[Question] Air Plastic Question

[lbond]

Ok so I've been trying to drop weight on some of the discs in my bag. I still keep a couple beefcakes around for headwinds, but other than that I'm trying to change as I'm getting old and weak.

I recently put up a post about getting a Lucid Air Escape and loving it. So then I went to Play It Again Sports last night and I found an Opto Air Saint that weighs in at 154g.

Does anyone know if the flight path of my Saints will change very much with the Opto Air Plastic?

I just always feel like it's a crap shoot with this stuff and don't want to waste $17 again. I've tried the Lucid Air, which didn't change the flight path much, and then tried a StarLite Wraith that flipped over and sailed away even in a huge tail wind. Help me not waste money on a turn and burn piece of junk!!!

 

[E_Rock25]

Light disc's take good form to throw correctly IMO. For very beginners they tend to be ok because the mechanics of a new player don't allow for much distance in the first place so they don't end up getting much into there throws. For a more experienced player throwing light stuff can be tricky and frustrating at times because we kinda know what we are doing. It will be more understable no matter what in a lighter weight but with good form and or less power it should fly similar. I don't have any experince with that mold so im no 100% but that has been my experience with other light disc's.

I throw a Blizzard Katana for Max D but I never throw it in a head or crosswind. Even a little bit of wind can be crazy with the light disc's.

 

[zmannz1984]

I have tried some Innova blizzard plastic and I would have to trial and error every disc if I was going to stock my bag with it. It seems to me a lot of faster molds get their stability from the shape of air they make when flying, and some get stability due to weight. I think this lends to how a light version will fly compared to a heavy version.

For instance, when I throw a 175 valkyrie or leopard, I can really torque on it with a hyzer release, and it will flip right up flat and GO. If I throw lighter valks on the same line, they tend to start turning further and further as the weight drops, until I get to a weight where no matter what it pretty much rolls.

When I throw bosses, I can throw a 175 and then a 170 and see a pretty good difference in flight, with the heavier disc being more stable at all times. But, dropping back to say a 167 vs a 150, I don't see nearly as much difference in flight, unless the wind is up or the lighter disc is getting worn.

Last, I don't like that the air molds seem to wear out to useless so quickly. My first blizzard disc was a wraith. It was great at first but after just a few weekends of use, it was like throwing a worn out DX disc. Not cool for the wallet, especially when I can't huck the light one much farther than the heavy one that lasts.

 

[AndyJB]

The Sweden air stuff seems to be a little better for throwing than Blizzard. Don't know about Prodigy stuff. But I chalk that up to them making smaller batches than Innova.

I use an Air Giant to slot between my max weight Giant and my Terns. It is still beefy but not AS beefy as the max weight. It's my third Air Giant and they all fly the same.

So, in my admittedly limited experience, I would Imagine your Saint would be pretty much the same as a regular Saint. Probably a bit more turn as long as your form is clean.

 

[SteezeOG]

I've found all blizzard discs after the good first run that had bubbles in the flight plate do not come out close in stability to the max weight ones. They are all very flippy in comparison.

Lat64 air plastic seems to run much closer to the normal weights but you still aren't going to find a perfect match many times. I only tried one air saint and it was really flippy but that's a small sample and I feel like I'm throwing cleaner and know more about what you can and can't do with the air discs so maybe I would like them now. Honestly if you like the air escape I don't see a need for an air saint. They will overlap a good deal. If you want something a little longer than the escape in an air plastic give the lucid air renegade a shot. Even longer than that you can try the air bolt or air trespass.

 

[lbond]

I've found all blizzard discs after the good first run that had bubbles in the flight plate do not come out close in stability to the max weight ones. They are all very flippy in comparison.

Lat64 air plastic seems to run much closer to the normal weights but you still aren't going to find a perfect match many times. I only tried one air saint and it was really flippy but that's a small sample and I feel like I'm throwing cleaner and know more about what you can and can't do with the air discs so maybe I would like them now. Honestly if you like the air escape I don't see a need for an air saint. They will overlap a good deal. If you want something a little longer than the escape in an air plastic give the lucid air renegade a shot. Even longer than that you can try the air bolt or air trespass.

Alright this leads me to another question then. I don't like to go above a speed 10 driver usually due to arm speed. They don't go any further for me they just bail out quicker.

But I did also see an Air Trespass last night too. And I know that another store near me has a couple Blizzard Destroyers. I know that the ligher plastic will help a little to compensate with my arm speed, but do you really think it will help that much?

 

[AndyJB]

Likely not. The light discs are easier to throw but they cut through the air a lot less as well.

 

[SteezeOG]

Alright this leads me to another question then. I don't like to go above a speed 10 driver usually due to arm speed. They don't go any further for me they just bail out quicker.

