2015 Minnesota Majestic

[Segovia]

That's probably the only flaw I see in how the Majestic payouts were handled this year. I believe the site said "top-heavy payouts" for amateurs which is about as vague as it can get.

I would doubt Cale and Jason will make that mistake if they run big tournaments in the future.

 

[beeyang78]

Am Worlds is trophy only and it sells out quick. I think trophy only should be the norm so that people will try hard to get better to play in the pro division. Also, they should do away with players packs and just make entry fees cheaper for amateurs. We are growing so tournaments will fill no matter what if they are decently ran. For me, I started playing competitively because I wanted to see how I stacked against others. Everything else was just a bonus. Even if I didn't get they, I would have played in the tournaments anyway.

 

[smarkquart]

Am Worlds is trophy only and it sells out quick. I think trophy only should be the norm so that people will try hard to get better to play in the pro division. Also, they should do away with players packs and just make entry fees cheaper for amateurs. We are growing so tournaments will fill no matter what if they are decently ran. For me, I started playing competitively because I wanted to see how I stacked against others. Everything else was just a bonus. Even if I didn't get they, I would have played in the tournaments anyway.

I have mixed feelings about player packs. For smaller events, especially C-Tier, I can see no packs. However, big events, something you look forward to every year, that should have something. If I go out of town to play in a big event, then I definitely want something to help remind of the great time I had.

 

[jeverett]

Yep, unless the TD is also in charge of the merch running tournaments is guaranteed to be a money losing operation. Even if you sell merch, you can't guarantee you'll sell enough to make a profit on the day.

Ok, I feel the need to step in here and say that, regardless of merchandise sales, running tournaments is not necessarily a money-losing operation. It does, however, depend on Ams, and how they are paid (i.e. the wholesale to retail differential).

In order to actually make money running a tourney, a TD must minimally A. offer some kind of players' pack, purchased at lower cost than the assessed retail value, or B. be a vendor/redeemer of scrip from the event (i.e. have merchandise) or have some reimbursement agreement with the event vendor(s), or both. With regard to the second part of option B, for example, many times a TD will have some deal worked out with their scrip vendor(s) where they get some percentage (e.g. 20%) of the value of the redeemed scrip back.

All of the above absolutely take work and/or merchandise purchasing, true. This is a challenge for small events, especially. At the C-tier level, even without any players pack or merchandise/scrip agreement, a TD doesn't *have* to lose money.. providing they're willing to drop below the 100% payout mark (at the C-tier level, only 85% payout is required). There is, however, definitely a social stigma around TD's paying out less than 100%.

 

[spinachd]

Just listened to the smashboxx podcast w Alex Geisinger. No ledgestone and no worlds for Geisinger that is a crying shame.

 

[bnbanbury]

Am Worlds is trophy only and it sells out quick. I think trophy only should be the norm so that people will try hard to get better to play in the pro division. Also, they should do away with players packs and just make entry fees cheaper for amateurs. We are growing so tournaments will fill no matter what if they are decently ran. For me, I started playing competitively because I wanted to see how I stacked against others. Everything else was just a bonus. Even if I didn't get they, I would have played in the tournaments anyway.

Trophy only inspiring people to go pro has not been my experience. the last trophy only tourney i played had 21 AM1s and 11 open. 48 ams vs 24 pro overall. People aren't failing to put in the effort to get better because they want to get player packs or payout.

 

[beeyang78]

Trophy only inspiring people to go pro has not been my experience. the last trophy only tourney i played had 21 AM1s and 11 open. 48 ams vs 24 pro overall. People aren't failing to put in the effort to get better because they want to get player packs or payout.

If all amateur tournaments went to trophy only, I'm sure we will see a change in attitudes.

 

[diskey river]

^
What you would see is a ton more non-sanctioned events, because would quit playing the trophy only ones.

 

[beeyang78]

I love non sanctioned events but unless you have a way to stop people from playing in a division they shouldn't or only have one division, good luck getting lots of people to play that event every year. I have not played in a non sanctioned event that had over 100 people. Most likely, you will only get locals out.

 

[bnbanbury]

If all amateur tournaments went to trophy only, I'm sure we will see a change in attitudes.

Why do "we" want that? I want as many amateurs as possible at an event. ams are what make the competitive disc golf world go around my friend.

