The "Incomplete" Secret Technique

[Blake_T1]

sweet. that's good feedback to hear.

i've found similar things to be true... such as hand more on top of the disc, needing to be familiar w/ the hammer pound before it works, etc.

 

[Uncle Dougie]

Right below my first knuckle along the side of my index finger is getting really raw from starting the drills. I do feel the "feeling" of whats suppose to be going on, but do I stop after the rawness starts to get intense and resume the next day to let the callus come? I've got the first three drills down. I've been repeating them. :wink:

 

[JR]

Callouses take a long time to heal so it is better to switch to other training and using sports tape. The skin will get tougher eventually and it happens faster when you push it to a little raw and do it again the next time instead of needing to take a break. Staying healthy gives you more training session and faster development elsewhere too.

 

[Blake_T1]

Right below my first knuckle along the side of my index finger is getting really raw from starting the drills. I do feel the "feeling" of whats suppose to be going on, but do I stop after the rawness starts to get intense and resume the next day to let the callus come? I've got the first three drills down. I've been repeating them.

the intentions of the drills are:
1. to understand and feel the weight shift of the disc.
2. to master manipulation of the weight shift of the disc.
3. to build the coordination and dexterity necessary to perform #1 and #2.

anything beyond that doesn't really help you except in isolated cases, e.g. doing 2 hammer pounds as part of your pre-throw routine to "lock in" that feeling just before throwing.

KEY POINT: you ARE NOT trying to master the hammer drills, you ARE trying to master the feel/nuances of controlling the disc's weight by performing the hammer drills.

 

[Uncle Dougie]

I understand the purpose of these drills but I should of taped the upper portion of my index finger like the rest of it. I was going by the picture when i taped my finger in the first steps. It's the friction of the disc that's rubbing my finger when doing the hammer drill in the (fh) horizontal plane.

 

[Blake_T1]

i wasn't necessarily directing the caps at you, but at a lot of people in general.

i've talked with several players that are like "i did 22 hours worth of hammer pounds last week" and it's like... damn... anything beyond 5 minutes (straight) on any one of the different pounds can be kind of overkill.

 

[zj10021]

Have you tried using a PVC pipe to teach people blake? Not sure if I have brought this up before

We randomly had some at Disc Nation and I started using them for my clinics a few months ago.

It is about a foot long, and I think a 2in diameter(bring on the dick jokes). On each end I have a cap. Its an easy way to show people how to create leverage and focus on the pound with out using an actual hammer. I just do my normal throw but because my grip is tight around the cap, the pvc pipe shoots out forward about 100ft, while the cap shoots straight backward with my follow through. I have had a few customers build up to it and they can pull it off every few tries now. Its really just a great visual effect to make folks see what actually is happening to create at least a decent hit. It shows them how to leverage the entire weight of the disc forward on to a point, which causes the pipe to shoot out from the cap. The cap stays in my hand, and I as I said usually shoots out backwards towards my customers which really opens their eyes.

 

[horsethief]

in order to build power you can do two things:
1. try to get as far forward into the pocket before unloading. e.g. you will have more power if you are 12" past your body into the pocket before unloading than if you are 2" past your body.
2. make sure you bring the head of the hammer (outer edge of the disc) around during your extension. ideal position is where the head of the hammer is pointing towards the target (your hand will be at around a 4 o'clock orientation).

Is there a limit to how far in you can go? It seems like the "depth" of the power pocket is determined by the length of my upper and lower arm and how far closed my wrist can bend. I am also still having grip problems, it seems like everything can uncoil so fast once i get into the power pocket that my fingers/hand/arm just leave the disc behind before I can apply all of the leverage/force to the disc. I'm going to try some experiments tonight with gripping earlier (maybe starting somewhere between my left and right pec) and uncoiling slower (not actively opening as hard/fast) to see what happens

 

[JR]

The wrist snaps slower with less force=easier to hold on to until the end of the disc pivot with the right pec drill. Once you do that a long reach back stand still and so forth. I'd also try setting down the thumb almost vertical in the outermost section of the thumb like the Jenkinses and on top of a Pro plastic disc with the thumb just off of the wing in the flight plate so that the flight plate caves in. That'll lock the thumb way better than normal grip and because the thumb is the weak link fighting alone vs 4 fingers underneath the disc it can make all the difference in the world.

