I came across a DGPT channel on ROKU the other day but there has been no new content since 2017.
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DGPT Drops New Media Outlook for 2019
- Thread starter hellbound
- Start date
I came across a DGPT channel on ROKU the other day but there has been no new content since 2017.
billyjacko
Eagle Member
I didn't say anything about full on boycotting. Subscriptions are a huge driver for the viability of a youtube channel. If a lot of people voice their opinion by unsubscribing, they'll get the message. I truly hope this works out for the DGPT, it just seems brash, untimely, and if anything else, a bad PR move.
Also, I do personally invest in other media organizations (CCDG, Jomez, and Sexton) through patreon.
Somebody help me out. I'm out of the loop---don't follow the DGPT very closely, don't watch videos at all.
Steve Dodge has built the DGPT. The media guys have built their companies. The DGPT and media guys have worked together; some might say they have built a successful DGPT together.
Does this mean the DGPT is obligated to continue that business relationship, forever?
Would the converse apply? If the media guys said they didn't want to be part of the DGPT any more, would people say they are obligated to keep doing it?
Steve Dodge has built the DGPT. The media guys have built their companies. The DGPT and media guys have worked together; some might say they have built a successful DGPT together.
Does this mean the DGPT is obligated to continue that business relationship, forever?
Would the converse apply? If the media guys said they didn't want to be part of the DGPT any more, would people say they are obligated to keep doing it?
This has kind of been my point all along. Each are a business, investing in what will grow their business model and maximize profits. I don't think either has any obligation to one another, nor do I believe either have an obligation to "grow the sport", outside of where growth will benefit their profits.
So, I mean this with no snark or smart-assed-ness intented, this is a generational thing. This is how Millennials and Gen-Z are, by and large. Not saying we're the only ones who feel this way, but it's very common across many industries for our generation to have a different rubric determining brand loyalties than the Boomers and Gen X.
...and this is not my original thought, this is what I've learned going to advertising/content conferences over the past 2-3 years. It's not native to disc golf either.
I did a flash poll on the FB group "Disc Golf Debate Group" asking people in the moment, who they felt more loyal towards - the media teams or the tour. It's approaching nearly 200 responses, and the ratio is ~25:1, in favor of media teams.
No, because they didn't build those brands at the same time. DGPT used the existing audiences built into those media brands, while hyping those benefits publicly in the beginning. Now all of the sudden he's too big for all of us and he's gatekeeping after using our quality work product to launch his startup. That's cutthroat, and disingenuous to younger fans who don't remember a time before DGPT.
If you hear harmony in what the media folks are saying, it's that we don't appreciate the way we've been treated by the DGPT. This is far from the first issue any of us have had with this tour or its management.
Whether they're in it for a profit, or the love and growth of the sport, or---likely---a combination of the two, it still seems the same.
I understand if people are disappointed at this turn of events, thinking they won't enjoy the same (free) product they've had.
I understand if the peanut gallery thinks Dodge is making a mistake (on his own dime); second-guessing is a cherished part of sports fandom.
I'm not sure I understand the bitterness.
To be fair, it's not the media folks who have me a bit bewildered. It's the rest of the crowd.
No snark perceived. Great point, and I am sure you are correct. Boomer and Gen X should not probably be the target demographic for either. As a Boomer, I indeed find it challenging to understand the entire loyalty issue. I don't even understand the question of favoring one over the other. The only issue seems to be the feeling of entitlement. That the game is entitled to altruistic treatment by anyone in business. I only see the issue as one of companies looking to make money off of disc golf. Maybe younger generations see business as obligated to some greater good. Might even be a great thing. But, I fear those business are in for a rough ride in the real cutthroat world of money making.
VLaForce2002
Par Member
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2017
- Messages
- 182
From a business perspective this is possibly the most neutral and accurate comment I've read (with the addition of JVPhobic's comment about the timing of the announcement).
HOWEVER, from a relationship perspective, it is very understandable why there are so many people expressing pain as to how this process has been handled. It would have taken much more time and effort than the rip off the band aid approach; what if those skills and that time wasn't available "in-house"?
