Trying to get a hill custom-made for a basket location. Need ideas and examples.

[hawk12]

I agree with the diagram, looks very nice and creates levels of good shots giving better putts. I also agree with Jen that there should not be entirely flat area on that green as it does allow for rollaways on some shots that might not 'deserve' to stay on that flattened out landing zone.

Basically suggesting a combination of that drawing, and keeping the "tiers" not entirely flat...

 

[tistoude]

That diagram makes me think after a rain your "green" will be pretty damp. All the water coming off the hill will sit on that flat spot. i would stay with a sloped green.

 

[New013]

Not if that amazing shot lands at an angle matching the slope. That's the point of baskets on slopes. You have to make a shot that lands the disc on plane with the slope. Otherwise, it's not an amazing shot at all.

I guess we just disagree on the risk/reward of just leaving it on the hill and the risk/reward of changing it in a way that leaves a small more level putting area behind the basket, while creating more danger than already exists below it.

I don't know how he plans to landscape the area afterwards but if the grass is anything but nonexistent you'd have to put the disc on a serious angle from just 120' for it to roll back down with just the slope. Secondly just leaving it as a slope creates no risk/reward other than the standard the closer you are the easier it'll be to make a putt. Not a lot of dynamics there that forces players to think about the shot.

If you change it to what I'm proposing you have a lot of new elements to think about. If you're short and off left or right, hit the side of a mound which now has more slope than the hill you're increasing the likelihood of a rollaway. Even if you land on the small small tops of the mound and stick you still have a putt that's more uphill than it was before because the basket is raised off the plane of the hill with the artificial landing area.

If you're basket high but left or right of the landing area you're still putting up because the basket is raised and because the basket is near the edge of that raised area a miss might leave you still off the landing area looking at the same putt again. If you nail the basket and ricochet towards a mound you might roll down really far.

If you go over the basket past the landing area now you have a serious death putt because missing the basket will definitely put you off the landing area, landing on a mound, possibly on the side of the mound and rolling. At the very least you're second putt is from one of the lower tiers back up.

With all of that I think rewarding people by landing in a 20' circle behind the basket that's semi-level isn't going to easy on people. Not to mention that landing there still leaves you with death putt where there is still a risk of going back down the hill substantially if you miss.

I'm just saying that my way creates a hell of a lot more risk/reward and I'd like to hear your opinion on how leaving it as is creates more. Even if you don't put in mounds and just make the small level area with the basket on the front of it you create more risk/reward. The basket is raised so any missed putts from any direction will be much harder than they were if you just left it as is.

 

[kyledstauffer]

I think the design is pretty cool! My concerns would be that you would need a retaining wall to keep that upper shelf the way it is. I'd recommend making that sheer drop off a little more sloped maybe 6 to 1? In any case if it's not going to be retained, let the grass grow longer on the slope for erosion control. The green should probably slope a tad for drainage, but I don't have a problem with it being mostly flattish. Cool two tier design

 

[Menacewarf]

That diagram makes me think after a rain your "green" will be pretty damp. All the water coming off the hill will sit on that flat spot. i would stay with a sloped green.

If they are spending all the money on excavation than put a French drain above the green and keep the green slightly sloped.

 

[Norcal]

Not if that amazing shot lands at an angle matching the slope. That's the point of baskets on slopes. You have to make a shot that lands the disc on plane with the slope. Otherwise, it's not an amazing shot at all.

This assumes that the 'green' is uniform and well-maintained. That's never the case in disc golf. Even a perfectly matched approach shot can hit a random weed clump, exposed root, rocks, etc., and roll away. Landing areas are a must on steep greens if we seek to reward skill and minimize random outcomes.

 

[Norcal]

Landing areas under the basket on steep greens also minimize rollaways stemming from a missed putt that hits the basket and lands on an edge. Why punish a putt that misses by inches worse than a putt that misses by feet?

 

[sidewinder22]

Landing areas under the basket on steep greens also minimize rollaways stemming from a missed putt that hits the basket and lands on an edge. Why punish a putt that misses by inches worse than a putt that misses by feet?

Because the person that missed by inches should have either laid up or made the putt.

 

[New013]

Even if with the landing zone I drew out a disc that hits metal and lands on edge could still end up way below. The basket wouldn't be in the middle, maybe 3' from the edge at most; and with the small size of the landing area if you're in it and you miss the putt you would probably deserve to go back down the hill.

 

[Norcal]

Because the person that missed by inches should have either laid up or made the putt.

