I have been throwing thumbers/tomahawks for most of my 18 year disc golf career. Best discs are overstable drivers. I have tried about every disc possible. Z predators are my personal choice fo their slow turn and predictable finish. I have used firebirds, whippets, banshees, nuke os, force, flick, trident, xxx, speed demon, spirit, evo blaze, xclone, extra, extreme(all z, optoor champ for durability). Always come back to the predators. After they get beat in they transition to a nice stable workhors driver.