Noob disc questions

[RAHfrolfer]

Hey, I've been playing for about 2 months now. Definitely hooked!

I started with some softer plastics (started kits), which was a bad call on my highly treed local course.
My form is improving and I can consistently throw up to 300 and on a really good throw 340ft.
Here are a few questions I have:
I have a champion beast that flies perfectly for me every time. I have another driver that I can throw directly afterwards and for some reason it will often fly too low (like into the ground 100ft down course). It is a gripier plastic, is this the issue? or is it the shape? I can't figure out why two similar drivers have such different results for me back to back.
I am also trying to figure out speed ratings and how the power behind a throw affects flight. I have a ROC3 in DX that doesn't seem to be as overstable as it should be. It is not particularly beat in so I don't expect it to fly understable but if I throw it 150ft it flies like an understable disc rather than the 5/4/0/3 it is rated. Am I throwing it too hard? Do I need to get it in champion for it to fly overstable as it is rated?
I have a few understable discs (genius and astronaut). I find them inconsistent (especially the genius). Sometimes they fly really understable and other times much less so. Is this just about choosing the right distance for the rating so you are throwing for the rated speed?
If so, what distance are different speed ratings best for - i.e speed 5 vs 7 vs 9 vs 11 vs 13 (how far should each ideally be thrown to fly as they are rated?)

 

[ru4por]

Here is a pretty cool interactive flight chart. This might give you an answer to some of your speed/distance/stability questions.

http://www.inboundsdiscgolf.com/content/?page_id=431

Less stable discs are often angle sensitive. The slightest shift in release angle and the flight performance is impacts. Disc speed magnifies that issue.

I have a couple Westside/Lat64 disc that always seem to come out and fly at a lower trajectory for me. Nose angle is practiced skill as well. Practice and experience help develop touch and feel.

 

[ray1970]

I have a ROC3 in DX that doesn't seem to be as overstable as it should be. It is not particularly beat in so I don't expect it to fly understable but if I throw it 150ft it flies like an understable disc rather than the 5/4/0/3 it is rated. Am I throwing it too hard?

While DX Rocs and Roc3's are easy to overpower, you'll have to be pushing them way past 150' before you'll ever run into that situation.

If you're Roc3 flies understable on a 150' throw it isn't the disc, its your form or technique causing you problems.

You can spend your time and money searching for those magical discs that will fly like you think they should or you can spend some time working on your form.

Definitely not bashing you or anything. Just passing along advice that I wish someone had given me when I was first starting out.

 

[GripEnemy]

I have a couple Westside/Lat64 disc that always seem to come out and fly at a lower trajectory for me. Nose angle is practiced skill as well. Practice and experience help develop touch and feel.

Plus rim issues?

 

[acrosley]

It's possible that you're releasing with a lot of anhyzer angle given that your beast flies around 300 feet but your roc3 is just turning and burning even at low speeds but it's hard to say without seeing you throw them.

A Champ Roc3 would be a lot more OS but if you're releasing it with a lot of anhyzer it would still turn over most likely

 

[RAHfrolfer]

Thanks for the replies. I definitely need to work on my form as I am totally new, have learned e timely from. YouTube and don't have any friends who play that can help me.

I havent actually started working on nose angle yet and need to. My shots are affected by disc material and shape way more than I realized and I haven't figured out how to compensate yet. What made me aware was that I just started using the beast and it flies perfect for me every single time. My champion firebird I struggle to flip and have to really make sure is absolutely flat so it was surprising to me that this one was doing it but maybe it's the different plastic and shape that I don't know how to throw yet.

Back to YouTube to work on my form I guess.....

 

[auzcar]

In regards to the nose angle thing. Low profile flat discs tend to release much more nose down (and thus "lower") from my hand compared to higher profiled domey discs. For me it's about my grip and how the disc sits in my hand, and because of this I much prefer flatter discs as they make it much more effortless and natural for me to get the nose down.

