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The lost art of course reviewing

Part of the problem is that reviews get deleted here if the review doesn't conform to the DGCR unwritten rules.

Rule # 48: Houck courses no matter what can not be rated lower than 4.5.

Rule # 106: Any reviewer admitting to not taking the coronavirus jab is subject to review deletion at any time depending on the whims of the moderators.

Of course, the younger generations who may have discovered UDisc first and then come over here to review are often multiple down-thumbed for brief UDisc-style reviews which discourages them.

Finally the general lack of interest by the owner of this site in recruiting new writers or encouraging the old writers is a big reason this place is barreling towards obscurity. I've lost all interest myself as a reviewer and a course updater due to the agendas of the moderators here and the owner's attitude of nonchalance. Once they banned me for sixty days for a joke about Nikko, I realized UDisc is so vastly superior to this place that it's really not worth the effort here anymore. I just re-designed one of my courses and I won't even bother updating it on this website…it's like why make this place better when my work is completely unappreciated by the guy making money off the ads here? It's a two-way street: respect your reviewers who are giving their time for free and we'll post content here so you can make money doing nothing. No respect, no new content.

I've written over 250 reviews here and not once had one deleted so I can't speak on that or about Houck courses or corona virus, no idea what you're talking about there. The rest of it with regret I have to agree with.
 
anyone see udisc new updates

its pretty sick it tells you how much elevation and steps and hours and course traffic

i havent used it in full as i just have the basic free non account version

but its pretty state of the art

also on my recent trip when talkin to random locals it was 100% "do you have udisc" and no mention of dgcr


Kind of straying off topic but the feature that shows course traffic (based solely off of the number of people actively using Udisc at the time) is awesome. While it can't account for players not using the app to score, at least it's something.

I was deciding between two courses one evening and the data showed one course was busier than usual and the other course was less busy than normal. Went to the one that was less busy and sure enough the course had very few people playing it.

It's also nice that you can look by days of the week and see which days and times are usually not very busy. I found that one of the popular courses that always seems to be packed is almost empty on Sunday if you go around 3:30 or 4:00.
 
i would guess more than 10%, but probably less than 50%. i think a lot of thumbs(up) are just people that enjoy a good read/well written review.

yeah udisc is kinda equivalent to course conditions here, but also it can corroborate a bad course. my case in point: i traveled to sd this past weekend & brought a disc, but knew there was only one option with the amount of time i had (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=2469). i was still considering it as i got off the plane, so checked udisc & a review from a week ago says they quit after 4 holes for fear of losing discs. not wanting to lose my 1 disc, i didn't get to check of sd (yet). can someone please introduce disc golf to the west central portion (between rapid & pierre) of sd

Out of curiosity I looked at the reviews on UDisc. There were 2 total reviews, one was a 4 star saying "volunteers could make this a 5 star course!" and the other, written a month later was a 0.5 stating "Worst course, a miserable experience"
 
Generally, I only write reviews on a course I've played more than once (at least recently) or spent extensive time on that course in anticipation of writing said review for a one-time review (I will be doing that this week at Ryan C Kelly in PA--I've had this course on my wish list since it opened, as it's under an hour from Allentown). I hold back on local courses that need a review (I'm waiting for the Palm Beach club to finish Delray so I can write that one up) or a revisit (I've got a few up north that I will hit once the chilling 70-degree days of south Florida come upon us).

There's a lot of functions I didn't take advantage of in the earlier days (I'm DGCR #5) so I don't have a lot of posts, but I enjoy hole of the day and reviews, when I can (I don't travel much outside of south Florida).
 
I think reviews on this site do drop-off after a course has been reviewed a number of times. A number of my reviews are on older courses that haven't been reviewed in years, even if they are fairly popular and oft-reviewed on Udisc. Could be indicative of a few things. Lower popularity of this site, an "older" more established crowd here attractive less newcomers and new writers. Or perhaps the perception that everything that has been said about a course has already been outed by the time the 40th review is up.

As evidence, I will put up Anson B Nixon Park, where less than 15% of the reviews (7 out of 47) are from the last 5 years (2017 or newer). Add only one more if updates are considered.

This is rather problematic on all review sites as far as I can tell. Would you trust a 10 year old review, good or bad, on a restaurant likely has anything to do with the establishment your going to today? Chefs leave (or change), owners too, waitresses and waiters long gone, food supply differs, etcetera. While admittedly not as drastic with courses, I've seen enough changes in old homer courses in just my six years not to trust a 15 year old review. Even if they completely stagnate, that in itself can greatly change a course (usually for the worse) just with sheer plant growth.

