Disc Golf World Tour

[corin_brown]

Since it's been such a hot topic in these parts:

Lack of Women's Division in DGWT Draws Criticism

Actually I will say that their press guy was excellent and got me all the access I needed. I spoke with Catrina and reached out to her a couple times after the event, and she did not respond, which is her right. Just didn't want any negativity on the DGWT PR guy, who was great.

Lol, fair enough. I didn't even know there was a dedicated DGWT press person, I was just making a joke by inventing one in my mind.

Still curious why CA chose not to even respond, even if it was just to issue a "no comment." Sounds like an honest communication snafu.

 

[TimSyl]

CA was probably too busy listening to her earbuds and foot faulting to answer. ;0)

 

[scarpfish]

I finally figured out why DGWT has only one division: $. The Memorial prize purse was $70k. LaMi prize purse was $20k. First place in MPO at The Memorial was $4k. First place at LaMi was $2500. Think about how much lower that LaMi MPO first place prize would have to be if Jussi had to pay out an FPO field and a Masters field too? The reason why Jussi wants only one division is because he has to spend his budget on things other than prize money and he doesn't want the prize money to be any lower, compared to other tours, than it already is.

All that's fine, of course. I just wonder how "feasible and sustainable" that strategy will sound when the corporate sponsors he's courting ask him if any women play disc golf or if anyone likes to watch women play disc golf.

In the piece, Jussi commented about the lack of sustainability of an FPO in DGWT at this moment. I think the sustainability of the entire DGWT in general is an open question.

And I wish more people would understand both of these things when discussing this matter. Jussi isn't trying to follow the egalitarian and politically correct model the PDGA has done for a long time now to grow the sport. He's trying a different top down approach to grow the portion of the sport that has had the most trouble growing. Unfortunately, that is often at odds with the way we've traditionally done things.

But just the same, many of us feel that he's trying to draw water from an empty well, (as are the other "tours" going on this year), because even our best men aren't catching enough eyeballs that will attract outside attention and sponsorship.

So in the end, getting all cranky about women being excluded from this one tour, may be much ado over nothing.

 

[Royalhghnss]

From Cat:

I keep getting tagged in a lot of different comments about what I am and am not capable of in disc golf! Whether I agree with the disc golf world tour or not, please stop saying I'm not capable of throwing far, I'm not strong enough, or I don't have the shots! I am and will continue to work as hard as possible to be the best I can be, not as a woman or a man but as a disc golfer! I encourage the men and women tagging me and limiting me to do the same! Go out and be great! Don't let anyone, disc golfer male or female, science or peers tell you you can't! You are the one who decides! Go out and do the impossible!

 

[Nova P]

I guess I've just been forgetting to give myself permission to routinely throw 450' with parking accuracy.

 

[Jenga54]

I finally figured out why DGWT has only one division: $. The Memorial prize purse was $70k. LaMi prize purse was $20k. First place in MPO at The Memorial was $4k. First place at LaMi was $2500. Think about how much lower that LaMi MPO first place prize would have to be if Jussi had to pay out an FPO field and a Masters field too?

In the piece, Jussi commented about the lack of sustainability of an FPO in DGWT at this moment. I think the sustainability of the entire DGWT in general is an open question.

He's trying a different top down approach to grow the portion of the sport that has had the most trouble growing. Unfortunately, that is often at odds with the way we've traditionally done things..

So in the end, getting all cranky about women being excluded from this one tour, may be much ado over nothing.

And from Hokum:
"But I've been an activist at heart, I'm a huge feminist, I believe in women's rights. I practically had a minor in it in college. So I really have strong feelings about this, and I'll continue to do whatever I can to push it."


It all adds up pretty simply. Jussi has a plan to run a "showcase" type world tour and spend a big BIG ol' budget on it. The FPO would cost a lot, and the FPO ladies probably wouldn't pony up for international travel anyway. There's no master's either.

So why isn't Climo all over this as he would easily cash in? Because he probably grew up believing you needed to earn what you get, none of this "protest if I don't get what I want"

I'm so ashamed to be a millennial most of the time.

Jussi could have decided to do a 2 man tour:
McBeth vs. Lizotte
and paid to go around like the harlem globe trotters vs washington generals.

Jussi decided the Return On Investment isn't there yet, sorry ladies. Sugar Daddy Steve Dodge is gonna spend some money too and spread it around.

 

[discRabbit]

mmmmm...that's some good commodification :/

 

[allinpflop]

None of the those tours are any different.....no big money come in because no one watches so no sponsors and no growth....disc gof is not a spectator sport....you can't even get disc golfers to watch let alone the general public......I know most of you wish and wish this wasn't the case but it is....

 

[discRabbit]

Fortunately, even if it isn't "big time" you can still (probably) enjoy PLAYING it

 

[Jenga54]

mmmmm...that's some good commodification :/

sorry, but the players are now a product, like any other pro sport. if they didn't want to be, they could have stayed amateurs, not taking cash and played for the pure enjoyment only. the only way

None of the those tours are any differentYET.....no big money come in YET because no one watches YET so no sponsors and no growth YET....disc gof is not a spectator sport YET....you can't even get disc golfers to watch YET let alone the general public YET......I know most of you wish and wish this wasn't the case but it is So Far....

