2010 USDGC

[biscoe]

also- i believe the university is the more likely entity to want it gone...

 

[12StonesScott]

Because there are a few other courses much better than Winthrop.

Flyboy for one, Flip City for two and so on.

Much as I love Flyboy, and as astonished as I have been at what Kelly and his family have done there, I have serious questions about the feasibility of running a major event there, particularly one that runs over multiple days and that is expected to draw a significant number of spectators and that requires lots of staff and volunteers. That *is* a live runway, and several of the holes play down taxiways, on which planes have the right-of-way. Keeping 72 or so competitors out of the way of all that for 5 hours is one thing -- keeping several hundred people out of the way for 10 to 12 hours is another. Not to mention that there's absolutely nothing -- not even a convenience store -- for several miles around, so everyone would have to either camp in the large but ultimately limited space on Kelly's property, or stay in hotels that are a half-hour or more away, and meals would have to be either pre-prepared and brought in or prepared and served by Lillian (and it's one thing to do that for a foursome or two, but quite another to do it for several hundred people). There's no sidewalks, roads, etc. that would work that well for getting spectators to key points on the course for watching the action, and getting from one place to another would often involve crossing live fairways (not to mention the runways and taxiways). An ADGO event with 70-80 people pretty much fills up the available area to park on Kelly's property, so Kelly's neighbors would have to be even more indulgent than they've already shown themselves to be to cope with several times that many vehicles. The mere existence of the course is a testament to the good relations Kelly has with the neighbors and the developer of the neighborhood, but there are limits to what even the most complaisant folks will put up with in and around their own property.

Not saying it's impossible, mind you, and if anyone could pull it off it'd be Kelly and crew, but it'd be a major logistical challenge.

 

[12StonesScott]

Not to take anything away from the all-important "SUV in the lake" topic, but the next biggest story so far has to be what "stroke-and-distance" has done to the scores, particularly for some of the big names: Val Jenkins and Nate Doss tied at 95th with a 9 over, only one stroke ahead of 13-year-old current MJ3 World Champ Daichi Inoue, for example, or Avery Jenkins in 71st at 6 over. Saw a ton of laying up yesterday from players who would have been going for it last year, and both Avery and Nate looked like it was all they could do to keep from launching into tirades against the rule change in their post-round interviews.

The upper reaches of the leaderboard (aside from Nikko and Schusterick at the top) include a lot of older guys who don't necessarily have the biggest arms but have outstanding control and putting skills -- Climo, Feldberg, Schultz, John McCray, Jay Reading, Dean Tannock, Phil Arthur, Brad Hammock, Cam Todd, Joe Mela, etc., but then there are exceptions -- Garrett Gurthie is up there, Ulibarri, McBeth, Koling.

Gonna be interesting to see if the big numbers find the guys who dodged them yesterday, or if some of guys at the top can continue to keep it (mostly) inside the ropes and hay bales.

 

[biscoe]

i told vegan ray last night that i thought the change would benefit guys like kenny and barry the most and predicted a climo victory.

 

[Ripper]

Not to take anything away from the all-important "SUV in the lake" topic, but the next biggest story so far has to be what "stroke-and-distance" has done to the scores, particularly for some of the big names: Val Jenkins and Nate Doss tied at 95th with a 9 over, only one stroke ahead of 13-year-old current MJ3 World Champ Daichi Inoue, for example, or Avery Jenkins in 71st at 6 over. Saw a ton of laying up yesterday from players who would have been going for it last year, and both Avery and Nate looked like it was all they could do to keep from launching into tirades against the rule change in their post-round interviews.

The upper reaches of the leaderboard (aside from Nikko and Schusterick at the top) include a lot of older guys who don't necessarily have the biggest arms but have outstanding control and putting skills -- Climo, Feldberg, Schultz, John McCray, Jay Reading, Dean Tannock, Phil Arthur, Brad Hammock, Cam Todd, Joe Mela, etc., but then there are exceptions -- Garrett Gurthie is up there, Ulibarri, McBeth, Koling.