Growing pains? Keen business? Bad PR? I can't seem to make up my mind. One thing seems inevitable: This is the most risk I've seen Steve Dodge embrace since starting the DGPT and he will suffer the consequences and enjoy the rewards.
Hope for the best for everyone
Perhaps it is a generational thing, and something I won't get. I'm in a business that has agreements for a set time and, when the agreements expire, the deal is over.
But I come back to, would the converse be true? If you decided that continuing the current business model didn't work for you, would you feel obligated to do it out of loyalty (beyond your agreed time)? Or would you leave, after your agreed time, to pursue more lucrative opportunities?
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2011
- Messages
- 331
I love CCDG and Jomez and support everything that they do, but I don't get the boycotting the tour thing. Yeah, this is a bad look for Steve Dodge (on the surface level at least, since I don't know what's going on behind closed doors), but if everyone is truly about growing the sport and supporting their favorite players, then not watching the biggest tournaments, that will have the biggest names, is counter productive. Players are going to follow the money, and that's where the best payouts are.
Also, I think this is another case of the vocal majority being the minority in the grand scheme. The average fan of disc golf videos are just going to search for '2019 maple hill open', '2019 memorial'. Then if they are the type to subscribe, they'll subscribe to DGPT's channel. Most probably couldn't care less who's channel it's under, they just want to watch some disc golf.
Also, I think this is another case of the vocal majority being the minority in the grand scheme. The average fan of disc golf videos are just going to search for '2019 maple hill open', '2019 memorial'. Then if they are the type to subscribe, they'll subscribe to DGPT's channel. Most probably couldn't care less who's channel it's under, they just want to watch some disc golf.
spinachd
Eagle Member
I sense that Steve Dodge is a control freak and that is why he wants to bring it all in house. He does not, however, have a history of great competence beyond running the Maple Hill event.
But of course I will check out whatever DGPT comes up with for next year. Maybe it will be great.
Of course, if Jomez was covering it, then I know it would be great, and I know it'd be out the next day. They know what they are doing.
But of course I will check out whatever DGPT comes up with for next year. Maybe it will be great.
Of course, if Jomez was covering it, then I know it would be great, and I know it'd be out the next day. They know what they are doing.
It is a joke that Steve keeps saying that he has a deal on the table for Jomez and hasn't heard from them.
If Steve is going to claim his own in-house production for mpo and fpo lead/chase cards and offer scraps like third card coverage to Jomez, that is not a deal at all.
It is identical to calling someone and saying to them, I'll be sleeping with your wife and living in your house from this point forward, but you can still stay married to her and do holiday dinners with her. Why stay married if all the best parts of marriage have been taken from you? Why would Jomez do coverage if he has swooped in and taken all the best/most profitable elements of Jomez coverage?
If Steve is going to claim his own in-house production for mpo and fpo lead/chase cards and offer scraps like third card coverage to Jomez, that is not a deal at all.
It is identical to calling someone and saying to them, I'll be sleeping with your wife and living in your house from this point forward, but you can still stay married to her and do holiday dinners with her. Why stay married if all the best parts of marriage have been taken from you? Why would Jomez do coverage if he has swooped in and taken all the best/most profitable elements of Jomez coverage?
Future_Primitive
Double Eagle Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2012
- Messages
- 1,770
Seems a little naive not to recognize where you are posing this question no?
Appears to me the DGCR community is simply sticking up for some media members who also happen to be active in said DGCR community. Maybe some folks feel like that their fellow members are getting a raw deal, right or wrong, and are simply voicing their opinions. Some are more passionate than others and some are taking it personally, just an internet forum afterall so I am not the least bit surprised by the wide range of opinions.
Conversely, if there was such a thing as the Steve Dodge Fan Club forum how do you think the conversation would be going over there? Would wager heavily it would be more pro-Dodge in that make believe place.
