Paige Pierce loses huge opportunity

[Alobar]

Suggestion for the Hokom Rule

Suggestion for the Hokom Rule:

How about a 3 hole cutoff point? By which I mean if the player is unable to join their card by end of play of the 3rd hole of the round, they take par +2? 3? 4? for those holes. If the player joins the card on 1st, 2nd, or 3rd hole prior to cardmates holing out, the player may play that hole and and make up the missed holes immediately following completion of the round or prior to the beginning of the next.

 

[The Hammer]

There is nothing wrong with the rule as it stands. It should be super punitive to show up late. How would you feel if you were on time and took a triple bogey on hole one, when Mr. Can't-show-up-on-time gets to card a double bogey?

 

[oddjob]

On another note, it seems to me that +4 is an awfully severe penalty for Pro players. I would not have argued if the tournament directors stepped in and decided that due to the circumstances, the penalty would be +2 on each hole. I am sure that is too simple for most folks and "you can't just change the rules" whenever you want. OK. How about they look at the rule now and change it to +3 or +2 for pro level? +4 just seems like a lot to me.

I'd prefer something like this:

The player must start at the time established by the Committee.
Penalty for Breach of Rule 6-3: Disqualification.

 

[Forester]

I agree with oddjob.

 

[Alobar]

There is nothing wrong with the rule as it stands. It should be super punitive to show up late. How would you feel if you were on time and took a triple bogey on hole one, when Mr. Can't-show-up-on-time gets to card a double bogey?

I'm against the rule I just proposed. As much as I was rooting for Hokom, I don't think they should have delayed or let her replay. However, according to Smashboxx, there is a possibility that some such rule may be a least floated for consideration.

What would have happened if it had been McBeth this happened to?? There would be 10X the criticism both ways if they had delayed or gone ahead, and still no resolution to the debate. McBeth haters and people that actually think we should follow the rules would cry FOUL if they delayed at all, while all the other bleeding hearts here would be having hissy fits if they hadn't waited on the best player in the game.

 

[The Hammer]

I'm against the rule I just proposed. As much as I was rooting for Hokom, I don't think they should have delayed or let her replay. However, according to Smashboxx, there is a possibility that some such rule may be a least floated for consideration.

What would have happened if it had been McBeth this happened to?? There would be 10X the criticism both ways if they had delayed or gone ahead, and still no resolution to the debate. McBeth haters and people that actually think we should follow the rules would cry FOUL if they delayed at all, while all the other bleeding hearts here would be having hissy fits if they hadn't waited on the best player in the game.

I'm a McBeth fan, and I would have no problem with the PDGA starting the tournament without him and issuing the standard par +4 for each hole missed. I feel that most people that have run an event for themselves would have the same sentiment. Delaying all of the other participants for one person being late, regardless of the reason, is both absurd, and a logistical nightmare.

 

[scarpfish]

Have any one of you suggesting these nutty ideas on here even actually ran a tournament or even played in one? I absolutely swear some of your ideas suggest a lack of understanding of tournament logistics?

On another note, it seems to me that +4 is an awfully severe penalty for Pro players. I would not have argued if the tournament directors stepped in and decided that due to the circumstances, the penalty would be +2 on each hole. I am sure that is too simple for most folks and "you can't just change the rules" whenever you want. OK. How about they look at the rule now and change it to +3 or +2 for pro level? +4 just seems like a lot to me.

Why should pros get a different rule than anyone else? The whole point of penalizing late players so severely is to ensure they don't get a better result by being absent versus someone who showed up on time and played the hole badly. 95+% of the time people are late for rounds, its due to their own laziness and stupidity, not because of circumstances like a near fatal car wreck.

Suggestion for the Hokom Rule:

How about a 3 hole cutoff point? By which I mean if the player is unable to join their card by end of play of the 3rd hole of the round, they take par +2? 3? 4? for those holes. If the player joins the card on 1st, 2nd, or 3rd hole prior to cardmates holing out, the player may play that hole and and make up the missed holes immediately following completion of the round or prior to the beginning of the next.

Nope. You can't allow people to make up holes after the round because by then they'll be possibly playing that hole under considerably different weather circumstances than when the rest of their card played it. You also have to consider that this was a tee time situation where the hole may not have been available for such to happen for several hours.

 

[Alobar]

Have any one of you suggesting these nutty ideas on here even actually ran a tournament or even played in one, because some of your ideas suggest a lack of understanding of tournament logistics?


