You can always strain your pronator teres muscle and be reduced to backhands only like me rn.
Even if you have both a forehand and a backhand, slow under stable discs are helpful for uphill and tailwind/crosswind. Also, a hyzer flipped roller can go a lot farther than an anhyzer roller and can lengthen a career. Plus, hyzer flips are just plain fun.
In my experience the more overstable the disc, the longer it rolls. They resist turning over on the ground and fading out better than understable molds.
If anyone wants to see this theory in action just check out my zone os test on my youtube page. freakishly long rollers, from a putter of all things.
Both can go really far. But it's rare to find someone who's actually tried backhand rollers with firebirds, predators, XXX, fireballs, motions etc. They go far and straight.
Plus, hyzer flips are just plain fun.
Understable is essential. Forehand rollers out of the woods that go right instead of left and good turnover shots. I carry a driver,fairway,mid,and a putter for turnovers. Just depends on the situation.
Are you releasing them anhyzer? Or are you able to get these discs to flip?
In my experience the more overstable the disc, the longer it rolls. They resist turning over on the ground and fading out better than understable molds.
If anyone wants to see this theory in action just check out my zone os test on my youtube page. freakishly long rollers, from a putter of all things.
Both can go really far. But it's rare to find someone who's actually tried backhand rollers with firebirds, predators, XXX, fireballs, motions etc. They go far and straight.
Yeah, I guess OAT just kills an understable/lighter disc. I sure don't want it to get an less stable,
I'm enjoying seeing some new energy in a few recent threads!I'm old/weak/slow and in my third season of frequent play. I've really avoided anhyzer release so far making myself work with hyzer shots.
I was looking at a Mamba, and someone handed me a Wombat to throw the other day, which I chose to not take as an insult.
I thought of the Wombat that I could get that flight with a Buzzz thrown with a bit of anhyzer.
I've got a decent flick shot inside 200.
I do bag two Sidewinders, which are pretty straight disc thrown on hyzer although they do like to wander over to the right. I also use a Star Cheetah for hyzer flip tunnel shots.
I think it is so easy for me to straighten up and release on anhyzer that I've thought I don't need any understable discs.
Now I'm getting more release angle control that I am starting to wonder. Maybe I should work in some lighter weights of the discs I like.
Putting: Nylon Wizard x 2
Approach: Pure White Wizard (the most racist disc ever), Zone x 2 (Z and Jawbreaker)
Mids: Buzzz (Crystal Flex and Z), Star Cheetah
FD: Star Hawkeye x 2, G* Tbird/Champ Tbird, G* Eagle L x 2
D: Star Sidewinder/Glow Champ Sidewinder, Star Wraith x 2
I mean, I'm old, weak and slow. Almost all I throw are understable discs.
Most of our courses are these sort of wooded, tight shots you are talking about. Sometimes the open shots are the ones I don't know what to do with. I've got an astroturf practice field with frequent heavy winds and that allows me to work with height.I'm enjoying seeing some new energy in a few recent threads!
I read what everyone wrote and had a couple things to add. I think this all depends on your goals and where you currently are.
I mean, there's a lot of wisdom in this, and IMO no shame.
You've got folks on the other end like Mike C who is a young, athletic crusher able to rip OS stuff on anny with good effect (it works btw). You've got other folks chiming in closer to 3P or Mike C or in between. I'm somewhere splitting the difference between 3P and Mike C. I have access to ~400' distance lines, but I rarely golf with them and am still conservative while nursing some body issues. I also am developing my mechanics on a hyzer swing plane, and still find it easier (control-wise and posturally) to throw hyzer. So I'll talk from that perspective.
I am always working on my distance form to the extent my body can take it, but I golf much more conservatively to my benefit. If I see a 600' hole, I am happy to split it in two with two 300' shots with a Comet or driver hyzer than try to overextend and risk OB, etc.
In the field I am usually working on distance form, and I spend a lot of time getting loose and testing angles and aim at different apexes. On the course, I am playing conservative to a "stock" hyzer release angle every time I can, and modifying the apex as needed. I let the disc do the rest of the work as often as possible.
Since I play mostly in the woods and now seek courses with longer holes, I had a "happy accident" from my long run strategy that has immensely helped my game. Calvin is famous for his blistering tunnel shots. I've obviously got nowhere near his stuff, but I envied his ability to take wooded courses apart repeatably. How could I do what he does but with my form and armspeed? It just so happens that most wooded lines 300-350' or so near me require pretty good "laserbeam" control. Too high, left, right, or low (elevation) is death.
