Dave242's Review of Idlewild

[jace]

Who said my way of reviewing is better? I certainly didn't. I'm just giving (obnoxiously) full-diclosure that I am rating/reviewing based on my opinion/personal tastes.

I'll try to explain: I am talking about the rating number. Since everybody has their own criteria on how to rate/grade courses (the number of discs/dots they assign), you can consider the numbers as random and the average will tend towards some center point (probably 3 discs) as the number of reviews/ratings increase.

Where you can not consider the numbers random are the courses that are exceptionally good, or bad. Almost everybody will agree and rate them highly and the few that don't will not affect the average significantly. So, "the cream will rise to the top" for the exceptional courses (and visa versa for the exceptionally low-rated courses). Does that make sense?

This is where trusted reviewer status comes into play..... I think people will eventually gravitate toward players that are trusted reviewers. I only say this because I have played a couple courses out of state that I essentially made my decision on which course to play because of a PM/Thread/or course review.

I'm about 50/50 on your reviews Dave only because I would be coming from out of state to most likely play a course you have played and it is difficult to gain maybe a little better feeling for the hole types and elevation and foliage of a course you have reviewed unless there are pictures (to your point) of course.

And quite frankly I want to know if there is a bathroom at the course if I just drove 4+ hours to get there, had 2 cups of coffee and a sausage biscuit for breakfast. I might actually need to use one and would prefer to stop at a gas station if i have to before showing up to play only to find out i now have a pressing issue (pun intended)

I actually loved your review on the course in question..... made me realize there is actually someone who isn't really worried about what all the locals are going to say because you blasted their course, or in this case just wrote an honest evaluation of a course that was so hyped up that it let you down! I commend you for getting outside your ABC rating shell

I think over time our fearless favorite website leader may have to find a way in which to qualify reviews or cycle out certain reviews which are arguably NOT helpful. Not sure how that works without making someone mad

 

[LStephens]

Yes...I too think Dave has taken this thread much much much better than I could have ever taken it. He's been a darn good sport and I apologize for any hurt feelings...it's that the written word rarely is taken with the same tone or emotion that the writer intends.

Idlewild isn't perfect. It has a lot of work yet to be done. It will never be perfect. Personally I think HBB is only used for outsiders....it's like saying you can't talk bad about my family...because they are my family..but I can write a book about all their flaws. I don't see Idlewild as perfect...I see every nasty flaw there is. I think Idlewild for most people can be looked at like this:

First time playing: Overwhelmed at the difficulty...so let's start making excuses for our bad scores...
12th time playing: Other people don't know what they are talking about...this course is great..you gotta learn to like it.
50th time playing: You know...I would change this and that...that shot is stupid...we need more OB...we need this hole to be longer.

I see this in a lot of courses..where the locals start messing up a good thing and start expanding holes to make them harder because they are bored..instead of just playing the course by the designers dreams. One of our flaws at Idlewild is this...we tend to 'tinker' with holes because we have become bored...we see someone of lower skill...luck up and deuce hole 11..and we put it on an island green....we see some other people do shots..and we think we need to change things....no...no we don't...let the course settle for a decade and let the sport catch up to us....Idlewild was a revolution when it was opened up to the disc golf world...people in Cincy went from shortish open courses...to one long mean wooded course.

This is NOT my website...I have other websites where people critique my vision and I take some ideas and blow the rest off...I understand what it is like for people to give you advice...criticism..and sometimes down right nastiness...but here is what I would like to see on this website since this whole thread exploded.

A numbering scale from 1 to 5 just like now...only the 1 thru 5 would be for:

1. Horrible course....someone should pull it before it gives our sport a bad name.
2. Beginner course....a place where people learn the game. pitch n putt
3. Rec to Int course...a place where you can work on shots.
4. Advanced course...a place where there is distance and hard shots.
5. Professional course...places designed to push today's top players

After you judge a course 1-5..then give it another 1-5 for how that compares to your expectation of that caliber course...or others at the same level you have played before.

That way...a new player can instantly see where they need to play...or an Advanced player can see where they need to play. I can give Winton Woods in Cincy a 1.5 instead of a 2.0 of the current ratings...a 1.5 would say...you know..this is one of the best pitch n putt courses I've ever seen...it was top notch in 1981...but now it is a course where people are introduced to the sport...as seen by 10 people per hole....on every hole....all day long in the summers.

Then I could rate the top pro courses a 5.*....where * would be how I judged the course in comparison to the top pro courses around the nation...I don't think I..or anyone would get upset if you said Idlewild was a 5.1...it was a pro course that you didn't happen to like....anyway..this is extreme thread drift..and for that...I apologize.

Looking forward to seeing you at Idlewild Dave.
3.

 

[DiscGolfCraig]

I noticed Dave's rating of Idlewild was changed from a 3 to a 5, moving Idlewild to #1. What brought upon the change?

 

[Greg Layton]

I noticed Dave's rating of Idlewild was changed from a 3 to a 5, moving Idlewild to #1. What brought upon the change?

Peer pressure.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showpost.php?p=159584&postcount=57

 

[Disc Golf Cowboy]

Peer pressure.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showpost.php?p=159584&postcount=57

Now that's crap!!!

Also I think if you do reviews you should atleast have a score in your score book from that course or some scores so we can have so idea what type of player you are. I think that would help out on the rating that they gave the course.

 

[Disc Golf Cowboy]

Idlewild isn't even in his list of played courses!!! WFT???