So why count fifteen year old reviews towards the final rating just as much as a fresh review or update? I put Anson up as an example, because I consider that a course is really unfairly hammered by a distant past that should be rather irrelevant now. Ratings would need to become a bit more dynamic to reflect the here and now.

What we see in the reviewing world are two basic models. DGCR is much like Yelp. Past its heyday and not seen by the great masses but you can generally trust the reviewers to have thought out their position even if you don't agree with their ratings. You can gauge their experience by past reviews and number and location of courses written about. It's a much more thoughtful and accurate site, in general. Then you have Udisc, which is akin to Google Reviews. Both are the Oprah Winfrey of the reviewing world where you get a '5'! And you get a '5'! And you get a '5'! And you get a '5'!!! Et cetera ad nauseum.

A dead mall near me with only 5 ****ty storefronts out of 72 closed ones still gets a steady stream of 5s on Google reviews as if it were Mall of America in its absolute prime by nostalgists and other gold starrers who feel no obligation to actually inform others other than to wax poetic on what used to be. Udisc has much the same problem with homer bias and the masses who'd rate a multiple bees' hives as a 5 star course as long as it was in their neighborhood. Udisc, and maybe DGCR, would do well to also final review score based on player experience which could be quantified by number of courses played, score cards created, and so on.

But DGCR can't stand still and sit on its laurels if it wants to stay relevant. Being an old internet person (early 90s onward) I have seen many iterations of hobby-oriented communities, such as sites/forums/groups/mailinglists/BBS/etc, stagnate once a new phase of internet superceded the old spot and hollowed it out over time. DGCR obviously missed the smartphone app phase that popularized Udisc. I know there is an app, but it was obviously never a priority. I work with Udisc and they've improved by leaps and bounds over the years taking suggestions. I think Udisc will obviously continue to improve. They can easily start weighing reviews, like I suggested earlier, and institute a voting system as well.

I know I initially started using Udisc to get driving directions. It was super easy. And then I started using the maps to get starting points, cause some courses' starting points were cryptic. Now it's for scorecards. It can easily fix everything else.

If DGCR wants to go the quality route, it can also improve. For instance, it could institute quick reviews and ratings that are seperate from review ratings, since it will undoubtedly introduce much of the same 5 star bump Udisc has. Still, it should increase lurker engagement and I think subcategories of different aspects of courses can be optionally rated. Stuff like terrain, execution, maintenance, fun factor, and so on.

I also believe drone overviews will become a bigger thing in the DG world in the years to come. If a picture is worth a thousand words, then a video must be a million. It's a video that convinced me not to go to courses like Perkasie rather than reviews (not because it wasn't a good course, just that with my arm, it would be like tossing bowling bowls at a basketball hoop). I opted for Jordan Creek instead, that wouldn't give me that problem. And in the meantime, I try to search drone or course overview videos out for a course I want to visit.
 
i don't see any problems here at DGCR

on a site where basically all the content is user-generated, you can be the change you want to see or shut the f*ck up. the idea that the creator of this site owes anyone anything is some really spoiled, privileged bull$hit.
 
i don't see any problems here at DGCR

on a site where basically all the content is user-generated, you can be the change you want to see or shut the f*ck up. the idea that the creator of this site owes anyone anything is some really spoiled, privileged bull$hit.

Nice attitude toward people who actually like the site and want to see it succeed in the long term.

Yeah, everything is fine, nothing to see here. Please re-insert head in the sand.

SMH...
 
Nice attitude toward people who actually like the site and want to see it succeed in the long term.

Yeah, everything is fine, nothing to see here. Please re-insert head in the sand.

SMH...


i don't know what you're talking about. i assumed it was obvious my post was a response to the troll in post #59, perhaps i was wrong. sorry for the confusion.

however, DGCR isn't broken, there's nothing to fix. i really like this site and i will continue to use it. i'm not sure what you think succeeding in the long term means but DGCR is the same site it always was and i think there will always be an audience for that.

the existence and popularity of another site is not a threat to DGCR. the two offer distinct benefits for different priorities. if anything, uDisc highlights the real value of DGCR.
 
okay, now i saw this post and i can see the confusion

I also use it for navigation (seems to be quite accurate overall), and current course conditions too. Many DGCR courses have nothing in current conditions. Most have nothing remotely recent. I think that is because one by one, users are opting to use Udisc because it offers so much more IN THE FIELD.