Gonna be interesting to see if the big numbers find the guys who dodged them yesterday, or if some of guys at the top can continue to keep it (mostly) inside the ropes and hay bales.

It's friggin stupid, but it does give you way more respect for Nikko though as a complete Disc Golfer

 

[Craig639]

We need to have a drug test before any major tournament to show the world that we are trying to change disc golf's black eye. That way it would cut the field down to 1/3 or 1/4 and heck I could go up and qualify!

This will never happen.
Especially after California fully legalizes the substance this November. Once that happens, other west coast states will likely follow.

In fact, who knows, eventually dg tourneys may be sponsored by companies in the business...just like a beer company sponsoring a tourney.

Everybody complains about these "black eyes"... All I can say is snowboarding and skateboarding companies and competitions (that actually do get TV coverage), are REALLY HURTING....obviously dripping with sarcasm.

 

[1978]

Ropes are a factor. I played a practice round with Nikko. He just played holes smart and took his birdies when he could, where it was safe. Stable Teebirds and Buzzzes and a few destroyer shots when safe thrown in.

JohnE had an 11! but is a smart player. The scores are out there; if you play smart you will be fine. Some of those guys like Avery just want to use their D and you can't do that this year. I wouldnt expect much from Valerie, she is a 957 rated girl that fills a spot due to sponsorship exemption. The course wasn't made for her skill level. Maybe in a tight wooded course she would have a chance. She finished 146/191 last year. Either way, scores are about 5 strokes a round higher...on a curve for the lower skilled players who have an even harder time with the OB's.

 

[1978]

This will never happen.
Especially after California fully legalizes the substance this November. Once that happens, other west coast states will likely follow.

In fact, who knows, eventually dg tourneys may be sponsored by companies in the business...just like a beer company sponsoring a tourney.

Everybody complains about these "black eyes"... All I can say is snowboarding and skateboarding companies and competitions (that actually do get TV coverage), are REALLY HURTING....obviously dripping with sarcasm.

They stay on TV because they are a circus. People doing more flips, faster speeds, higher jumps. Basically, because there is still room for people to go higher and fall harder...hey, lets have a snowboard race, but then put 3 no 4 people in it...hopefully they will all hit then roll 2 miles down a hill in a bloody tangle. Thats a real respectible sport (sarcasm). 250 and 125 CC racing used to be on ESPN every Sunday morning. That was real racing and sport. That is gone now. Now you can barely find "extreme" sports except for the week of the xgames and maybe a few teaser weeks before and after. It will go away once people find other stuff that satisfies their need to see people get hurt.

Cigarettes and alcohol are legal and most places frown on you coming to work drunk and would not sponsor a sporting event where everyone was drunk. cigarette advertising has been banned from almost every outlet. Removal of alcohol from advertising and sporting events is on the rise. We will all be old and grey before a bud company is sponsoring anything worth while. Its about gaining acceptance from the mainstream market. Pot smoking will have a long way to go, even if legalized.

 

[Craig639]

Removal of alcohol from advertising and sporting events is on the rise.

BAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

This made me laugh... do you watch ANY sports on TV?

 

[Cgkdisc]

The sad thing is that Throw & Distance is the biggest story this year. I doubt that has ever been the story for a ball golf event. Not even close. I checked ball golf stats for several big events and in the events with the most OB including ones with the famous hole 17 island hole, the total field of players averaged about one OB penalty per tournament, not per round, and most of those were not stroke and distance penalties.

 

[Fender088]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

This made me laugh... do you watch ANY sports on TV?

x2

I'll agree that tobacco companies have been kept out of various advertising circles because that's a plain fact, but alcohol companies are as present as ever. At least at any major sport. It's hard for me to even imagine a football, basketball, baseball, or soccer game without alcohol ads.

 

[12StonesScott]

The sad thing is that Throw & Distance is the biggest story this year. I doubt that has ever been the story for a ball golf event. Not even close. I checked ball golf stats for several big events and in the events with the most OB including ones with the famous hole 17 island hole, the total field of players averaged about one OB penalty per tournament, not per round, and most of those were not stroke and distance penalties.

