[Other] Fly High Discs

[Pbmercil]

I just think it is strange to release a whole line of discs and not tell anyone that it is simply current molds in a new plastic. Especially when one of those rebranded discs is the much vaunted wizard.

I dont think its strange at all. For one, its a fantastic deal for gateway. Dave gets to keep his production running and doesnt even have to worry about if it sells or not, thats Scotts problem and presumably Dave has already gotten paid. Scott doesn't have to try and put the machinery/molds/technical expertise together to run his own stuff, so he saves a fortune in start up costs and can hit the ground running with basically nothing. Im sure the margins are thin for Scott right now, and thats the downside of this kind of operation. Whats strange about that?

 

[AndyJB]

I agree. This doesn't belong in the 'fill, it belongs in a cat box somewhere. It's been said many times before, but the entire concept of this company rubs me the wrong way.

I agree with you, but I also personally know the guys behind it with the exception of Scott Stokely and they are good folk. I had originally heard that the Fly High discs were existing Gateway discs with small mold changes, but now it seems that they are just Gateway discs in a new plastic. I've only held a few, but the AK-47 is making some headway here in Colorado (makes sense, as it is a Wizard). Hopefully they can make some money on these, but I don't see them getting very big, market share wise. I'm not even sure if that is their intent, anyway.

 

[BC Product]

I dont think its strange at all. For one, its a fantastic deal for gateway. Dave gets to keep his production running and doesnt even have to worry about if it sells or not, thats Scotts problem and presumably Dave has already gotten paid. Scott doesn't have to try and put the machinery/molds/technical expertise together to run his own stuff, so he saves a fortune in start up costs and can hit the ground running with basically nothing. Im sure the margins are thin for Scott right now, and thats the downside of this kind of operation. Whats strange about that?

I understand that there are advantages for both parties. The part that I find strange is that these are not new products, yet the discs are being marketed as a new line of discs. They even went through the approval process for previously approved discs. The fact that the wizard is being whored out kind of bothers me.

Why not just run them in whichever plastic you want (as long as it isn't g9i, wink wink) and custom stamp them like I assume Nikko will with his similarly named fly life line.

 

[DeadEye]

Hate to say it, but I hope this company gets put on Scott Stokely's long list of terrible ideas, along with every FB post he's ever made, the hair, and the tats. I'm not one that's too worried about disc golf going mainstream, but do we really want it that 'counter-culture'? A little kid is going to trade for a disc at the course, and come home telling his mom about the 'Sticky-Icky White Widow' he just got from some guy at the park.

Put out good discs in good plastic with a long-term business plan. This seems like a publicity stunt to cater to the kinds of golfers who don't care about the growth of the sport, or even competitive DG in general.

 

[Stable]

Hate to say it, but I hope this company gets put on Scott Stokely's long list of terrible ideas, along with every FB post he's ever made, the hair, and the tats. I'm not one that's too worried about disc golf going mainstream, but do we really want it that 'counter-culture'? A little kid is going to trade for a disc at the course, and come home telling his mom about the 'Sticky-Icky White Widow' he just got from some guy at the park.

Put out good discs in good plastic with a long-term business plan. This seems like a publicity stunt to cater to the kinds of golfers who don't care about the growth of the sport, or even competitive DG in general.

Kinda harsh on Stokely. I might agree with the tattoos being a bad idea though.

There is nothing wrong with this particular 'counter-culture'. I would say this 'counter-culture' has provided a strong and consistent foundation for this very fun game to build on. It's just one of those genres that if you don't like it, don't pay attention to it. I'm one of those "kinds of golfers" and I have a full-time job, buy lots of discs, bought a $200+ golf bag, play 8-10 PDGA tournaments a year and volunteer to work on courses all the time. I very much care about the growth of the game and love competing.

 

[cooter]

lets try to keep this out of the landfill.

And it's on the way there........

Many points to you for trying


I was actually enjoying reading about the discs and their Gateway comparison. Been wanting to try a Karma and if Fly Highs plastic blend is superior I wouldn't mind picking up a few.

 

[AndyJB]

THREAD DRIFT AHEAD: if any of you have seen my videos on Hucking Aces, you know I have tons of tattoos. I got my first one at 18, and have been getting them throughout my military career. I don't really care what you think about them, nor will I tell you what they mean. It's none of your business. But I do hate it when people refer to tatoos as "tats". To those of us who do indeed appreciate body art, that's like calling disc golf "frolf" or "frisbee golf." Its disrespectful and condescending. END DRIFT

I find it weird that Gateway helped developed this new plastic blend for Fly High that everyone who throws them is saying is superior. Maybe the folks at Gateway knew Fly High would never get big enough/get enough respect for it to matter?