It just so happened that these shots are well-handled with me releasing on my preferred 20-30 deg. hyzer with an Avenger SS at 60-80%. Every time I have a tunnel with a low ceiling, I just aim to throw the same exact shot at whatever apex I need. The disc is a little "fast" on the short end of the range, but not if I have good control, and the placement is very reliable on a line with almost no left to right movement because it is flipping up during most of its flight. Then it just drops where I want it to.
Two weekends ago I hit the placement 4/4 times. On hole 18 from the long tee, a par 510' with a straight low ceiling tunnel shot with guardian trees at ~300', then numerous scraggly exceptionally low ceiling obstacles the last 200', and arguably the hardest technical par 4 on the course, I was in position after the drive, laced the only "good" low ceiling upshot gap with a standstill, then predictably missed my C1 in reg putt to collect my par. I was still pretty happy with that after a clean round with some newfound birdies and went back to my putting basket. Now I actually look forward to those laser beam lines because they don't scare me anymore.
The point of this story is that anything you do on the course is relative to your ability and goals now, and that might change according to your goals later. Maybe in 3 months I'll leave this strategy behind me, or maybe I'll realize it's exactly how I like to put birdies in play on most wooded holes and do it sustainably as I get older.
Most of our courses are these sort of wooded, tight shots you are talking about. Sometimes the open shots are the ones I don't know what to do with. I've got an astroturf practice field with frequent heavy winds and that allows me to work with height.
I have two Avenger SS discs—a flippy ESP and maybe a Z that is more reliable. I don't bag them because Sidewinder has that spot ATM.
Part of my issue is on the approach end, where I have Wizards and Zones. The Sol counters that whole situation, and allows me to slip through tight gaps at a pretty extreme hyzer and once flat or slightly turned, the glide makes for flat landings. That feel very different than powering up my Jawbreaker Zone (my straightest upproach). I'm often struggling off the tee when I have a strong tailwind. These discs (Underworld) round out some possibilities in that situation.
Yeah, I think it's interesting how individual slots/choices vary. The drivers that gel best for me usually are a combination of what feels good in my hand and gets the flight I want without feeling like I'm forcing too many adjustments to the disc. Just a personal preference. As my game/throwing changes I'm willing to go back to previous molds sometimes and am often pleased to find I can use them a lot better. Adjusting all these choices for wind takes time too, and there's the conventional wisdom more US for tailwind and more OS for headwind. I am glutton for punishment so I also spent some time throwing neutral discs in windy conditions on purpose to better understand how it knocks them around and glides or stalls them, which made me much better appreciate when and why to swap more OS or US.
I don't mow through a ton of molds/plastics these days, but I definitely believe in run-to-run variability and it's super noticeable (to me) on the understable end of the spectrum. When messing with understable plastics it can be frustrating to find the interaction between how you throw and the desired effect at first and for a while after that, and people end up with different preferences/synergies in their game. E.g., I had put the Avengers on the shelf for a while thinking it was too squirrely, but as I developed better body control I realized what I was doing was occasionally cranking it too close to flat or even anhyzer with poor release point/angle/trajectory/nose control. Then as I improved I still noticed meaningful differences across runs etc. I'll just muse in writing since I love the topic of understable plastics.My first Avenger SS was a fav., but was not with me long. The replacements seem very different. The ESP version seems floppy and flippy, and the Z has a thick flight plate and seems to not like to push forward like the old Titanium.
I have almost always carried a Star Cheetah, which is the most basic starter driver in a plastic that is a bit more OS. That is what has been getting me through the tailwind drives. That's a -2/+2 if I recall. With a 20 mph tailwind, I could still use something a bit more flippy. I also find it likes to throw that -2 turn out and widen the right side of the shot, which also gets me into trouble. The Avenger SS always seemed, when I threw it well, to have a slow, flat wander over to the right without much sense of wanting to come back. The Underworld flies more like a less stable Eagle L, in that it will, eventually, given enough height, want to fade a little. It also seems like maybe my first roller disc. The Sol is a different beast, slower than the Comet that you throw. It reminds me a bit of one of my first discs—a DX XD. It's a little more rounded nose, but very familiar in a way. It likes to flip up flat and glide, and will get a lot of use AND give me a good tool for dialing in release angles, which feels like the thing to be refining at the moment.
You bastard.Oh boy....here we go. You all know where this is headed....to the cult of Glitch. :wall:
HOT TAKE: The Glitch gets close, but don't go in.