Going to attempt my first dye, questions.

[sneakytiki]

So, after spending countless hours reading through information regarding disc dyeing, I am going jump right in... I should probably do something easy for my first dye...

I have a white icon clutch that I don't really care too much about. I have already stripped off the stamp with acetone. I bought some vinyl (some off brand I found at an art supply store for screen printing... I hope it works). I want to put an effect like the attached pic onto it, a bulged checkerboard.

Once the bulged checkerboard is on in black, I plan to fill the white space with a shaving cream marbling of a couple colors to be decided, and attempt to have it be darker around the rim, gradually getting lighter towards the middle.

Here is my hold up. I was about to start cutting up the image into the vinyl and I'm thinking "How is this going to work... all the squares will just fall apart, become disconnected..." So I think I might be going about it the wrong way. Now I am thinking I might cut out the squares with an xacto knife once the mask is on the disc... but I don't want to cut up the disc.

How difficult is it to cut out an image in vinyl already on the disc? Will I end up destroying the disc? Is there a better way of achieving my goal?

 

[pfpro]

Cut flat and use transfer tape (I use 4" painters tape to cover my designs) to take your whole design to disc. That being said, you can cut on a disc. I find it easier to work on a flat surface.

 

[Black]

I would tell you to maybe start a little simpler at first then work up to more
elaborate patterns. Sounds cool thou!!!
Have fun it gets addicting :thmbup:

 

[sneakytiki]

I just watched some youtube videos that might have cleared things up a little better. I was picturing everything just falling apart into squares once I cut it and before the transfer tape... but I guess I don't cut ALL the way through the vinyl backer and that holds it all together until I get the transfer tape onto it?

I would tell you to maybe start a little simpler at first then work up to more
elaborate patterns. Sounds cool thou!!!
Have fun it gets addicting :thmbup:

Eh, I want to crash and burn once. Humble myself.

 

[championlog22]

Correct. Don't cut all the way through the vinyl backing, only through the vinyl itself.

 

[bmxpunk01]

^^^ What Champion just said - cut through the vinyl only. then apply the transfer tape over top. Then peel off the vinyl backing & apply to the disc.

Easy-peasy, rice & cheesey.

 

[sneakytiki]

Well, Everything was looking good... until the transfer tape wasn't sticky enough to hold on to nearly half of the diamonds as I pulled away the vinyl backing... I scrapped it. Going to try again with stickier transfer tape, take more time pressing it down to get better adhesion. Its tough when there is as much white space as there is vinyl.

I may try doing the cutting on the disc. I found it easiest to cut out the image by using a light table to put dots at each intersection and then just make long sweeping cuts connecting the dots, they just peel up alternating squares/diamonds. The only problem I could see there is it is a lot harder to peel vinyl once on the disc.

 

[Eky8]

Cut everything. Then apply transfer tape. Transfer to the disc then weed out the areas you want dyed. I have found that is the easiest way to not fight this issue. Also if your transfer tape is too sticky it will stick to the vinyl better than the vinyl sticks to the disc.

 

[Tiny]

I only cut on discs cause I'm too lazy to move the design lol.

Be firm and gentle at the same time. AKA make sure you cut through the vinyl without scarring your disc. I also find that the disc tends to move up and down while cutting. If you are making the disc indent with the exacto, you are pressing too hard.

 

[Kodachrome]

I just started to do dyes as well. Listen to these dudes; they know what's up. I have limited experience, but I sorta jumped the gun on my fourth dye just like you're doing and went fairly elaborate as a challenge. i screwed up two times and finally just sucked it up and bought transfer tape.

here's what i did - take what you want from it, leave the rest. i went shopping at joann's fabric and picked up their adhesive sheets. look on the back; they say oracal 631. everybody here seems to prefer 651; probably better for slivers and feathering that can move around once they're on your disc.

in that same rack, they'll have transfer tape too. it's designed to work specifically with oracal 631. i just did the final fantasy x logo; that has soooo many slivers. when you'll pulling up the vinyl, take it slow. if you see something sticking while you're pulling it up, take your xacto blade and flick up the edge using the side of metal blade. just slide it under there and help the vinyl out. that little bit of help is usually all it takes as long as you didn't cut through the backing.

don't do what i did (twice) and let the vinyl touch itself. you'll go blind.

as far as cutting on a disc goes, i don't do it except to smooth corners and such after weeding. i always weed on the disc. it seems much easier than weeding while it's on paper. some people may have the golden touch, but i haven't been able to cut an entire design on the disc without leaving scratch marks on my disc. nothing major, but a PITA after you take hours to do a job and you have these little cosmetic scratches. as a beginner myself who has tried it, i recommend against it.

i was in the same boat as you about a week ago and now i can actually say once you have the system figured out, it's easy. mine is

oracal 631 sheets from where ever.

transfer tape designed for that shizz from joann's fabric.

straight xacto, swivel xacto, tiny straight blade xacto, compass with xacto (you might want that for your circle).

idye poly and laundry detergent. obviously you'll wanna dip yours.

just transfer the whole sheet over and you'll be right as rain. give it some help with the side of the xacto if it wants to stick. i peel with one hand and keep looking under the tape, helping pieces with the knife as i go. take it slow and you'll do fine. experiment with different transfer tape tackiness. some people use masking tape that they have rubbed on their clothing, but i wouldn't risk it on a design that takes so long.

 

[Garryjercia]

I find that delicate surface painters tape works great for transferring. Possibly cheaper, and I had some laying around.

 

[sneakytiki]

I just started to do dyes as well. Listen to these dudes; they know what's up. I have limited experience, but I sorta jumped the gun on my fourth dye just like you're doing and went fairly elaborate as a challenge. i screwed up two times and finally just sucked it up and bought transfer tape.