The problem is that rollaways are too random. The crime (a barely missed putt), does not necessarily fit the punishment. One guy rolls 20', the next guy rolls 150' behind a stand of trees. Meanwhile the guy who airballed his putt has a tap-in. Without a landing area, even a good layup can roll away. Good design minimizes random results.

 

[sidewinder22]

The problem is that rollaways are too random. The crime (a barely missed putt), does not necessarily fit the punishment. One guy rolls 20', the next guy rolls 150' behind a stand of trees. Meanwhile the guy who airballed his putt has a tap-in. Without a landing area, even a good layup can roll away. Good design minimizes random results.

This probably varies with the type of terrain and the way hole plays. I don't think I've seen a layup from below the basket ever roll unless it hit something else that shouldn't be there or was a bad layup, but a roll away layup from above the basket is not uncommon. One could argue that the player should have put the drive or approach shot below the basket to minimize that risk. I think it just depends on the hole.

 

[JonCatch]

Being a civil engineer who works in grading there are a couple factors you must consider.

1. COST - talk to the engineer and find out if the project is looking to cut (export dirt) of fill (import dirt). Use this to assist in your design. If he's gotta bring in more dirt to make this basket happen, someone's gonna have to pay for it. Work around his constraints. The closer your hole matched the existing terrain, the cheaper it will be.

2. SCHEDULE - Keep in mind that a lot of design is prepared far in advance of construction, especially on public projects (roadways). It is not difficult to accommodate these requests early on, but after the plans have been prepared it can be very costly to change. Many companies use computer models to calculate earthwork quantities and they can be time consuming to adjust later. Additionally, if the plans have been reviewed and approved, they are not going to resubmit just to accommodate your disc golf needs.

3. EROSION - Stay below 4:1 slopes (4 ft horizontally : 1 ft Vertically). This is a very stable slope (11.25 degrees above horizontal). Steeper slopes are possible but undesirable by many municipalities. Also mention to the engineer that you'll be walking up and down these hills. Many times after construction they use a hydroseed mixture to establish plant growth but that takes some time. They may want to use a quicker mix or perhaps have a devoted trail up the hill.

Just a couple thoughts from a Engineer / Disc Golfer. Hope this all comes together, sounds like a great idea!

 

[denny ritner]

I agree with Norcal on the rollaway issue. For severe sloped greens (which I think are vital for the improvement of the sport), I'd put a small semi-circle of rocks or logs just below the basket (5 ft or so).

I also agree with Jen that leaving the basket on the slope is better for risk/reward considerations.

I think, however, that the best use of a sloped green like that is to have the approach shots coming in from the side or diagonally, not directly below. I think that throwing straight uphill or straight downhill are the worst uses of hills.

Also, if I'm reading the OP correctly, most players will have between 50 and 140 left for their third shots, putting many/most players in Houck's NAGS category.

 

[sidewinder22]

I think that throwing straight uphill or straight downhill are the worst uses of hills.

 

[denny ritner]

It's much more dynamic to throw sidehill or diagonal sidehill with the potential to put the nose up too much and hyzer far down the hill. Plus, as Jen mentioned earlier, the player must insure that the disc is oriented to land flat on the slope to avoid roll-aways.

Throwing straight uphill allows players to throw hard and not worry about distance control and minimizes mistakes. Throwing straight downhill is really just a matter of proper nose angle, whereas diagonal downhill shots require proper nose angle, wing angle, and power control.

 

[sidewinder22]

I don't think it's bad use of elevation. I think it's more fun throwing up and down although maybe not as technical. I think you need a lot more land to throw diagonally to slope due to errant disc potential. I also don't like walking along the slope with my bad ankles and knees.

 

[Almighty_Ed]

Not quite sure what your asking but here's one similar I just did at my local course. The basket was at the bottom of the hill and we had an S shaped goat path to get up to the next tee that nobody liked to climb. Moving the basket cut the hill climb in half and added a fun shot. I used 6x6 timbers keyed into the hillside and rebar driven through them 3-4ft into the ground. If your going to just use dirt it will be quite tricky to get it to stay without eroding.

 

[goosefraba1]

Necrobump.... lots of good info on this page right here that I will be using in the near future.

 

[goosefraba1]

This is a really good video I think for anybody building retaining walls in the future. Towards the end, he mentions putting in a deadman anchor. I hadn't thought about that... seems like a good way to keep the wall from slipping.

 

[JMONEY]

This is what you need

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1836&pictureid=33071