 

[Dave242]

A few thoughts:
This thread needs to stay buried.
Not peer pressure.....possibly beer pressure though
I listed my score my review. I list my rating in my profile. I list my D in my profile. I am all for this idea of full disclosure both on skill level AND on what you look for (and rate on) in courses. I do this - I wish more people did it.
Idlewild is on my played list - has been all along (check again).
What is WFT? (by the cowboy's demeanor here, he might be saying "What a Freakin Tool" to me).
I will be re-adjusting my rating soon when I am done laughing at the results of my prank. I actually will be rating it higher than the 3.0 I had it rated at.
Lastly, this thread needs to die.

 

[DiscGolfCraig]

A few thoughts:
This thread needs to stay buried.
Not peer pressure.....possibly beer pressure though
I listed my score my review. I list my rating in my profile. I list my D in my profile. I am all for this idea of full disclosure both on skill level AND on what you look for (and rate on) in courses. I do this - I wish more people did it.
Idlewild is on my played list - has been all along (check again).
What is WFT? (by the cowboy's demeanor here, he might be saying "What a Freakin Tool" to me).
I will be re-adjusting my rating soon when I am done laughing at the results of my prank. I actually will be rating it higher than the 3.0 I had it rated at.
Lastly, this thread needs to die.

Dave,
I agree this thread needs to die, along with every other thread that's questioned your ratings. I'd just noticed Idlewild went from third to first in the ratings, then saw there wasn't a 3 rating for it anymore. I'm sure all the FC'ers went into full panic mode when they dropped to third.

Craig

 

[tomjulio]

I'm sure all the FC'ers went into full panic mode when they dropped to third.

Craig

No, "they" won't. In fact, we all laughed! Right along with Bill from Flip who OWNS Flip!

Why? Because THAT my friend is the true nature and spirit of Flip City and those that get "it", that "get" the essence of the spirit of disc golfing.....unlike the tin hat haters who are actually the fuel that keeps this dumb fire burning.

 

[nygfaninva]

Ok, so I read the review to get an idea of what the big deal here was, and I still don't get it. Dave made a very thorough review and it was all his opinion which he explained very clearly. I have never played the course but understood everything Dave was trying to convey through his review. Why the hate? The only thing I still don't get about the review was that it was strongly on the negative side, which is fine, the experience he described didn't sound like he enjoyed it, so my question is why the 5 discs? If he didn't like the course why give it such a great rating? I have hated a course others liked (Falling Creek comes to mind) and still only gave it 3, due to the amenities and upkeep of the course alone. That's my opnion and how I felt about the course, who cares what anyone else thinks or wrote. If a reviewer didn't like a course no one should give him or her a hard time about it. Just wondering why Dave changed his score? Stick to your guns Dave, if you didn't like it don't feel pressured into giving it 5 discs. Your review, the version I just read, certainly didn't read like a 5 disc review. Man up and blow off the haters, I liked your review. Good for you.

 

[WillA]

I'm with Nygfaninva. You shouldn't change the score you give a course because people get bent out of shape. And people shouldn't get upset if you give a course a low score.

 

[Dave242]

Thanks for the concern and support. As I said above, I will be re-adjusting my rating soon when I am done laughing at the results of my prank.

 

[nygfaninva]

Thanks for the concern and support. As I said above, I will be re-adjusting my rating soon when I am done laughing at the results of my prank.

Prank? So your negative review was a prank? All the insights I read as I read what you wrote were untrue? You just did this to illicit a response? That's lame. I was standing up for you because I thought you wrote with conviction and was getting flack for it.

 

[Disc Golf Cowboy]

Sorry dave guess I missed it in your played list. I still think to write a review you should have a score listed. Not just you, anyone that writes a review.

 

[Dave242]

Talking about pranks - your post is a prank, nygfaninva. Right?

But, in case you did not read/comprehend what I meant by "I will be re-adjusting my rating", I had adjusted my rating last night from a 3.0 to a 5.0 as a prank. I will be adjusting by rating back down (re-adjusting - get it?) soon.

Oh, and BTW my review was NOT a negative review. I wrote glowing praise for many of the aspects of the course that I find important. It is just that other aspects that I also found important were lacking to me. So those made me give the course a grade of "good" (not "OK" or "Bad") rather than "great".

 

[skurf]

Attention whore much? You change your rating to illicit a response out of people and when they respond you keep saying how this thread should die, but you're the one that keeps coming back and posting in it to keep it alive. I don't care one way or the other which course is rated No. 1, but I do find it ironic that your actions contradict your words.

 

[Dave242]

I need councelling - how much do you charge per therapy session?

 

[tomjulio]

I need councelling - how much do you charge per therapy session?

I think I am beginning to like you more and more Dave.

 

[nygfaninva]

Talking about pranks - your post is a prank, nygfaninva. Right?

But, in case you did not read/comprehend what I meant by "I will be re-adjusting my rating", I had adjusted my rating last night from a 3.0 to a 5.0 as a prank. I will be adjusting by rating back down (re-adjusting - get it?) soon.

Oh, and BTW my review was NOT a negative review. I wrote glowing praise for many of the aspects of the course that I find important. It is just that other aspects that I also found important were lacking to me. So those made me give the course a grade of "good" (not "OK" or "Bad") rather than "great".

Gotcha. Sorry misunderstod the "Prank". Good for you. I guess I shouldn't have said negative, but compared to the 5 stars the wording seemed negative. I know that you said a lot of good things, but you didn't seem to enjoy it as much as you expected. I have had the same feeling on a few courses I couldn't wait to play based on previous reviews, which is why your review stuck with me. Thanks for clearing that up and I stand by you and any reviewer to write what they feel regardless of how "homers" feel about their home course.

 

[AdamE]

50th time playing: You know...I would change this and that...that shot is stupid...we need more OB...we need this hole to be longer.

You really do know the course well. I heard that's exactly what they did at the Kentucky State Doubles Championship last weekend; more OB and longer holes

I'm just sad I missed it...