Future_Primitive
Double Eagle Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2012
- Messages
- 1,770
This is the part that I am against, putting disingenuous statements out to make himself look better. The same crap I hate from other sports like the NFL and NBA doing it. Every year you see some player become a free agent and sign with another team and the former team says we made him an offer to stay for the same amount of money not sure why he didnt take it. Then the details leak and the new team is $20 mil guaranteed while his old team is only $5 mil guaranteed with incentives each year to stay. They are not the same offer, one gives the player better protection while the other protects the team. Its all BS PR spin to cover their own arse for not paying him.
The smart move would have to been vague as hell, we are working with our current partners to secure the best long term solution. Done, say no more. When you start to play the media spin game you insult our intelligence and come off as disingenuous, which is how I now perceive Dodge. I had no opinion before he made his statement, now after he made it my liar detector is going off. I don't know the facts but I know that I now perceive him as disingenuous at best. :thmbdown:
Moseley
Birdie Member
You're over-simplyfing things. When your deals end, don't you know beforehand whether they will be extended? Don't you talk to your partners while under contract, so that you have a good sense if they're happy, or if they want out?
Business is always personal, always has been.
DiscNinja33
Par Member
Especially when it's been posted that he's offered MPO3 coverage at best. Get out of here with that BS, Dodge. Jon Gomez, Ian Anderson, Terry Miller, and their teams made him and now they're getting kicked to the curb. The more I think about it, the more I get pissed for those guys.
broomerang
Double Eagle Member
Only a few people are saying "boycott". I'm not one of them. I am just saying that if CCDG and Jomez do their own thing I would support that decision. I'll watch the DGPT coverage if its good. If its not good I will feel sorry for the TDs that worked so hard to get that DGPT stop endorsement and lose viewers because of Dodge's decision.
I will not pay money to support DGPT. My money is limited and I have choose in the past to support CCDG and Jomez and I will continue to do so.
I will not pay money to support DGPT. My money is limited and I have choose in the past to support CCDG and Jomez and I will continue to do so.
Beable
Double Eagle Member
I pay for the product through Patreon. I don't necessarily have bitterness towards Dodge, but I don't particularly care about him either. I do care about the media teams, inasmuch as I decided to go and give them money monthly on Patreon. And they're the ones whose voices we know through the youtube commentary, participation on these forums, and podcasts. It shouldn't be a surprise when you get a negative reaction from a largely faceless entity going against something familiar and valued.
Here is what I need people to get over. There is no way that the DGPT was going to be able to hire/buy Jomez.
Here are the reasons:
1. Jomez would (and should) demand more money than the DGPT could afford.
2. Jomez isn't going to put broadcasting equipment on their equipment to help reduce the costs. It would hamstring their quality.
3. Jomez isn't going to give up the future and current revenue stream that they have. Between Patreon & YouTube, they have built a decent cash flow for what they are doing.
4. Jomez isn't going to give up their branding, they have spent a lot of time building up an audience and brand.
If Jomez were to "sell" their brand to Steve Dodge, I figure that would be approx around $1,000,000. Assuming they continue to work and provide the same level of quality over the next 4 years or so. But, I don't think that Dodge is looking to buy Jomez brand, as he would be to buy their expertise and apply it to the DGPT brand.
I am NOT saying that Jomez won't be at the DGPT. But if they are, it will be as themselves, and not a member of the DGPT umbrella.
Here are the reasons:
1. Jomez would (and should) demand more money than the DGPT could afford.
2. Jomez isn't going to put broadcasting equipment on their equipment to help reduce the costs. It would hamstring their quality.
3. Jomez isn't going to give up the future and current revenue stream that they have. Between Patreon & YouTube, they have built a decent cash flow for what they are doing.
4. Jomez isn't going to give up their branding, they have spent a lot of time building up an audience and brand.
If Jomez were to "sell" their brand to Steve Dodge, I figure that would be approx around $1,000,000. Assuming they continue to work and provide the same level of quality over the next 4 years or so. But, I don't think that Dodge is looking to buy Jomez brand, as he would be to buy their expertise and apply it to the DGPT brand.
I am NOT saying that Jomez won't be at the DGPT. But if they are, it will be as themselves, and not a member of the DGPT umbrella.
