2015 Pro Worlds full- Another registration fiasco?

[Mr. Anderson]

Does everybody want to see higher pay outs or maybe the tournament staff getting paid? Since forever, Disc Golf Players have added the most money to the payout through entry fees. If a event has such a demand that it sells out 144 spots in 10 hrs, then the PDGA and hosting club should choose to make sure the entry fee reflect the demand and raise entry fees. C- Tiers are for introducing the game and making sure competitive disc golf is affordable.

 

[JC17393]

The problem in this thread and, frankly, every thread like it, is that people are arguing for or expecting Worlds to be something it isn't. Ratings mean nothing for Worlds. Never have. You earn an invitation by attending events, not winning events or even necessarily playing well in events (though winning obviously makes it easier to qualify). A 960 rated pro who plays 15 events to earn his points to qualify deserves equal chance to go to Worlds as a 1020 rated player who played 10 events to get his invite.

If the registration criteria is going to change, the invitation criteria is going to have to change too. Somehow I don't see that happening anytime soon.

 

[Timeetyo]

The problem in this thread and, frankly, every thread like it, is that people are arguing for or expecting Worlds to be something it isn't. Ratings mean nothing for Worlds. Never have. You earn an invitation by attending events, not winning events or even necessarily playing well in events (though winning obviously makes it easier to qualify). A 960 rated pro who plays 15 events to earn his points to qualify deserves equal chance to go to Worlds as a 1020 rated player who played 10 events to get his invite.

If the registration criteria is going to change, the invitation criteria is going to have to change too. Somehow I don't see that happening anytime soon.

Why can't it? If the PDGA feels the points earned are more important than the rating, then why not have a tiered registration by points then? The touring pros won't have a hard time getting the points in, so they'd be ok that way as would the "decent" player who is out there every weekend chipping away at the points required.

 

[captain jack]

 

[davetherocketguy]

Poor touring pro making money playing disc golf has a sad. So what. Move on...

This made me lol pretty hard...and I couldn't agree more.

 

[The Happy Gilmore]

Wah! I didn't get in to World's....

If a player has completed what is required to enter and has paid his money he has just as much of a right to play as the defending world champ or any top pro.

I'm am so sick of this argument.

Poor touring pro making money playing disc golf has a sad. So what. Move on...

Maybe if the top guys miss a few events they might learn to set an alarm or 2 to make sure they get off their asses and register before the thousands of players that might have qualified for their first worlds and are eager to sign up and have an experience of a life time.

It's no one's job to baby sit a touring pro. They are big kids they can fend for themselves.

^^Am for life

 

[AndyJB]

I was playing a non-sanctioned tourney event the day that registration for the Memorial opened. Right on cue, the whole course lit up with phone alarms and people stopped to let others register. Everyone got in.

Not that hard.

me being a super ****ty disc golfer has no relevance here. I'm not looking to go to any type of Worlds (never have a chance of qualifying, for one thing) but if something is important to me, I make sure all my t's are crossed and i's are dotted. Simple. As. That.

 

[gcr_russell]

The idea that people should have prioritized Worlds registration and the idea that it could have been done differently are not mutually exclusive. Should top pros have made sure they had their stuff together and registered in time with the way things have been? Of course. Does that mean the current system is the correct system? Of course not. Something obviously needs to be done or this kind of reaction wouldn't keep happening. In the event that it wasn't implemented this time around (yet again for who knows what reason) people (and their sponsors) needed to make sure they got in.

 

[The Happy Gilmore]

me being a super ****ty disc golfer has no relevance here.

It has everything to do with it.

 

[araytx]

So many different thoughts, but everyone seems to be approaching it based upon what they think Worlds is. The problem is everyone doesn't think "Worlds" is the same thing. You can't change what "Worlds" is. If you want to do something totally different, then create a new tournament and call it whatever you want to -- The National Championships, the International Championships, the BCS... for all I care.

Several people say, there should only be one division ... don't we already have that tournament -- the USDGC? Tiered registration? Well welcome back the sandbagging ratings-protecting pick-your-course tourney selection process. We just a couple years back created the 888 to deal with some of that.