 

[horsethief]

Thanks for the reply JR. I didn't get a chance to do any testing tonight, hopefully some time this week since I wont be able to tomorrow. I'll try with the thumb tip on top like AJ and see if that helps.

 

[pask2155]

how long do you do this until it takes effect?

Essentially I did all the drills today, watched all the videos, read a ton, and did more drills... Then today went out into the field and I lost major distance... I went from throwing 330' easy to 250-270' and all my throws seems to rocket way up in the sky or stay about 5 feet off the ground and then worm burn.... Obviously my control and my consistency is way off...

So back to the question... this is obviously very frustrating... So how fast is this supposed to take effect?

Also how am I supposed to throw at the beginning... After I do the drills then I actually of to the field to I cross step, reach back, the whole nine yards of throwing? Or do you stand still with doing nothing but the reach back and hammer? Or just hammer? Anyhow... please let me know... you guys have been very helpful, hopefully soon I can get 400+ soon...

 

[Star Shark]

Incorporating any new technique into your game is gonna totally bork up your consistency and/or accuracy. The key is to stick with it until you've fully processed the feel for it.

 

[Blake_T1]

the goal of these drills isn't to just throw far, but to feel the disc differently/better when you throw so that you can snap it better.

if you aren't able to have any success at it then you are doing it wrong. it's up to you if you want to keep futzing with it until you get it right or just give up on it.

if you are worm burning and skying, i'm almost certain your shoulder rotation timing and manipulation of the disc's center of gravity are way off.

when this style works for people they tend to "feel something different that feels better" pretty quickly (e.g. the first 10 throws) even if they aren't able to master it right away.

 

[pask2155]

I guess my question is how do you know when you have the right amount of snap? Because I think I have the idea down but at the same time I'm not throwing any further then before. And the reason this technique becomes such a big thing is because they say without enough snap you will never throw 400'.

So how do you know if you have enough?

 

[JR]

See the diagram for slip vs half hit vs full hit in the other thread. Once you're getting the rip at full hit territory and the disc leaves the fingers pivoted to at least 3.30 o'clock preferably more and get over 350' with long mids and over 400' with TBs you know you've made strides and should get a lot more distance from warp speeders. I'm a half hitter and before the snap (mostly elbow chop and squeeze strength advances) improvements this year i made a test last fall. I tried to lock my wrist in place and got 350' max and warp speeders and TBs were almost as long. TB max to 340' IIRC. Loosening the arm and allowing the wrist to move popped the discs to past 400' at best.

 

[Blake_T1]

Half hit discs with reference points (distances are approximate)
Roc: ~330
Buzzz: ~350
Teebird: ~410
Destroyer: ~430
Nuke: ~450

Full hit distances (approximate)
Roc: ~360+
Buzzz: ~380+
Teebird: ~440+
destroyer: ~460+
nuke: ~480+

the goal of the drill is not to achieve the same thing. The goal is to feel something different that you dont feel in your normal throw.

 

[tuckerjt071]

I know this thread is old but I need some help in a bad way. I, think, I'm doing these drills correctly. I feel my wrist fly open and rebound, but I cannot for the life of me do the towel drill correctly. Has anyone else experienced this? If so, how does one fix it?

 

[sidewinder22]

Towel drill is just to get the idea of late acceleration, that's all. If you try to perfect the towel drill, you will likely screw up good throwing mechanics and could even injure yourself. Drills are exaggerations that you must learn to apply.

 

[tuckerjt071]

By that I mean I get a great Whoosh but no crack of it popping.

 

[sidewinder22]

I wouldn't put much stock in the towel drill, although it's a good way to warm up. You are better off throwing hammers.