We (users, mods, owners, whoever) can stand on past accomplishments, and yes the reviews here today totally blow Udisc away, but the brutal fact remains that unless some changes are made, I fear DGCR as a legitimate source for current course information/feedback will fade away in the next couple years, as more and more users simply switch to the other app. That is why I wish there was something in the app to allow for some quick thoughts on a course--no thumbs necessary.

DGCR has always been the Cadillac of review sites, but if no one is writing them any longer, or even reading them, is that car on the road being used, or just in a museum?

Are we there yet? Of course not. But we are trending in that direction. Now is the time to act to keep this review site viable. A site this large with such a treasure trove of info cannot be kept going by 50-100 good reviewers. There's just way too many courses these days.

that said, i think this is a bit of an alarmist perspective. there are definitely some improvements that could be made and your example of the lack of flexibility in layouts is a great point. i look forward to improvements but it seems they're unlikely to happen before a major overhaul. the reasons for that not happening to this point have been covered in other threads.

i take the general lack of things like course conditions updates as a personal call to action. i do updates whenever i play, though that's not as often as i'd like, but i try to take care of my local area.

i think the two sites self-sort their users, and plenty of people use both. i don't see the end of DGCR's relevance or audience.
 
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i don't know what you're talking about. i assumed it was obvious my post was a response to the troll in post #59, perhaps i was wrong. sorry for the confusion.

however, DGCR isn't broken, there's nothing to fix. i really like this site and i will continue to use it. i'm not sure what you think succeeding in the long term means but DGCR is the same site it always was and i think there will always be an audience for that.

the existence and popularity of another site is not a threat to DGCR. the two offer distinct benefits for different priorities. if anything, uDisc highlights the real value of DGCR.

I guess it was not so obvious (to me anyway though I can be dense) since it was not quoted directly, and there have been several posts suggesting things that might be improved. :)

I understand your point of view (shared by many perhaps) that the two sites are distinct and perhaps even complementary. My take is simply that several examples are given in this thread of where someone uses Udisc instead of DGCR for various tasks, and that perhaps this is occurring more and more. I think every time this happens, it then forces one to consider two sites for one round of disc golf. Not sure how many want to do that. I am not privy to stats, users, etc, but more than one person has complained about the lack (or decrease anyway) in recent reviews. This entire thread in fact is sort of touching on this. Just trying to bring some perspectives to these observations.

Thinking well of this site, while at the same time being concerned about its future are not mutually exclusive.
 
I won't be writing any reviews here. You guys are sticklers about what you do and don't want in a review. Also, weird things that some of the reviews here ding a course for aren't things that I would even factor in to the quality of a course. Basically there's no way I'm investing time to tell people what I thought about a course only to have them tell me why I am wrong or why my review isn't a "quality" review. It's just too hard to punch someone through the internet.

I would appreciate your opinion about courses you've played.

Doesn't mean it is the final word, but I would read it.

In doing reviews I do think it is relevant to understand who the reviewer is to provide perspective. If it's someone that throws 2X as far as I do, that's ok, but I can adapt the information to my play

Not suggesting that everyone needs to review every course they play, but if you give a thoughtful review from your perspective, it is appreciated.

A thoughtful review doesn't have to be exhaustive. But something about your experience is appreciated.
 
Part of the problem is that reviews get deleted here if the review doesn't conform to the DGCR unwritten rules.

Rule # 48: Houck courses no matter what can not be rated lower than 4.5.

Rule # 106: Any reviewer admitting to not taking the coronavirus jab is subject to review deletion at any time depending on the whims of the moderators.

Of course, the younger generations who may have discovered UDisc first and then come over here to review are often multiple down-thumbed for brief UDisc-style reviews which discourages them.

Finally the general lack of interest by the owner of this site in recruiting new writers or encouraging the old writers is a big reason this place is barreling towards obscurity. I've lost all interest myself as a reviewer and a course updater due to the agendas of the moderators here and the owner's attitude of nonchalance. Once they banned me for sixty days for a joke about Nikko, I realized UDisc is so vastly superior to this place that it's really not worth the effort here anymore. I just re-designed one of my courses and I won't even bother updating it on this website…it's like why make this place better when my work is completely unappreciated by the guy making money off the ads here? It's a two-way street: respect your reviewers who are giving their time for free and we'll post content here so you can make money doing nothing. No respect, no new content.