Sad because you disagree with the rule changes and tightened OB lines, or sad because the best players in the sport have so much trouble with them?

Not arguing either way, myself, just curious about what your thoughts are.

 

[Ordered Chaos]

I have no problem whatsoever with the stroke and distance rule. The players knew about it going into the tournament and should be prepared for it. If top players play intelligently they can get around Winthrop Gold with very few problems. Its when you try to force the issue on some shots that leads to the "big number".

 

[12StonesScott]

Nate seems to have adjusted a bit today -- all birdies except for a bogey on 5 through six holes so far. Hole 5 seems to have been a bear for the lower cards today -- seven or eight cards with only about 4 pars among them, lot of 7s, 8s, and 9s, and some 11s.

And Harold Duvall is 20 over through six holes.

 

[Cgkdisc]

It's not disc golf. It's a different version of the game. Any sports writer with any ball golf understanding would mock us for this punitive structure. Normal OB (last point IB) and selective use of the buncr rule work well for risk/reward elements in the game. It's just all risk this year for the same shot. If adding one more shot penalty to the way OB is normally played (last point IB) or the buncr rule (distance penalty only) makes things better, why not add 2, 3 or 4 to the penalty?

At some point, adding more penalties doesn't make sense, right? Is it going from 1 to 2 or 2 to 3 shots where it finally doesn't make sense? The risk/reward balance was already there before. No more penalties were required. It's sort of the difference between playing capture the flag with paintballs versus live ammunition. The game is challenging enough with just paintballs.

 

[Cgkdisc]

And Harold Duvall is 20 over through six holes.

Looks like he may have taken par+4 on his first four holes maybe not joining the group until hole 5. Might have had to talk with the Winthrop people about yesterday's events before playing.

 

[12StonesScott]

It's not disc golf. It's a different version of the game. Any sports writer with any ball golf understanding would mock us for this punitive structure. Normal OB (last point IB) and selective use of the buncr rule work well for risk/reward elements in the game. It's just all risk this year for the same shot. If adding one more shot penalty to the way OB is normally played (last point IB) or the buncr rule (distance penalty only) makes things better, why not add 2, 3 or 4 to the penalty?

At some point, adding more penalties doesn't make sense, right? Is it going from 1 to 2 or 2 to 3 shots where it finally doesn't make sense? The risk/reward balance was already there before. No more penalties were required. It's sort of the difference between playing capture the flag with paintballs versus live ammunition. The game is challenging enough with just paintballs.

Thanks, Chuck. I thought that was what you meant, but I could read your previous post either way and wanted to make sure I understood correctly.

 

[12StonesScott]

Looks like he may have taken par+4 on his first four holes maybe not joining the group until hole 5. Might have had to talk with the Winthrop people about yesterday's events before playing.

Could be -- he would be the only player not to par or birdie at least one hole of the first 5 otherwise.

Then again, he's now 33 over after 12, taking a 7,9,8,6 on 9 through 12.

 

[bigt]

The sad thing is that Throw & Distance is the biggest story this year. I doubt that has ever been the story for a ball golf event. Not even close. I checked ball golf stats for several big events and in the events with the most OB including ones with the famous hole 17 island hole, the total field of players averaged about one OB penalty per tournament, not per round, and most of those were not stroke and distance penalties.

All OB (marked by white stakes) shots in ball golf are stroke and distance, what you may be seeing is a shot into a hazzard (marked by a red stake)(water around an island green) is not stroke and distance it is line of flight where the ball went into the hazzard or a drop zone + one stroke.

http://www.golflink.com/list_1507_out-bounds-golf-rules.html

 

[12StonesScott]

Meanwhile, Philo Braithwaite has come back strong after a horrible day yesterday (+14, including a 10 on hole 9) -- 5 birdies and an eagle, with only one bogie, to be -6 after 12.