think I just gave you the subject of your next research paper. Rameka
Par Member
air pockets? Now who is bull****ting who here?
Hell yes. If only. Being an undergrad doesn't really give you a lot of freedom to conduct research, though
Maybe someday...
Maybe you're actually rubbing off a very thin layer of disc with the eraser and it takes the ink with it? Kind of like how you can erase ink from a textbook's page.