Why should pros get a different rule than anyone else? The whole point of penalizing late players so severely is to ensure they don't get a better result by being absent versus someone who showed up on time and played the hole badly. 95+% of the time people are late for rounds, its due to their own laziness and stupidity, not because of circumstances like a near fatal car wreck.


Nope. You can't allow people to make up holes after the round because by then they'll be possibly playing that hole under considerably different weather circumstances than when the rest of their card played it. You also have to consider that this was a tee time situation where the hole may not have been available for such to happen for several hours.

I REPEAT:
I'm against the rule I just proposed. As much as I was rooting for Hokom, I don't think they should have delayed or let her replay. However, according to Smashboxx, there is a possibility that some such rule may be a least floated for consideration.
#simmerdownnow

 

[KaBooM]

Haven't watched PP's interview on the podcast, I am hard pressed to see how anyone can question her actions on Friday or Saturday. She seems like a classy person of high integrity.

 

[Brodysseus]

Haven't watched PP's interview on the podcast, I am hard pressed to see how anyone can question her actions on Friday or Saturday. She seems like a classy person of high integrity.

She is.

The situation absolutely sucks for Hokom and I'm sorry it happened to her. But it is what it is.

 

[biscoe]

There is nothing wrong with the rule as it stands. It should be super punitive to show up late.

I don't play golf competitively but I would guess the penalty there is DQ.

 

[AndyJB]

All the people who are crying that they should have started late:
NONE of you have answered the question: what if it had been someone on the 4th or 5th card?

 

[Dan Ensor]

All the people who are crying that they should have started late:
NONE of you have answered the question: what if it had been someone on the 4th or 5th card?

I think it has been answered: tournaments have been delayed for far sillier things than a car accident. Probably for people 4th card or lower.

Maybe it's a logistical nightmare, but maybe it isn't? Wouldn't the TD know if it is?

 

[Brokensaint]

The rules ARE the rules. Foot faults, missed holes, conduct, dress codes, relief et al. Why would anyone propose more lenient rules for top-tier players? That doesn't make any sort of sense.
This isn't to say that what happened to Ms. Hokkum wasn't awful (the accident, I mean), nor is it to imply that she was anything less than a warrior for still showing up, taking her strokes (as prescribed by the rulebook) and playing strong.
But the rules, they are.
For everyone.

 

[corin_brown]

Ms. Hokkum

I hope this thread never dies. If for no other reason than to see how long it takes before people stop butchering her name.

Post #255 and counting...

 

[SonicGuy]

All the people who are crying that they should have started late:
NONE of you have answered the question: what if it had been someone on the 4th or 5th card?

I said they should wait for anyone like 10 pages ago...

 

[Nemmers]

Nobody wants to be given a win. Regardless of whether or not Sarah most likely would have won on her own, had the accident not occurred.

This....

 

[DavidSauls]

All the people who are crying that they should have started late:
NONE of you have answered the question: what if it had been someone on the 4th or 5th card?

Or 20 minutes or 45 minutes or 2 hours....

Or an early round, or even the first round....

Or not quite as dramatic as this accident, but just as uncontrollable, like car trouble....

Or tournaments other than Worlds.....

I don't think you're going to get an answer, or at least not a firm principle for guidance in the future.

 

[DiscJunkie]

Part of me wanted PP to drop a few putts on the final hole as an acknowledgement that SH was indeed the best female player at this Worlds competition.
However, I cannot fault her for sealing the win for herself, however conflicted she may have been.
There is no tradition in golf or disc golf for anyone to purposely drop strokes to ensure another wins. Our sport's rules are based on all players giving their best effort all the time. Indeed, if PP had decided to drop a few in order to let SH win, she may well have been called for unsportsmanlike conduct.
Sara is my hero for her courage and never-say-die attitude.
Paige is the World Champion.
And that's the way it should be.

 

[ru4por]

Or 20 minutes or 45 minutes or 2 hours....

Or an early round, or even the first round....

Or not quite as dramatic as this accident, but just as uncontrollable, like car trouble....

Or tournaments other than Worlds.....

I don't think you're going to get an answer, or at least not a firm principle for guidance in the future.

This^^ Bee stings, twisted ankles, family issues, sick kid, skunked dog.....late is late. Anywhere, anytime, anybody. The rest is minutia.