 

[Discin'Cider49514]

I love non sanctioned events but unless you have a way to stop people from playing in a division they shouldn't or only have one division, good luck getting lots of people to play that event every year. I have not played in a non sanctioned event that had over 100 people. Most likely, you will only get locals out.

We must be spoiled here in IA, because non-sanctioned events regularly hit 100+ participants, and that includes temp courses on ball golf courses (Amana, DSM Holiday Showdown). We also have a saturated sactioned tourney field, where I could easily pick a tourney within the state of IA every weekend for the rest of the season. That being said, Diskey is right, if the sanctioned tourney model goes full trophy only mode, there were be plenty of non-sanctioned events popping up, at least here in IA, and participation would bet between 60-100 people easy...

 

[beeyang78]

You are only naming a few tournaments. You would have to have unsanctioned events weekly and hit those numbers in order to have any credibility. I can see once a year special unsanctioned events getting lots of people, but when it becomes weekly, I doubt people will show up for them. It then becomes league play. I just don't see that model having any staying power.

 

[Rhynos4life]

I'm really glad that I saw this thread because alot of the opinions shared here mirror my own. This was my 2nd Majestic trip and my group really had an awesome time! My buddy was the guy who was selected by Alex for skins, my girlfriend won Adv womens, and me, well...I had fun! Despite that though, i was definitely disappointed in a few different aspects.
When I last went to the Majestic 2 years ago, I was really impressed by the fly shop GGGT had set up at Hyland and was really excited for something similar this year but was sorely disappointed. Yeah, they had the airborn trailer set up but the selection was pretty pitiful and the club shop at BRP was nice but definitely not the same.
As a whole, this tournament didn't feel like an A-tier what so ever. It felt like a B tier at best. I LOVE the courses in MN but it seems like the ball has really been dropped since Hyland has been off of the venue. I really look forward to making another trip out there but if it ends up being anything like this year, I may look else where for a trip.

 

[beeyang78]

I agree with you in that aspect. It was a great tournament when we played three days at three different courses a few years ago. Because it went to a two day tournament and not knowing what to expect before the tournament, I chose to go to The Discraft Great Lakes Open instead.

 

[timj5304]

I'm really glad that I saw this thread because alot of the opinions shared here mirror my own. This was my 2nd Majestic trip and my group really had an awesome time! My buddy was the guy who was selected by Alex for skins, my girlfriend won Adv womens, and me, well...I had fun! Despite that though, i was definitely disappointed in a few different aspects.
When I last went to the Majestic 2 years ago, I was really impressed by the fly shop GGGT had set up at Hyland and was really excited for something similar this year but was sorely disappointed. Yeah, they had the airborn trailer set up but the selection was pretty pitiful and the club shop at BRP was nice but definitely not the same.
As a whole, this tournament didn't feel like an A-tier what so ever. It felt like a B tier at best. I LOVE the courses in MN but it seems like the ball has really been dropped since Hyland has been off of the venue. I really look forward to making another trip out there but if it ends up being anything like this year, I may look else where for a trip.

Kind of hard to have a course on the menu that has been closed since 2013. Gggt dropped the ball last year in the final year of running the event in their 3 year run from 2012-2014. Year 1 they had merch thru the roof at hyland and dynamic discs were there as well. Each extra year they had less and less merch with last year at kaposia only having it inside of a truck. It was embarrassing. Jason add Cale have never ran an event this big before and will only learn from this and do much better next time. Jason's child was born a couple days before the event so he had probably zero sleep and a very understanding wife allowing him to run a huge a tier event.

 

[Deet]

I really liked the flow of this tournament. I can't recall any other tournament where I didn't run into large backups during play. I only had to wait for a couple of groups on 17 at Vision Quest during the entire tournament. I was in Advanced, so I can't speak for how Intermediate and Open went, but kudos on the carding if they flowed as nicely as our division.

 

[spinachd]

I really liked the flow of this tournament. I can't recall any other tournament where I didn't run into large backups during play. I only had to wait for a couple of groups on 17 at Vision Quest during the entire tournament. I was in Advanced, so I can't speak for how Intermediate and Open went, but kudos on the carding if they flowed as nicely as our division.

Same thing on Kaposia and BRP. Very smooth for the difficulty those courses can cause. Tee times are great