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1. Your rear hip is nowhere near stacked over your rear ankle - not wiping your butt/stacking posture upright. So your stride and stance are too rounded/wide/closed and you are setup to move to the left of the target line, instead of moving all your weight/momentum inline/linearly to the target and keeping the body in a narrower profile/stance like Will below.
2. Your rear foot is still heavily weighted on the ground when your front heel plants. Ideally your rear heel should be going up/forward before your front heel plants. Will's rear foot is already weightless and has starting sliding to the right a la vintage Greg Norman.
So - in order for the rear foot to go airborne prior to the plant heel touching down, should the rear foot push from the instep to engage the hips happen sooner?
So - in order for the rear foot to go airborne prior to the plant heel touching down, should the rear foot push from the instep to engage the hips happen sooner?
Your question is misconceived. Your hips are two independent joints(like your shoulders) where the femurs rotate from the pelvis/torso. Your femurs/hips can rotate without the pelvis rotating - this happens when you sit or squat with both legs, you should be able to feel the femurs turning inside the pelvis. Your shoulders rotate when you do a push up, but your torso doesn't rotate. If you do a one leg squat your pelvis ends up rotating because there is nothing to counter torque it from the ground and your airborne leg has to either go forward or backward to clear out of the way. In a throw(stance wider than your shoulders) your hips act more independently from each other like a one leg squat.
I think of the rear side as all linear(although there is some rotation), leveraging/maintaining momentum targetward. The rear hip doesn't really rotate the pelvis during the swing because the rear foot ends up sliding behind the front to the right side of the tee to counterweight/balance the arm swing. The rear side is basically done driving momentum before the front side plants and only acts to counter after leaving the ground. So if the rear foot is sliding to the forward/right like Will Schusteric(Hershyzer drill second half), then it's actually anti-rotating the pelvis which allows you leverage/whip the arm forward harder into a wider arm angle giving you more space to accelerate the arm(faster arm speed).
The front side has to catch/brace that linear momentum and transfer it to rotational/angular momentum through the body by extending the front leg which clears/rotates the front hip and turns the pelvis/body with the shoulders, then the arm releases. If you are still trying to drive your rear foot from the ground through the hip when planted on the front side, you will likely hurt yourself(especially in a stance wider than your shoulders).
Been a frustrating couple of weeks, lots of OAT and unintended anhyzer/grip lock.
Went out to the field the other day trying to crush the can more, but not the best results. I feel that my swing is rounding out during the pull through, shanking everything right due to a lack of brace, as SW pointed out earlier in this thread.
I'll post the footage here, but it's more of the same I'm pretty sure. I did slow the footage down and compare it to the lead card driving vid (you know the one) and I believe that I begin my backswing too early. I think that I could benefit from a pre-swing forward during the rear-foot-crossing-behind portion of the x-step to help my timing and to help delay my backswing. Thoughts? I don't think it would be a cure-all, but I do see myself dragging the disc forward into the plant rather than turning more deeply back into the plant.
Also, SW, watching your Crush the Can 2.1 I noticed something with your rear foot, and I'll post a link to a gif I made of it to show what I'm talking about. When you demonstrate the hop into the can crush, right before the plant, it looks like your on or near your heel, then you "spring" up onto the toes to shift (I think?) into the plant. Trying this out just at my house in a walk through feels like it helps drive the weight more and perhaps could help me get off of my rear foot during the swing.
I agree with a pre-swing, it should help keep your more balanced forward and turn back later and better sequencing - see door frame part 3. You still appear to be swaying leftward into the plant instead of striding straighter, and appear to be rounding taking the arm/disc too far back around behind your spine in the backswing. So your body and disc are crossing paths/directions instead of moving more together and keeping the disc outside your spine/body out of the way of a straight swing through. In the door frame drills, your stance would be going across/outside the door frame instead of your stance being inside the door frame so your arm/disc stay wide out to the side.
As you noted my rear heel bounces in the hop crush, see the double crush in bottles and cans and turbo encabulator - I'm getting my weight forward/off the rear side quicker. Your heel is still on the ground and spins out when the front heel plants so you are not crushing the can with all your weight.
I agree with a pre-swing, it should help keep your more balanced forward and turn back later and better sequencing - see door frame part 3. You still appear to be swaying leftward into the plant instead of striding straighter, and appear to be rounding taking the arm/disc too far back around behind your spine in the backswing. So your body and disc are crossing paths/directions instead of moving more together and keeping the disc outside your spine/body out of the way of a straight swing through. In the door frame drills, your stance would be going across/outside the door frame instead of your stance being inside the door frame so your arm/disc stay wide out to the side.
As you noted my rear heel bounces in the hop crush, see the double crush in bottles and cans and turbo encabulator - I'm getting my weight forward/off the rear side quicker. Your heel is still on the ground and spins out when the front heel plants so you are not crushing the can with all your weight.
Awesome, good to know that some of my analysis is confirmed. Excited to implement some of this in the field.
One thing though - when you mention that I'm striding leftward, I think this is a result of me trying to plant closed. I'll refer back to the door frame.
I could be wrong here as it's nearly impossible to see without high FPS slow mo, but it almost looks like you are letting go of the disc rather than holding on at the hit.
I could be wrong here as it's nearly impossible to see without high FPS slow mo, but it almost looks like you are letting go of the disc rather than holding on at the hit.
You could definitely be right. I always hear/read about gripping the snot out of the disc right around the hit, but currently there's so many things I'm trying to correct right now. Mainly the lower body. I'll have to keep this in mind some more in my swing thoughts.
Tried some things out the other day - mainly trying out the backswing differently. I'll post one video here where I tried the buttwipe/hershyzer portion which leaves the disc near the rear foot and the shoulders turn while striding forward to "create" the backswing.