....

Thanks for the input koda. I'm going to make another attempt tonight with the same transfer tape I will NOT back down! (even though I'm obviously a noob). What I think I did wrong the first attempt was weeding before transferring to the disc. Also, peeling off the transfer tape along the axis of the corners of the diamonds in the image is a bad idea, since it is easier to lift up a corner than a side. I have high hopes for this attempt, and hopefully I will have something to show for it.

 

[barneco]

I had good success weeding before transferring. Made the same mistake at first, but if you take care to 1) really press the xfer tape in, using a credit card or something, before removing backing, and 2) really try and remove the backing by pulling as close to parallel to your surface as possible, you'll eliminate the problem.

These 2 steps are also really important when applying the vinyl/xfer to the disc. apply it, press it in really well to activate the vinyl PSA, then remove the xfer tape carefully...pulling it backwards along the surface of the disc. The extreme angle of force(as opposed to perpendicularly to the disc surface) helps to keep the vinyl from lifting(may or may not be a problem depending on your xfer tape choice).

Another thing I learned the hard way...it's worth an extra 5 minutes to go over each and every vinyl edge with your finger or a burnish tool to ensure every single edge is completely adhered, paying special attention to inside and outside corners. This will eliminate any bleeding.

 

[championlog22]

Thanks for the input koda. I'm going to make another attempt tonight with the same transfer tape I will NOT back down! (even though I'm obviously a noob). What I think I did wrong the first attempt was weeding before transferring to the disc. Also, peeling off the transfer tape along the axis of the corners of the diamonds in the image is a bad idea, since it is easier to lift up a corner than a side. I have high hopes for this attempt, and hopefully I will have something to show for it.

In my opinion, your best bet is to weed before the transfer. As long as you get some good tape (I've always used regular 3" masking tape). When you place the tape completely over the design, take the side of a credit card and rub it over the entire surface of the tape. I've found this makes it stick to the vinyl much better than just pressing it down with your hand. When you are ready to peel off the transfer tape, peel it as parallel as you can with the disc. Don't have the disc flat on the table and the tape you are peeling off sticking straight up at a 90 degree angle. Peel it off along the top of the disc horizontally if that makes sense. This will reduce the amount of air bubbles in your design as well.

Heat up the dye on a stove, I usually do this until it starts to 'smoke'. Turn the burner off and let it cool down before putting your disc in. You do NOT want to dye a disc in hot dye. It will cook the vinyl onto your disc and it will discolor the disc and leave a lot of sticky residue. (I've done this) After about 20 minutes, the disc has probably taken all the dye in that it can. I remove the disc then and run it under cool water as I peel off the vinyl. This is the moment of truth. If you cut it right, weeded it right, transferred it right, and didn't have air bubbles, you're golden.

 

[sneakytiki]

In my opinion, your best bet is to weed before the transfer.

Even taking into account the image I am trying to put on the disc? It has a LOT of "white space", a lot of diamond shapes unconnected from each other. I could try again with weeding prior to transfer and really take a lot of time pressing down the transfer tape onto the diamonds left.

I would prefer to weed before the transfer, but that's what I tried last time and it failed. Thinking back however, I did not press down the transfer tape with a credit card, and I did not peel the vinyl backer at an extreme (almost 180 degree angle). Decisions decisions...

 

[barneco]

Both methods can work...it's really whatever you like and execute better. Weeding first makes weeding a little bit easier, and you can reposition any mistakes without compromising the PSA. If you make a mistake weeding while on the disc, then some of the adhesive might be weaker and lead to bleeds...or worse if you mess up and accidentally lift a tiny sliver. Sometimes those will never restick and you'll end up trying to splice in a piece with varying results.

On the other hand, as you've pointed out, the little tiny "chads" can get "overstuck" to the xfer tape making them a pain to deal with. Dealing with them requires a bit more care when weeding first than when weeding on the disc. When removing xfer from them, I'll use the back edge of the knife to get them to release and hold them to the disc while removing xfer. More difficult if you have a bunch of them in one area, since you only have 2 hands.

 

[barneco]

I should also point out that I'm a complete hack and have nowhere near the insane skills that a lot of the guys here do, so YMMV

 

[bmxpunk01]

Once you have the transfer tape applied to the stencil, make sure you are really working the air-bubbles out from between the tape & the vinyl. Then do the same thing between the disc & the vinyl before you try removing the transfer tape.

I also find it helpful to pull very gently, and bending the "peeled" section of tape directly back over the tape still being "unapplied". If that makes any sense...

 

[sneakytiki]

I also find it helpful to pull very gently, and bending the "peeled" section of tape directly back over the tape still being "unapplied". If that makes any sense...

It does. I referred to it as peeling close to a "180 degree" peel. I think the first attempt I made I wasnt really thinking about the angle i was peeling at, but what you say makes sense. definitely something I will try.

I meant to make an attempt tonight, but alas, it stopped raining and I just received a couple new discs in the mail, so the actual activity the discs are meant for trumped the decorating of them, but I am sure that is not a new occurrence among you dyers. A time for dyes, and a time for hucks.

 

[Eky8]

Look through my dyes. You will see dyes similar to what you are doing. Trust me when I say if you weed on the disc you will have less problems. One of the things that will help with weeding is to get a fine tip dental pick to help lift the vinyl. I have done several discs both ways, It wasn't until I did the little guy sitting on a die reading that I realized how much easier it is to weed on the disc. Especially with fine detail. Also Cut your big pieces of vinyl occasionally so they don't get restuck to your disc where you don't want it to.