Worlds is just a unique situation and a truly unique tournament. It's the only one all year long like that. No other tournament has the atmosphere of everyone there, the 5-day 7 1/2 round format, the chance for juniors and other divisions which rarely fill to actually have a competitive division, etc. I don't see a solution that involves keeping it "Worlds," except maybe having certain events being "qualifying events" for the calendar year prior, and tallying that way. To be fair, I don't think you can do it by rating because that'll lead to ratings games, and I don't think you can do it by points because that favors those people who live in areas with a lot of tournaments.

 

[scarpfish]

I was playing a non-sanctioned tourney event the day that registration for the Memorial opened. Right on cue, the whole course lit up with phone alarms and people stopped to let others register. Everyone got in.

Not that hard.

What if this magical moment when registration opens happens to be in the middle of someone's work shift. Not everyone works M-F 9 to 5.

me being a super ****ty disc golfer has no relevance here. I'm not looking to go to any type of Worlds (never have a chance of qualifying, for one thing) but if something is important to me, I make sure all my t's are crossed and i's are dotted. Simple. As. That.

Doesn't override the fact that an invitation to a competition to establish World Champion should be based on performance based criteria done over an entire year, and not just who can be online at the right moment. If criteria to get in were points based, Mr. 930 rated journeyman won't need to be on his computer at midnight as he knows he won't have a chance. He might elect to work on his game and play more tournaments instead.

 

[scarpfish]

My proposed solution...

1. Leave the invite criteria as is (as it will be essentially meaningless).
2. Open registration, but with a new twist. Instead of paying the full entry fee for your division you pay a flat $50 deposit towards it. For 3-4 weeks, anyone with an invite can pay this deposit.
3. If the number of deposits exceeds the number of spots (which it likely will), who gets a spot reserved and who doesn't will be done by previous years points.
4. People on the right side of the cut line will get 2 weeks to guarantee their spot by paying the balance of their entry fee (they must also be registered for the current year and have their officials test passed).
5. People on the wrong side of the cut line will have the option of having their deposit held and going on the waiting list, or getting it refunded. Any reserved spots not filled go to the top people on that list.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Does everybody want to see higher pay outs or maybe the tournament staff getting paid? Since forever, Disc Golf Players have added the most money to the payout through entry fees. If a event has such a demand that it sells out 144 spots in 10 hrs, then the PDGA and hosting club should choose to make sure the entry fee reflect the demand and raise entry fees. C- Tiers are for introducing the game and making sure competitive disc golf is affordable.

Lol but that seems to make too much sense.

 

[The Happy Gilmore]

For those of you who have no problem with amateurs getting into "Pro Worlds" and actual Pros being wait listed, would you have the same opinion if the top 100 Pros in the world somehow did not get into the tournament and the entire tournament was filled with a bunch of ams and a few actual pros?

 

[Usher]

Tired registration is the way to go. 1000+ first (day to two), 975+ next, then 950+, and everyone else.

I think Am Worlds should be the same way. 925+, 900+, everyone else.

Give those that actually have a chance to compete a chance to play.


We have the same "issue" here in Colorado where tournaments crash websites and fill within the hour. It gets really crazy. We have split tournaments up to Ams on Saturday and Pros on Sunday and still have the same thing happening. I proposed that PDGA members get priority registration for the tournaments. Then let non members sign up.

 

[Dan Ensor]

The problem in this thread and, frankly, every thread like it, is that people are arguing for or expecting Worlds to be something it isn't. Ratings mean nothing for Worlds. Never have. You earn an invitation by attending events, not winning events or even necessarily playing well in events (though winning obviously makes it easier to qualify). A 960 rated pro who plays 15 events to earn his points to qualify deserves equal chance to go to Worlds as a 1020 rated player who played 10 events to get his invite.

If the registration criteria is going to change, the invitation criteria is going to have to change too. Somehow I don't see that happening anytime soon.

Soooo much win in this post.

This is why I always think USDGC is a better title to have.

If the Worlds wants to be the best competing with the best, they have to get the best there. But they want the DG fanatics. That's cool too. Live and let live.

 

[davetherocketguy]

For those of you who have no problem with amateurs getting into "Pro Worlds" and actual Pros being wait listed, would you have the same opinion if the top 100 Pros in the world somehow did not get into the tournament and the entire tournament was filled with a bunch of ams and a few actual pros?