We are all different and finding what you like and what works for you and your game/form specifically is what building a bag is all about. I like to throw on a slight anny and flex my shots a lot. I also like to play the fade, pairing that with my preference for flatter discs makes my bag built around flat and overstable discs. My friend likes to release his shots on hyzer and he mainly bags much less stable discs, even though we throw roughly as far.

Oh btw, I threw DX Roc3's for a bit and I had problems with OAT and wobble, I just couldn't get them to release cleanly from my hand. That might have a play in why it's flying more "understable" as well.

 

[ChrisinFL]

In regards to the nose angle thing. Low profile flat discs tend to release much more nose down (and thus "lower") from my hand compared to higher profiled domey discs. For me it's about my grip and how the disc sits in my hand, and because of this I much prefer flatter discs as they make it much more effortless and natural for me to get the nose down.

We are all different and finding what you like and what works for you and your game/form specifically is what building a bag is all about. I like to throw on a slight anny and flex my shots a lot. I also like to play the fade, pairing that with my preference for flatter discs makes my bag built around flat and overstable discs. My friend likes to release his shots on hyzer and he mainly bags much less stable discs, even though we throw roughly as far.

Oh btw, I threw DX Roc3's for a bit and I had problems with OAT and wobble, I just couldn't get them to release cleanly from my hand. That might have a play in why it's flying more "understable" as well.

You gave me an aha moment there. Some insight into my game. Flatter discs feel better in my smallish hand, and tend to fly better for me. I can't power grip putters or mids worth a damn - they don't even feel good in my hand. They feel bulky and wobbly. I have a slight hyzer angle naturally - I think I have a disc flat when it is actually slightly on a hyzer angle, so I like under stable discs. Thus, light weight US distance drivers are my favorites to throw - makes sense why now - flatter discs and US, thus hitting both of what fits my hand and my natural throwing tendency best! Aha! Also, cocking and flicking my wrists often helps me get a better release, because it helps bring my natural hyzer release angle up to a bit flatter. Bits and pieces of things, all of which I already knew, but Aha, putting all together and better understanding WHY I like what I do - why I throw discs the way that I do. Hopefully this added insight will help me make better DG decisions going forward. Thank you auzcar!

 

[ChrisinFL]

You gave me an aha moment there. Some insight into my game. Flatter discs feel better in my smallish hand, and tend to fly better for me. I can't power grip putters or mids worth a damn - they don't even feel good in my hand. They feel bulky and wobbly. I have a slight hyzer angle naturally - I think I have a disc flat when it is actually slightly on a hyzer angle, so I like under stable discs. Thus, light weight US distance drivers are my favorites to throw - makes sense why now - flatter discs and US, thus hitting both of what fits my hand and my natural throwing tendency best! Aha! Also, cocking and flicking my wrists often helps me get a better release, because it helps bring my natural hyzer release angle up to a bit flatter. Bits and pieces of things, all of which I already knew, but Aha, putting all together and better understanding WHY I like what I do - why I throw discs the way that I do. Hopefully this added insight will help me make better DG decisions going forward. Thank you auzcar!

With a power grip, I can't get putters and mids to release cleanly from my smallish hands! That is part of my game, and it's okay.

 

[Sewer bill]

I don't think hand size has much to do with putter release being wonky with a power grip. I think it's a technique thing that gets easier over time. Putters immediately reveal grip issues that drivers can completely mask over. Most backhand players with a couple years under their belt can probably throw a putter with no thumb touching the flight plate, most new players can't. The sense and perception of where to apply grip pressure hasn't been trained into you yet. It takes time and repetition to feel where to apply pressure and when in the throw. Learning on shallow putters or smooth bottom rim putters can speed the learning curve up. Sharp bottom and tall beaded putters are probably the most unforgiving to throw when you're unfamiliar with the grip properception.

 

[ChrisinFL]

I think for power grip, I have to stick with flat discs as much as possible. I threw my buddy's Crave and Rhythm today, and they both felt and threw real good for me. Bigger rim putters and mids just feel big and clunky in my hands with a power grip - like even just holding them, I have no ability to hold them flat, so how can I expect to throw them flat? Think I may turn into a big MVP fan mainly because their flatter discs fit/feel better in my smallish hands.