As for the approval process, make Stokely and crew decided to get them approved because of the controversial names? Maybe as a goodwill gesture to PDGA?

 

[Gdingy]

I purchased a set of these discs. One tree and they are done for. Threw awesome until deforming. Sad. Wouldn't recommend.

 

[Qikly]

I purchased a set of these discs. One tree and they are done for. Threw awesome until deforming. Sad. Wouldn't recommend.

Just a thought: does anyone think that Stokely's use of base plastic for all his discs reflect the generation he comes from? He's been out of the sport for a while, and in that time there's been a significant move away from base plastic (especially for faster discs). It just surprises me to think of a new company releases fairways in drivers in only what sounds like base plastic these days.

 

[whitefedora]

Kinda harsh on Stokely. I might agree with the tattoos being a bad idea though.

There is nothing wrong with this particular 'counter-culture'. I would say this 'counter-culture' has provided a strong and consistent foundation for this very fun game to build on. It's just one of those genres that if you don't like it, don't pay attention to it. I'm one of those "kinds of golfers" and I have a full-time job, buy lots of discs, bought a $200+ golf bag, play 8-10 PDGA tournaments a year and volunteer to work on courses all the time. I very much care about the growth of the game and love competing.

I don't have a dog in this fight what so ever. I like gateway and I don't care if someone wants to make discs that are how do you say... controversial in naming.

That being said, it doesn't appear that your logic is sound here. If you say you are "one of those kinds of golfers" that is being marketed to, then why do you not have one in your signature? It seems to me that you are grouping yourself into a larger category that should be broken down into multiple skews. The larger category being the people who "understand the reference." Within that there are groups of people that fall into the stereotypical side and the multiple skews of people that don't. This seems to mostly be directed towards the stereotypical skew, but will possibly appeal to the rest within that category (depending on other factors, such as quality, price comparison, availability, color options, etc. i.e. are the discs better to buy than other discs) and more than likely turn off all those who "do not understand the reference" to the point that even if it is better than other discs they still won't buy it. Some even to the extreme that even if they were magical, they wouldn't buy it.

To me, the market share of disc golf is relatively small. To market towards a very specific skew of people within a small category is not great business. The discs would have to be revolutionary to the point that a number of people who didn't agree with the names would overcome their differences and buy them anyways. And that's just to get a piece of a small category. Right now the plastic might be better than other gateway blends, so some of "those golfers" within the whole category might buy them if priced correctly, but very few others will.

This company might make enough to be a slightly lucrative hobby for Stokely, but that's it. And honestly... that's being generous. I hate to see any entrepreneurs fail. The time, money, and stress involved is insane and only that much more heartbreaking when it ends poorly. But the plan and execution were not there.

 

[whitefedora]

Just a thought: does anyone think that Stokely's use of base plastic for all his discs reflect the generation he comes from? He's been out of the sport for a while, and in that time there's been a significant move away from base plastic (especially for faster discs). It just surprises me to think of a new company releases fairways in drivers in only what sounds like base plastic these days.

I think this will follow an oscillating market trend and will always have a divide of people that strictly use one or the other, but that middle area will shift to premium heavy to baseline cycle heavy. I'm not saying that 13 speed baseline is a great idea, they cycle just fine in premium, but I would put my money on speed 7-9's having this trend. Could be wrong. Maybe there will be a revolutionary advancement to the way people cycle and all discs will be premium heavy some day.

However, I bet the combination of Stokely being old school and gateway having a wider variety of baseline plastics to blend and play with are the main reasons this happened. So yes, I do agree, but I don't think it's a horrible idea to be releasing baseline fairways or possibly even control drivers.

 

[shawny0123]

The point of Scott's disc brand along with his ridiculous videos etc. is self-promotion and hype. All of you talking about him is proof it is working. How many other "Pro" disc golfers who have been out of the sport as long as him and haven't really won anything since they returned is anyone talking about? It's obvious he does not care about the image his disc brand is portraying and is only concerned with self-promotion. Anyone that argues it's no big deal needs a reality check. The vast expansion of disc golf courses are on public land and built with taxpayer dollars. The last thing the sport needs is for local municipalities to stop showing interest in the sport because a brand of discs with obvious drug references become well known and like someone said already, little Timmy comes back home after trading discs at the course with a White Widow. All it takes is the wrong parent to have an issue and calls their local paper, voices their anger at the local township meeting etc. to start a snowball effect. Even one course being pulled or not installed from something like this is too many IMO.

 

[roggenb3]

Anyone that argues it is a big deal needs a reality check.

FTFY.

