Unless thrown at the proper speed, distance discs underperform...

[djjeremiahj]

I was talking to my local Pro and this was a discussion he had with Josh Anton. (second hand information, i know.....)

But he said that unless a thrower has the power to get a disc up to speed it wont fly anything like it should and wont perform as such. (Take note, this is about SPEED not POWER). He went on to say that although it doesnt look like it, the thrower is actually under utilizing the disc and killing their own distance. His argument was based on pure disc speed. Every disc has to be thrown at or above a certain velocity (and spin) or they dont work. He likened it to driving a Ferrari in the city - its the best car out there, but you really cant tell when you are in traffic and until you get it on the open road and driven at higher speeds, you really dont realize its performance capacity.


He mentioned that unless you have the strength to get the top speed discs to stand up, flatten out and find their own "center of gravity" they wont actually progress through the flight patterns that they should; the same patterns that give the max distance.
- For example... Unless you can snap and hurl a boss, most of us probably dont get the disc to straighten out, fight its own center of balance, drift right, slightly rise and then get a long hyzer as the disc's spin fights its own desire to hook and fade. Most of us only get 1/2 to 1/3 of the actual flight characteristics.

He was saying that instead of a boss, he always recommends someone throw a Teebird and really work on their snap.

As a testimony to his words, i can tell you that (when i do throw right with snap) my TeeBird will fly distances similar to my boss. I am not a mega arm.

This was the most interesting argument i've heard about noob's using high speed discs. To me, it was the first time i actually considered disc speed in the equation of distance. I always focused on snap and power. speed is a function of power, but this simplified the argument. It's not about "how hard", its more about "how fast".


Comments?

 

[CwAlbino]

Speed is why the little man can get distance so far. Look at body types of Avery Jenkins and of Nikko Locastro. I'm built more like Nikko. Tall skinny dude with not a whole lot of muscle mass, my distance comes from speed and not power. Of course Avery is going to have tons of speed too, but I would venture to say Nikko's arm speed is faster than Avery's when they are hitting equal distances. Maybe I'm just grasping at straws though.

 

[sloppydisc]

I am a genius!! I discoverd that all on my own last year. When I finally realized that I was able to throw my Stingray farther than I could throw some of my drivers the light went on. That's when I pretty much buried my drivers and started to stick with my Leopard as my high-speed disc. I do throw a Sidewinder once in a while, but usually only with a nice tail wind or good downhill to help it out. I am going to take a brief arm break while NC gets it winter chill, and then I am going to start working on driving my putters. That will help my form and hopefully get me some more snap. Then maybe I can get my Teebird, Stalker and other drivers to perform as they should. Maybe someday I'll be able to throw all those high-speed drivers, but probably not any time soon.

 

[roadtripstuff]

I have heard advice and discussion about this topic on these forums quite often.

 

[discjon]

Bingo. But that doesn't stop everyone from buying the latest and "greatest" speed 13 driver.

 

[DiscJunkie]

I first learned of the relationship of speed and disc flight from Joe's Universal Flight Chart.
If you read the information on the left-hand side of the chart, it will help anyone pick the correct speed disc for the distance that you throw.

 

[Technohic]

This is why I throw fairway drivers. I dont have the speed for them just yet most the time


Also, nose angle becomes even more important with these, another thing I have been working on.

 

[toothyfish]

So far, my fastest discs are Valks. I've been spending more time lately using putters and mids, stretching out the distance I get with them. I've noticed I'm getting more spin and my release is much cleaner. It's funny how far they go when you throw them correctly. That should translate nicely to the faster discs when spring rolls around...

 

[sloppydisc]

Good plan. I am right there with you. But I can't resist throwing my Core or Cro once in a while.

 

[Technohic]

Those should be fine, they are mids.

I got to where I could heave my Banger-GT out 250' but only 200' really maintaining control and my mids are not much better and fairways just around 300'

Think mine still has a lot to do with nose angle, but plan on doing a lot of work with my mids. Got a Stingray again which the last one I had, I could get it out almost 300' but it was one labeled as long range driver. Dont know if they changed the mold since then or if it is purely since other discs got faster.

Never had that luck with any other mids.

 

[tmahan]

That said, I have one of the aforementioned rag arms, yet I can throw a Katana further than anything else (before that my longest was a Sidewinder), ymmv.

 

[sloppydisc]

I bought a couple Katanas under the assumption that I would be worthy someday. I vow to not use them until I get my putters, mids and at least a Teebird flying decently. But sometimes I am SO weak.

 

[jkdisc]

i like to think i have an "arm" but i can really only control the boss about half the time

 

[culinarywiz]

You don't always have to drop to a fairway driver. They have various stability's too. I realize you are speaking of speed. But I assure you, if you throw a Rogue or a Surge, which are close in speed to a Boss, you will out distance them with less arm speed.
The Katana and Nuke are evidence that the leading manufacturer's realize that with the newly achieved speeds they need to let up off the stability a bit.
Speed VS stability is a balancing act.

 

[Lewis]

The word "power" seems pretty much useless to me in disc golf, because once the disc leaves your hand, the only things that matter are speed, spin, and release angle. The only use for a "powerful" arm would be in helping you generate disc speed, but when you're throwing objects that are less than 180g, "power" isn't very important. It's more about flexibility, joint elasticity, length of body parts, and, of course, coordination. This is why I think the best body type for disc golf is the long, lean ectomorph, rather than the heavier, stronger mesomorph or endomorph. That's not to say you'll never see a man shaped like a bowling ball become a top pro, but I'd expect it to be less common.

 

[jkdisc]

The word "power" seems pretty much useless to me in disc golf, because once the disc leaves your hand, the only things that matter are speed, spin, and release angle. The only use for a "powerful" arm would be in helping you generate disc speed, but when you're throwing objects that are less than 180g, "power" isn't very important. It's more about flexibility, joint elasticity, length of body parts, and, of course, coordination. This is why I think the best body type for disc golf is the long, lean ectomorph, rather than the heavier, stronger mesomorph or endomorph. That's not to say you'll never see a man shaped like a bowling ball become a top pro, but I'd expect it to be less common.

you are right on

 

[Dave242]

Comments?

Innova does not want people to know this nugget you speak of. That would hurt sales from the masses looking for the magic elixir.

 

[skurf]

It's also the same reason why a disc will become understable in a headwind and overstable in a tailwind. The relative speed of the disc (how fast air is passing over/under the wing) is going to be faster into a headwind even though the actual speed of the disc is going to be slower. This is why you can throw a disc that may normally be too fast for you into a headwind and get it to go dead straight instead of fading hard left.

 

[Jimb]

It's also the same reason why a disc will become understable in a headwind and overstable in a tailwind. The relative speed of the disc (how fast air is passing over/under the wing) is going to be faster into a headwind even though the actual speed of the disc is going to be slower. This is why you can throw a disc that may normally be too fast for you into a headwind and get it to go dead straight instead of fading hard left.

Thanks for this information. I never thought of it that way. Now the "great tailwind/headwind driver" type descriptions for discs make a whole lot more sense.

 

[vcadd]

As my throw has gotten faster I have worked my way up the speed chart slowly but surely.From valk,to orc,to starfire,to beast,to wraith,and I tried the boss and force but had to come back to the destroyer.I know it's time to move up when I turn them over unintentionaly on a regular basis.