 

[allinpflop]

Nothing is any different.... every couple years for the last 30 years someone decides their disc golf tournament model is going to change everything.....people don't watch disc golf.....not even disc golfers......keep hoping and in 5 more years when nothing has changed you can get behind the next big thing....

 

[Steve West]

I guess I've just been forgetting to give myself permission to routinely throw 450' with parking accuracy.

It's not that hard. (Unless you try to do it with just one throw.)

 

[corin_brown]

And from Hokum:
"But I've been an activist at heart, I'm a huge feminist, I believe in women's rights. I practically had a minor in it in college. So I really have strong feelings about this, and I'll continue to do whatever I can to push it."

Hokum. Lol, smh.

Jussi has a plan to run a "showcase" type world tour and spend a big BIG ol' budget on it.

I'm not sure Jussi's budget is any bigger than any other big tourney. His prize purse budget is about 35% of the prize purse of The Memorial. And what about Ledgestone(sp?) Isn't Ledgestone's purse over $100k? Where's Jussi's big ole' budget being spent? Because it sure isn't going into providing live footage, getting local or national press coverage or advertising to the general public.

The FPO would cost a lot, and the FPO ladies probably wouldn't pony up for international travel anyway.

FPO would cost a lot? Define "a lot." Like more than the budget of MPO? Also, if the prize money was sweet enough, FPO players would travel anywhere.

 

[corin_brown]

.keep hoping and in 5 more years when nothing has changed you can get behind the next big thing....

So what if disc golf never gets bigger than it is now? What's the downside for trying? Anyways, why do you even care if these tours succeed or fail? It's not your money.

 

[Jenga54]

Yes, Jussi's budget isn't bigger than any other by any stretch. I think the money is going towards media and on site support stuff.

By "professional" I think Jussi sees this partly about a professional thing for the players, but also paying for professional services, supporting companies with dollars for covering the events from media, staff, etc. instead of relying on volunteers. Right or wrong at this stage of the game, it seems to me some of his focus is around building that support structure underneath the tour.

I see a lot of collector discs with companies and logos that are no longer in business. Some are only a few years old. Part of a sustainable tour is a sustainable support structure.
Part of it is income and fan support, so there's that...

 

[DirtyMeathook]

Corwin Brown had become a parody of himself. One ironic post after another. He says "why do you even care whether the tour succeeds or fails." This coming from a guy with a short novel worth of content in this thread. Complains prize pool is not big enough, but gawks at idea of not having the resources for a restricted division, and does it all in a single post.

 

[VictorB]

Nothing is any different.... every couple years for the last 30 years someone decides their disc golf tournament model is going to change everything.....people don't watch disc golf.....not even disc golfers......keep hoping and in 5 more years when nothing has changed you can get behind the next big thing....

The thing about watching disc golf is kind of the same thing that plagues some of the smaller eSports games...they are so accessible, that people are more likely to play than to watch people play, no matter how skilled they are. Many of those that are hardcore enough to sit around and watch would still be much more likely to get out in any conditions to get some holes in.

The big tournaments are all in the same season and share days as the rest of the PDGA events around the country. Every weekend, there are boat loads of people that are migrating to the nearest PDGA event to play, not sit in front of the TV and watch. Traditional PGA events are different in this aspect. There isn't a major event nearly every weekend, and players aren't necessarily going out every weekend day to play (simply because of cost/time/availability of tee times etc).

Also, PGA events have all day coverage, and even if you had something to do, it's much more likely that you can watch an hour or so - maybe not necessarily of the lead card - and still get things done. I really think a single 3 hour window to watch one card play also kind of detracts viewers, but not as much as the other reasons I already listed.

 

[hook_nuts]

And from Hokum:
"But I've been an activist at heart, I'm a huge feminist, I believe in women's rights. I practically had a minor in it in college. So I really have strong feelings about this, and I'll continue to do whatever I can to push it."

Another fake feminist, awesome! By definition I'm a feminist. There use to be great women feminist. These new age "feminist" are bigots and hypocrites that have been convinced the world is against them. Is this really the bs they teach in college or did she just think that made her sound more qualified. A minor in feminism lmao. What a waste of tuition.

 

[NOStheBOSS]

Corwin Brown had become a parody of himself. One ironic post after another. He says "why do you even care whether the tour succeeds or fails." This coming from a guy with a short novel worth of content in this thread. Complains prize pool is not big enough, but gawks at idea of not having the resources for a restricted division, and does it all in a single post.

he's been all over this site, just likes to spew I guess

 

[Steve West]

It's time to declare the winners of the first event. Not the winning players, the winning holes. Here is how each hole performed in terms of sorting players by skill.

      Contribution
      to Scoring 
      Spread Width of
Hole  Total Scores
 1      6.1%
17      4.9%
 9      3.8%
 4      3.3%
 3      3.1%
13      3.1%
15      2.7%
 7      2.6%
14      2.5%
 6      2.5%
11      2.4%
 2      1.9%
10      1.8%
 8      1.6%
 5      1.6%
16      0.9%
12      0.6%
18     -0.1%