 

[whitefedora]

Shawn- I completely understand where you are coming from. I can even agree that any course being pulled would be a travesty over this; however, this would only really be likely to happen at a pitch and putt course. The company would also have to get big enough that someone had the discs and was wanting to part with it for something else. The stereotype of people this is marketing towards are more than likely going to want to keep their funny referenced discs and don't care about getting better ones.

While I don't want it to ever happen, the likeliness of the right set of circumstances happening seems small. This company just isn't going to get big enough that those odds will increase and if it does happen, it'll most likely only be a pitch and putt course in some public park with playgrounds. It's more likely that someone will be injured by a disc and it getting pulled than this particular situation.

 

[shawny0123]

Shawn- I completely understand where you are coming from. I can even agree that any course being pulled would be a travesty over this; however, this would only really be likely to happen at a pitch and putt course. The company would also have to get big enough that someone had the discs and was wanting to part with it for something else. The stereotype of people this is marketing towards are more than likely going to want to keep their funny referenced discs and don't care about getting better ones.

While I don't want it to ever happen, the likeliness of the right set of circumstances happening seems small. This company just isn't going to get big enough that those odds will increase and if it does happen, it'll most likely only be a pitch and putt course in some public park with playgrounds. It's more likely that someone will be injured by a disc and it getting pulled than this particular situation.

I agree the odds are slim to none.

 

[Pbmercil]

Just a thought: does anyone think that Stokely's use of base plastic for all his discs reflect the generation he comes from? He's been out of the sport for a while, and in that time there's been a significant move away from base plastic (especially for faster discs). It just surprises me to think of a new company releases fairways in drivers in only what sounds like base plastic these days.

Yeah I agree. The idea of making the perfect baseline plastic mid/driver is straight out of the 90's.

 

[Rocaholic74]

Now I'm not one to tell anyone how to raise their children, as I believe that is every parent's God given right. But i'm of the opinion that we must educate our children about the real world and not try to shield them from what they are going to experience in their lifetime. My boys are 9 and 7 1/2 and I've explained to them what they will see on the course from time to time. Educating them is the best option in my opinion because if you shield them and try to hide things from them, what do you think is going to happen when they get older. I knew plenty of kids growing up that didn't even know what it was until they went to college. And guess what happened next, they were the ones that became the "party animals."

As far as Scott's disc project.....I hope it kicks off and he prospers from it. I think he's doing what he loves and what he believes in and if it ruffles a few feathers along the way then so be it. People are taking this too seriously. And for those who are ragging on him about his tattoos and hair....get a life. I'm sure you're not ragging on any of your favorite football players or basketball players as they have more tattoos then most people. Jesus, you people are worse than a knitting circle filled with a bunch of yentas.

 

[scarpfish]

So, all of the fly high discs are just current gateway molds using a new proprietary blend of plastic? Why would they even need to get pdga approval?

Because according to the PDGA specs, its not exactly the same disc.

I just think it is strange to release a whole line of discs and not tell anyone that it is simply current molds in a new plastic. Especially when one of those rebranded discs is the much vaunted wizard.

You mean very close to a Wizard, but not exactly a Wizard.

 

[disctildeath]

I get the comparison, but the beadless gator was not overly prevalent and it would appear that innova has given up molding them and selling them as the gator in favour of giving the disc to hyzer bomb.

I just think it is strange to release a whole line of discs and not tell anyone that it is simply current molds in a new plastic. Especially when one of those rebranded discs is the much vaunted wizard. If RDG had tried to pass the lizard off as a new disc because in was in fossil plastic I do not think you would have garnered as much of a following as you have now.

I'm not sure if these are quite the same, the have obvious inspiration but have some difference in flight and inbound numbers, people compared the KGB to Karma, though a Karma should be more overstable than those numbers on the Fly High line (which an understable Karma for cycling would be good for people who don't want to mix in Elements), Diesel looks like one of the flatter, more overstable Illusions, which if Gateway could keep a decent domed glidey Illusion to be the understable counterpart that would be cool. Guessing the Pure OG is based off the Scout mold and Train Wreck off of the Samurai with maybe slight variation. The one I am looking for feedback on is Jack the Ripper, given the speed numbers was this disc based off of the Apache or Assassin? I would love it if there was something either the same or similar to the Assassin made more available.

 

[chevis]

you guys are inferring a lot about the names. there are no obvious drug references in the names! if some kid takes home any of these it's not like the kid knows that's what it means, nor the parent, unless they have prior knowledge, just like how YOU are inferring what these names are referring to. I'm sure there would be no issue with a Innova white widow or a Discraft AK-47, but 1 company putting both out and BAM inference.


so anyway on with the disc discussion: I wonder if there are plans to put these out in a more durable plastic (at least the drivers).