 

[GripEnemy]

I don't recall the name of the grip but I throw putters and mids with my pinky and index fingers on the inside rim (like power grip), but ring and middle are extended out flat towards the center of the disc.

Chris - not sure if you've tried it before but give it a shot. I, too, don't have large hands.

@bill I've tried for over a decade to power grip putters but I just can't. Used to with mids years ago but really anything slower than s JLS is nope. It feels inherently wrong so I don't bother...to each their own?

 

[mostlynorwegian]

Sort of sounds like with the Beast and what you pair it with, that you aren't giving the other disc enough height to work with.
With your Roc3. Ditto. They like height, and/or elevation to show off that 3 finish. Not knowing what your form is up to, or If you have prior bodily knowledge and muscle memories of things that will help out with disc golf. It could just be that you are just arming the disc out into space, etc. and that you are just overpowering it, while not giving it sufficient rotation to be a disc. Which may explain the short distance you are getting from it.
Roc3's have a particular feel in the hand to them, and you may just need a beadless disc to counter that/or switch to a smaller diameter midrange altogether.

 

[ChrisinFL]

I have experimented with modified grips - some with putting a finger or fingers at either end of my hand out under the flight plate to stabilize the disc, while using others on the rim to help add power, with varying levels of success, but it seems like an uphill battle. I guess I basically tried splits between power grip and fan grip. I think I might be able to accomplish more better by just going to flatter MVP discs, at least for some of my mid range and fairways. Time will tell - I already plan to start by getting 2-3 MVP fairway drivers, and seeing where it goes from there. I threw my buddy's Rhythm and Crave, and they both felt and threw really good. Going to check out a local shop, hold some MVP stuff, and see what I like, but those two are high on my list. For approach shots, I just use putters with a fan grip, and my comfortable distance with them continues to inch outwards.

 

[ChrisinFL]

I have experimented with modified grips - some with putting a finger or fingers at either end of my hand out under the flight plate to stabilize the disc, while using others on the rim to help add power, with varying levels of success, but it seems like an uphill battle. I guess I basically tried splits between power grip and fan grip. I think I might be able to accomplish more better by just going to flatter MVP discs, at least for some of my mid range and fairways. Time will tell - I already plan to start by getting 2-3 MVP fairway drivers, and seeing where it goes from there. I threw my buddy's Rhythm and Crave, and they both felt and threw really good. Going to check out a local shop, hold some MVP stuff, and see what I like, but those two are high on my list. For approach shots, I just use putters with a fan grip, and my comfortable distance with them continues to inch outwards.

Update: Held several mid range MVPs - rims still too big to feel comfortable for me. About 6-7 speed and up feel good. I bought a used 170g Axiom Trace for $10, in very good shape. Threw it a few times already. I can get it pretty straight, at 200' plus or minus a little, if I throw it decent, but if I throw it poorly, it will go high and dump left. I figured when I bought it that the weight was too much for me on an 11 speed, but counting it as a decent deal on a disc I can grow into. Also, can bag it now for when I need a fairly straight, 175-205' shot. I guess it is fairly similar to what I have been getting out of my 175g Valkyrie. Interestingly, I got a longer, straight shot with a gentle fade from my buddy's 168-170g Rhythm when I threw it, maybe 250', and a similar flight and about 200-225' from his 168-170g Crave. I threw the Crave on a hole I am guessing is about 215-225', that plays best by throwing it to the right of some trees and letting it fade back left, and I parked the Crave right under the basket. I also paid $5 for a used 176g Maverick that, for a 7 speed, seemed pretty flat, and felt good in my hand. In limited use it flew very straight, about 200', and could also be useful for me to try to fill out that gap caused by my inability to throw putters and mids with a power grip. Potentially useful because the 6-8 speed stuff I have was almost all under stable, and has become too flippy for me. Figuring out how/why people end up with 1,000 discs! Always a disc out there beckoning - I will fill that void in your bag - buy me, buy me! Ugh!