:D
 
I am not privy to stats, users, etc, but more than one person has complained about the lack (or decrease anyway) in recent reviews. This entire thread in fact is sort of touching on this. Just trying to bring some perspectives to these observations.


yeah, i've seen a lot of these complaints but i don't think they are founded in reality. no offense to those who think that but i don't see it.

reviews disappear off the front page in no more than a day or two and it has never been faster. it's true that the same dozen or so people are doing the lion's share of that work but they aren't the only ones. it seems there are more baggers than ever before and more of them are writing reviews, and good ones.

the increase in uDisc style reviews seems to have gotten under some people's skin but there have always been poor reviewers. i think the dropping off of some formerly very active members contributes to the impression that DGCR has a retention issue but i think that speaks more to people entering different stages of life and shifting priorities than any disappointment or disenfranchisement with the site itself.
 
yeah, i've seen a lot of these complaints but i don't think they are founded in reality. no offense to those who think that but i don't see it.

reviews disappear off the front page in no more than a day or two and it has never been faster.

Well Idk if it means anything other than the sheer convenience of a smartphone, but if I want to be pretty sure to hit all the courses in an area, I do look at UDisc. Granted, you're not gonna miss any Maple Hills here, but I have seen more than a few 9ers exist for years before getting added here. I think I added at least six of them this year, usually after I get a chance to play them, cause I have a special place in my heart for the crappy little courses.

The only ones I don't add are those on campgrounds, only free to guests or paying for a 1,600 foot course, type of deal. Kinda hard to justify doing work for the owner for a third rate course.
 
reviews disappear off the front page in no more than a day or two and it has never been faster. it's true that the same dozen or so people are doing the lion's share of that work but they aren't the only ones. it seems there are more baggers than ever before and more of them are writing reviews, and good ones.

the increase in uDisc style reviews seems to have gotten under some people's skin but there have always been poor reviewers. i think the dropping off of some formerly very active members contributes to the impression that DGCR has a retention issue but i think that speaks more to people entering different stages of life and shifting priorities than any disappointment or disenfranchisement with the site itself.

Isn't that just a symptom of the growth disc golf has seen in the last 3-5 years? You add a million players (or whatever it is) to the game over a short period of time and you're going to see at least some new people here. I'm not sure the growth of DGCR (and the droppers) are keeping up with the overall growth of players in disc golf, IMO.

Well Idk if it means anything other than the sheer convenience of a smartphone, but if I want to be pretty sure to hit all the courses in an area, I do look at UDisc. Granted, you're not gonna miss any Maple Hills here, but I have seen more than a few 9ers exist for years before getting added here. I think I added at least six of them this year, usually after I get a chance to play them, cause I have a special place in my heart for the crappy little courses.

That's also a problem because this site is supposed to be for course baggers yet it doesn't have listed all of the courses to be bagged. I just recently moved to Idaho and had to add a bunch of courses because they weren't listed here. I played a private course and the owner told me I couldn't add it here and he wasn't going to add it here because "Udisc is much easier to make course changes and I'd rather not have multiple areas to update my course on. Everyone who plays disc golf uses Udisc, never heard of DGCR"
 
Inspired by this thread, I made my first review for a fun little nine hole course. It's a work in progress and hopefully my current rating is fairly accurate. Having talked to the course designer about future plans I think it could be a 4.0 to 4.5 type of course.

Not sure how to link it but if you look up The Owl's Den in Thornton, CO you'll find it.
 
Inspired by this thread, I made my first review for a fun little nine hole course. It's a work in progress and hopefully my current rating is fairly accurate. Having talked to the course designer about future plans I think it could be a 4.0 to 4.5 type of course.

Not sure how to link it but if you look up The Owl's Den in Thornton, CO you'll find it.

Here's the course!

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=12783
 
Ironic how some complain there aren't many reviews these days, yet cheer at the thought of certain reviewers leaving the site.

Definitely displays the pretentious attitude so rife at this dinosaur of a website. Don't dare break unwritten rule # 12—only reviews that agree with the aging dinosaur reviews from 12 years ago will be welcome.

Most of all, do not violate unwritten rule # 1 which is, Flip City, no matter how many better courses are built, will always have reviews deleted that will drop it out of the top 10.
 

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