By the way, that's not what happend and not what is ever going to happen under the current system. Little what if scinarios are just that...

If they truly had 10 hours to reg as some have stated here then I have zero sympathy for those on the waitlist. If you're a "pro" then act like a freaking pro. Know and understand the system (no matter how stupid it is) and be prepared to take full advantage of it and be prepared to make whatever sacrifices needed to get into the big event. Getting up early or staying up a few hours later is not that big of a sacrifice.

On the other hand, the current system of first come first serve on the biggest events of the year seems rather absurd. Hence one of many reasons I am not a PDGA member anymore.

 

[JC17393]

For those of you who have no problem with amateurs getting into "Pro Worlds" and actual Pros being wait listed, would you have the same opinion if the top 100 Pros in the world somehow did not get into the tournament and the entire tournament was filled with a bunch of ams and a few actual pros?

This needs to be said...again...AMATEURS CAN'T AND DIDN'T GET INTO WORLDS AHEAD OF PROS. Amateurs aren't invited to Pro Worlds. Pros are invited to Pro Worlds. Every single player registered for Worlds is...a...pro. Those that got in met the same invitation and registration criteria as those on the waitlist. There is nothing inherently unfair or untoward going on here.

And considering it took 10 hours to fill, the arguments about it opening in the middle of the night while people were asleep or working fall short too. There was a more than reasonable window for someone to take five minutes to get in if they really wanted to. They announced the date and time of registration in December. After last year, there should be no expectation that it wouldn't fill quickly. There is no "woe is me, it caught me off guard" excuse that holds water.

Only way this changes is petitioning to have Worlds changed entirely...new qualifying, new registration, new event structure. Considering 2016 is booked and rumors are 2017 is as well, the change might be a ways off if it happens at all.

 

[DavidSauls]

Tiered registration? Well welcome back the sandbagging ratings-protecting pick-your-course tourney selection process. We just a couple years back created the 888 to deal with some of that.

Not necessarily. If I were appointed Worlds Registration Czar---not yet offered to me, but there's always hope---it would be a tiered registration, but not based on ratings. For the very reason you describe. Probably a combination of points (with a cap on huge events), NT standings, prior Worlds finishes, and ratings.

It should be possible to have the best players competing for a World Championship, and a huge field of people there for the experience. It doesn't have to be a choice between the two.

I agree with those who say that this year's pros had a 10-hour window to register, so all had reasonable opportunity to register. But that 10 hours wasn't set by the PDGA---it just happened that way. What if next year's registration, under the same rules, takes 20 minutes? Being available in the middle of the night, with an internet connection, and quick on the keyboard, is a poor standard for determining who should play---poor for the top pros, poor for your local 950-rated pro. Why not base entry to the disc golf world championships based on.....disc golf?

Well, that's my stump speech. Now to see if my Czar appointment is forthcoming.

(Actually, I hope its not. Like everyone else, I don't want to do the actual work. I wonder if the PDGA has a position for trusted backroom advisor?)

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Not necessarily. If I were appointed Worlds Registration Czar---not yet offered to me, but there's always hope---it would be a tiered registration, but not based on ratings. For the very reason you describe. Probably a combination of points (with a cap on huge events), NT standings, prior Worlds finishes, and ratings.

It should be possible to have the best players competing for a World Championship, and a huge field of people there for the experience. It doesn't have to be a choice between the two.

I agree with those who say that this year's pros had a 10-hour window to register, so all had reasonable opportunity to register. But that 10 hours wasn't set by the PDGA---it just happened that way. What if next year's registration, under the same rules, takes 20 minutes? Being available in the middle of the night, with an internet connection, and quick on the keyboard, is a poor standard for determining who should play---poor for the top pros, poor for your local 950-rated pro. Why not base entry to the disc golf world championships based on.....disc golf?

Well, that's my stump speech. Now to see if my Czar appointment is forthcoming.

(Actually, I hope its not. Like everyone else, I don't want to do the actual work. I wonder if the PDGA has a position for trusted backroom advisor?)

:clap: You have my vote, Czar.