But I did also see an Air Trespass last night too. And I know that another store near me has a couple Blizzard Destroyers. I know that the ligher plastic will help a little to compensate with my arm speed, but do you really think it will help that much?

Probably not. If you're not getting the disc up to speed it's not going to make a huge difference if it's 159g or 170g. The renegade might be a tweener that is worth checking out but if you don't have the disposable income to just buy and try don't worry about it. It's speed 11. You might get a little more distance over the escape but you're probably better off just practicing more with what you have. Escape is a great mold I think. Balances between a long fairway and shorter control driver. If you feel most comfortable with speed 10 or less hold on to that discipline until you are confident you can benefit from the speed 12 stuff.

 

[Beener]

I bag (and love) a whole horde of AIR plastic discs: Saint, Saint Pro, Renegade, Sword and Trespass. The durability (~2 years of usage) has been equivalent to their non-AIR counterparts; OPTO / Lucid / VIP is just a tough plastic. And for my ~300 ft. arm, the AIR plastic is roughly the same stability as a light weight (mid 160's) GL / Fuzion / TP equivalent...

 

[lbond]

Probably not. If you're not getting the disc up to speed it's not going to make a huge difference if it's 159g or 170g. The renegade might be a tweener that is worth checking out but if you don't have the disposable income to just buy and try don't worry about it. It's speed 11. You might get a little more distance over the escape but you're probably better off just practicing more with what you have. Escape is a great mold I think. Balances between a long fairway and shorter control driver. If you feel most comfortable with speed 10 or less hold on to that discipline until you are confident you can benefit from the speed 12 stuff.

Yeah this is pretty much what I thought. I think the fastest things I keep in my bag wraiths, bandits, and a couple other ultra high-speed randos for extreme head or tail wind shots. Thanks Steeze!

 

[lbond]

I bag (and love) a whole horde of AIR plastic discs: Saint, Saint Pro, Renegade, Sword and Trespass. The durability (~2 years of usage) has been equivalent to their non-AIR counterparts; OPTO / Lucid / VIP is just a tough plastic. And for my ~300 ft. arm, the AIR plastic is roughly the same stability as a light weight (mid 160's) GL / Fuzion / TP equivalent...

This is perfect. Thanks!

 

[AndyJB]

Has Air plastic been around for two years already? How the time flies...

 

[SteezeOG]

Has Air plastic been around for two years already? How the time flies...

Little over a year I believe. Air trespass was one of the first and they were out a few months into 2013. Probably been about 15 or 16 months give or take.

 

[Beener]

Has Air plastic been around for two years already? How the time flies...

Don't forget about the "original" AIR Saint; released in October 2012. I (and my noodle arm) took to the bubbles right away... :thmbup:

 

[SteezeOG]

Don't forget about the "original" AIR Saint; released in October 2012. I (and my noodle arm) took to the bubbles right away... :thmbup:

Yeah King, Halo, and Saint all came out before the Trespass but I didn't remember it being that much sooner until I looked. Good call. It will be almost two years by the fall.

 

[Monkeypaws]

I started with a blizzard Wraith - Air Saint kicked it out of my bag because it flew true to form, whereas the Wraith was harder to handle and less HS stable.

 

[Mr. Butlertron]

I've been experimenting with 159 grams and below in blizzard & air for the last 6-8 months. It seems like the longer innova does blizzard drivers the better they get. I've had an early run blizzard destroyer, t-Rex, and even Ape that were flippy as hell, but the Bosses, Tern, and Firebird in Blizzard Gstar and Blizzard Champ that I got at the Japan Open are pretty much the same as max weight flight. They are a little less resistant to damage though. The true litmus test for bubble plastic is how well do the mids preform. That's the where the Lucid Aiir plastic shines. I have a Air Truth that is so amazingly similar to my max weight Buzz that I just ordered 4 more.

 

[dantheman0721]

I've been experimenting with 159 grams and below in blizzard & air for the last 6-8 months. It seems like the longer innova does blizzard drivers the better they get. I've had an early run blizzard destroyer, t-Rex, and even Ape that were flippy as hell, but the Bosses, Tern, and Firebird in Blizzard Gstar and Blizzard Champ that I got at the Japan Open are pretty much the same as max weight flight. They are a little less resistant to damage though. The true litmus test for bubble plastic is how well do the mids preform. That's the where the Lucid Aiir plastic shines. I have a Air Truth that is so amazingly similar to my max weight Buzz that I just ordered 4 more.

Blizzard Gstar? Is that a thing? I know there's Starlite, so I guess they can just run that in the pearly Gstar plastic. I would love to see that.

 

[Mr. Butlertron]

Looks like bubbles to me, but maybe I misspoke. I'll let you decide

 

[Mr. Butlertron]

Blizzard champ is on the left and gstar is on the right