I want people to disagree with me and challenge my idea's. This is how we ALL get better. When I respond to people, it's not to tell you your wrong, but to throw my multiple years of experience onto the equation.
But it gets really old when people just make things up as hard statements with no experience to back it up, or much else.
It's perhaps my fault as well because when I talk about things I know, I say them boldly standing behind my point and people are afraid to ask questions back.
It's perhaps partly my issue as well because I put down my experience in respond and people find it as an attack because I'm not asking questions, then it devolves into them thinking I'm attacking their character or something.
But then I've spent lots of time asking other people questions to be disregarded as not good enough to speak to or answer.
If we had all these conversations in person, none of these conversations would ever devolve into any of us getting mad at each other for attitudes or idea's or attacking each other. Because in person you can tell that someone isn't attacking you personally, they are attacking your idea, they want to discuss it with you and others to come to a conclusion. Nobody who meets me in person goes "man that guy is so horrible." I am faaar more blunt in person.
And its also important we dont' hold onto our theories and idea's so dead set as well. My mind has been changed by brychanus in here probably more than anyone causing me to re-think things in really weird ways. Because when he comes at you, he comes at you with data and no attacks or attitude.
I admit I suck at responding to some people Because I see someone get emotional and start responding to me that way and I have a natural desire to butt heads at that point. But it's my fault to engage, because you can't win an argument when someone is arguing emotionally.
I will engage here because I hear part of you are saying, and I know you care, which is why you engage and get hot sometimes. I write this next part with a lot of love. Then I will get back to the contents.
I get as hot as anyone I know deep down inside. It has motivated me to do many good things and stand up for things I care about, and also required me to learn. One of my mentors said (equal parts compliment (too kind) and life lesson) "you are like a supercomputer mounted on a tiger." I channeled my childhood frustrations into weightlifting and bodybuilding and martial arts. But I was lonely. Then, I gained a lifetime of experiences including some personal work, community building, challenging voluntary discussions about "-isms," training and interests in a wide range of topics that forced me to interact with many kinds of thinkers and professionals to get anything valuable done. I am almost never the smartest person in the room I am in. For a long time and still sometimes occasionally, I fear that what I am and do will always be inadequate and that my life will be to some extent "wasted." Then I learned to look at all of that, stop and smell the roses, and enjoy much more of the ride. Everyone is walking some kind of line between narcissism, confidence, and doubt, and everyone is walking some line of incompetence and competence.
My tone is practiced because I am
highly emotive by nature. Over the years, I realized how much that I wanted people to engage with my outrageous level of curiosity and energy. When they don't, I'm more depressed. I just want the world to get better in the time I have here, and me and others to be better (or at least want to be, in whatever way is most meaningful). Disc golf is now just a part of that.
It is important in general to know when you are getting emotional about something, to step back, and to wonder about what the best response for is - often, you will find one that's pretty good for the people around, you, and if you practice it, it's also good for you too.
So, I did short track this in the video by accident. but it was 20 minutes.
What exactly is it ya'll are not quite understanding that I presented in the video about finding how to grip the disc the easy way that has inspired this conversation about all sorts of weird grips?
I kinda feel this is how sidewinder looked at me 3 or 4 years ago when I started this journey and was asking him questions and all I could decipher from the words he responded with was what i took to be bewilderment and "good luck."
Because I can soap box a 20 min video on just the grip stuff that makes it even more confusing. I'd rather not do a 20 minute video on that though, because good lord its to much for anyone to really work with.
It's just important to help people learn the quickest way to get close without trying to over complicate it with numbers and letters on a hand. But also finding a way for them to find "Their" grip with 0 influence from other throwers who's bodies, wrists and hands work nothing like theirs. So I'm not quite understanding what we got going with this conversation, because what I was trying to hint at before was that "there was a lot of words that didn't say anything."
Has nothing to do with my inability to understand.
I don't think I misunderstand what you are saying and in fact it led me down a path to pay much closer attention to the arm, wrist, hand, and grip moves that can "work" and what I really thought I took away from "hammertime." The problem with "hammertime" is that you literally have to do it correctly to "understand" what it teaches. And that takes a lot of time, and some people never get it. And others clearly learn in different ways, and not all top throwers threw hammers.
Your comments about the nose etc. made me think and pay more attention to the very end of the move and start to figure out why I think everyone is basically partly talking past one another in one way or another in this thread. When I have a puzzle, I usually don't like to let it go. Personality strength
and weakness for me.
When I first started writing Fundamentals,
@sidewinder22 told me on the phone that he found the first draft "hard to read." I asked him why, and he said that the writing seemed very frustrated. And he was right - I came here because I found the endless pile of cues, words, and priorities and concepts overwhelming, and I
just wanted to learn how to throw the stupid frisbee farther without getting hurt. Over time, I started to realize there was a real "method to the madness" that no one else did, which is why I started writing. After I wrote it, I started to become much less frustrated, and far more curious again. It was easier to understand what he meant, and why other people seem to disagree - and why sometimes it's really not a disagreement at all and they were just stuck on something. Other times it is a real disagreement, but people are operating in echo chambers too often. And as I realized those things, I got better and happier, and began to "understand" (in his meaning) things better the more I just let certain things go. And it has been wonderful. And then I got even more curious again.
People like Neil are analytic, want to work with tools, want to do analyses, and want to figure some things out themselves. I get it. I learn from people like that. I am one of those people.
People like Sidewinder are
also very analytic, but also have somewhere at the bottom "just do it" in their approach to learning. I am also one of these people. An inestimable advantage Sidewinder had when he became obsessed with all this and started his drill set was being a D1 athlete. I was not one of those people. It is not surprising that it took me a lot longer to "understand." Some of it was purely intellectual. That is why I write. But the lion's share was moving.
People like Josh are trying to grab whatever they can that makes people improve, regardless of its source or attribution, and make students better, and learn to make students better. I am also now one of these people.
I think if everyone just stopped to think about their assumptions and intentions and place in life and lead with curiosity and realize that people and their priorities and histories and backgrounds and so on can all differ, we could go far. It is the only reason I am still active here. I have hope that it can remain a special place, and perhaps become even more than that. What
can happen here and
sometimes happens here is wonderful even if many of the people who try to learn to throw here just end up confused. I don't like being confused. And if I am not learning, I get bored and depressed and disconnect and would rather not be there. So here I remain.