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[Innova] Beast vs. Archon
- Thread starter Darth Anovin
- Start date
lilbrummy87
Bogey Member
I could have sworn they Vulcan was a -4?
booter
* Ace Member *
vulcan is 13 , 5 , -4 , 2. not what bogey posted.
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my bad. I copied and forgot to change the turn #
But I meant what I said that Charcon is flippier than a Barry Schultz 2X Beast.
Does anyone know when they changed the Beast mold and it got flippier than the "old school" Beasts?
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Hardtongue
Newbie
I've had a few champ beasts (one of which I got my first ace!), as well as a few stars. They used to be my go to driver because they aren't really over or under stable (unless beat to hell), but just plain stable. You can really make them do anything fairly well.
However, I just picked up a star archon about a week ago. The main difference, in my experience, is the beast has a good bit more s-curve to it than the archon. The archon is longer and straighter and will go a little bit further before fading, while the beast will turn over for a bit before it fades back. This makes the archon much better for long tunnel shots. They are both very accurate, but if the fairway is narrow, the archon is the way to go.
Other than that, the archon is just a lot faster and can probably get more max d with less effort.
However, I just picked up a star archon about a week ago. The main difference, in my experience, is the beast has a good bit more s-curve to it than the archon. The archon is longer and straighter and will go a little bit further before fading, while the beast will turn over for a bit before it fades back. This makes the archon much better for long tunnel shots. They are both very accurate, but if the fairway is narrow, the archon is the way to go.
Other than that, the archon is just a lot faster and can probably get more max d with less effort.
captain jack
* Ace Member *
The Beast was introduced in 2002.
It survived, in all plastics, with the "X" wing, until 2005.
When the Orc was introduced, the two discs were almost identical, so in order to have two different flying discs, the Beast wing was changed to the current "L" configuration.
This only applies to Dx and Champion Beasts, the Pro Beasts have always been run with the "X" wing.
Quality first post, welcome to the forum!
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Thanks for that info!
jacob2918
Eagle Member
No pro beasts are also in l wings too. And it blows because the old mold pro beasts BOMB
kcoates
Newbie
I used to throw the pro beasts and I just got a proto star Archon yesterday and threw it for the first time today. I also carry a Star Valkyrie in my bag. I think that the Archon flies slightly similar to both but it has glide for days from the vulcan top. I think it would be best compared to a slightly beat in wraith because it will turn over when thrown hard but it still has enough to come back at the end.
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I agree with you - like the glide on it, seems to take less "oomph" to get same distance. I'd compare to a well broken in Wraith. I couldn't flip my Wraith till it was quite beat up. If Innova worked like Discraft, the Archon would be the "Wraith SS."
kcoates
Newbie
I can get on board with that for sure.
lancer
Newbie
The beast seems a bit flippy now that I can throw farther, but it was basically a shorter archon when I first started.
bbails
Par Member
I throw champion beasts a lot. Bought 3 Archons two weeks ago and have thrown them in the field five or six sessions (in addition to playing rounds with them.) My Archons turn right early, but then straighten out and fade just a tad. My beasts turn a lot later in their flights. Big fan of both. Archons have given me some of my longest throws. They do stay pretty low unless you make an effort to get them up there.
(Incidentally anybody know the best disc to throw a high backhand that turns over, but comes back?)
(Incidentally anybody know the best disc to throw a high backhand that turns over, but comes back?)
Darth Anovin
Eagle Member
This is one thing that Innova has right and Discraft doesn't. When the manufacturer "modifies" a mold, they should give it a different name. I'm sorry but more people will buy the Archon than they would have a Wraith SS. I know Innova doesn't do that, but you get my point. It's very good marketing on their part. Sell something "new" and give it a name that's not an alteration of another product. Then everyone runs out to but the next big driver. I really think it's kinda lame to have a Nuke SS or Avenger SS. They're new and different. Give them new and different names!
Hardtongue
Newbie
Thanks. I've been lurking for a while haha.
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I was just trying to provide a comparison that most people would understand.
And I would say Innova has done the exact same thing, just not as often as Discraft does.
Cases in point:
TeeBird followed by TeeBird-L/TL, and now the the TeeBird Plus Mold
Firebird and the FL
and the Eagle is now available in a Plus Mold as well.
Regardless, I get what Discraft is up to. Their "SS" naming convention immediately gives players some basis for comparison. They're basically saying, "If you like the ___, but want wish it were less stable, then you'd like a ____SS." From what I've seen, SS's pretty much fly like beat-in versions of the "original" molds. I'm not defending Discraft, but see what they mean. Not sure if they actually claim that every SS is necessarily a modified ____, but I really don' care if they do
Regardless of what anyone tells me, I think of the SS's as different discs from the discs they are patterned after. IMO, how companies name their discs is 1/2 dozen of one, six of the other.
The two first run archons I have been auditioning are to me more controllable and longer than the beasts I've tried. Really digging them so far, more glide than a wraith but not as good into a wind. Glad that innova released a driver that isnt warped speed.
Craton
Double Eagle Member
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Yeah definitely longer than the Beast, with nice gliide. Makes sense Archons don't handle headwind as well as Wraiths - the Wraith has greater stability. Rule of thumb is go more stable into the wind, less stable with the wind.
That too!