STILL leaving weight on my rear foot though. I've watch the sevam1 "the move" video and SW drills countless times and have been reading countless threads. I just can't figure out what to do with the rear foot or leg at the top of the backswing, or what my first move should be into the transition/downswing. I do know that what I'm currently doing is just pulling my arm through from that point, which I'll wager is improper.
I know that it needs to evert or counter the arm swing, and from watching pro footage it seems that they drive the knee downwards/backwards (although I think you've said that's incidental) and the rear foot is airborne as or even before the plant heel lands/disc comes forward. This move is proving to be painfully elusive to me.
All that said, I did manage one drive about 370' with a flippy-ish wraith, but I want to stop doing this the hard way and get on the right path to the easy, proper way and eclipse that distance.
Part of the issue is that you are not deep enough into the Door Frame Drill. You start turning your shoulder before you get your hips/weight forward and trying to push the arm/disc through from the rear foot. The rear foot should only drive your hips/weight, not the arm/disc. Your upper arm/elbow also lags and collapses/hugging yourself too much, and can't get your elbow forward enough. Think of your elbow as a hinge that only swings the lower arm/disc in and out and the elbow doesn't move forward or back across the chest relatively, only the disc does. The elbow only moves with the shoulders and remains relatively forward of them. So if you "reachback" with your arm extended and elbow forward your shoulders will be turned further back and have a very wide arm.
Ok, so turn shoulders/hips further back into the plant?
I see what you're saying about the rear foot trying to drive the arm. I guess my difficulties are in trying to figure out what it feels like to separate my weight/hips from the upper body and just use my rear foot to push that instead of immediately trying to blast my arm through and rotate shoulders after full backswing.
As far as the elbow is concerned, are you saying it should be somewhat "fixed" to the shoulder, and the lower arm swings from it to allow for backswing, pull through, and extension? (I think Danny on reddit posted about this yesterday)
I think your first throw in Post #24 is the best one. All of your throws look pretty good up until the hit/brace. Instead of your leg going straight and hips clearing, your rotating around. I think they're two issues caused by the same thing; Not getting loaded (or stacked as Seabas says) on your rear leg.
I'd stop thinking so much about crush the can, herchyzer, ect, and start trying to get torqued up on that rear foot more. I don't know if it's posted here, but 'the move' Part 1 and 2 helped explain it to me (post #14 in my thread). That accompanied by trying to stop everything on that inside foot is what helped me figure out how to get a real brace. It's the concept of the hips rotating inwardly that gives the pros that bowed in leg look. This moment is when the loaded back leg is transferring into a loaded right leg in a swivel chair manner. Once you get that loaded transfer down, and you're catching the weight on the inside of the plant foot, there's nothing you can do but extend the leg and clear the hips. It should happen naturally.
OK, so per the usual, what SW has been saying still holds true. I'm not striding laterally, my plant wants to bring me like 45º to the left, which pulls my body in the way of my swing. What's a good way to work on this other than "just stride laterally" (duh)
Also, it seems like my shoulders are getting way out ahead and my upper arm angle is collapsing, leading to a lot of "grip lock", ie yanked shots to the right. Do I need to actively punch or drive the elbow more? Focus on slowing down the shoulders?
And of course, both heels on the ground at the same time or spinning out or weight not forward. I'd wager that a one leg drill prescription is in my future.
So, what first? I see this as three glaring issues, although they may all stem from one fundamental issue
1. Not striding laterally to target/apex of shot
2. Hugging myself
3. Weight left on the rear foot
Ready to rebuild here, I've been getting by for a while with strong-arming to 375' but the inconsistency is killing me. :doh:
Toss a sledgehammer around, make sure your body stays the hell out of the way(to the right) of it swinging back and forth and your arm doesn't get yanked.
Yes, and try the drag your back foot to your plant foot heel:
I couldn't find the ball golf video, but I talk about it first in that video.
Your upper arm is collapsing against your chest causing the rounding, so as SW says "keep it wide".
To get the feel for the "frame" of your upper arm staying perpendicular to your shoulders, take your left hand and grab your RIGHT elbow, locking it into place so that your right upper arm is perpendicular to your shoulders. Now turn back, keeping the left hand holding your right elbow and see how it feels.
OK guys, it's been an exciting past couple of weeks. I was up in CO for a wedding and made time for a lesson with HUB - as I was saying in the Shift from Behind thread, he stuck it out through some nasty weather with me so kudos to Jason (HUB) for that!
We worked on the one leg drill and shifting from behind.
Since then I've been seeing great feedback from my discs for the most part. I think I hit metal three or four times in the last round with standstill putter shots from 150' out or so, my comet is straight money in the 300' range, and drivers are going great for the most part too. OS drivers are gliding straighter and further before fading, and I'm reaching my previous max D much more consistently and with much less effort. I even parked a 420' hole the other day!
That said, it's still not consistent yet, it will obviously take some tuning and practice. Sometimes it feels like I don't fully commit to the rear side driving targetward/the shift, and sometimes the discs comes up a little nose up or too much hyzer. May need to watch the disc more to maintain planes/angles.
I took some video of a few shots today and I think I'm still leaving power on the table, maybe my shift is late or not quite behind me every time. These weren't my greatest shots, a couple were too much hyzer or nose up, the couple from the side were 375' laser beams. But I know the potential is there for a smooth feeling 400'+ shot, so when it does sync up, kaboom.
One aside, I am feeling a bit of tenderness/soreness in the right knee. I feel like I may be getting jammed up a little bit, do y'all see what could be causing that? I plan on taking it easy and sending video to my sister who's a PT. I don't want no knee injuries! I'm also feeling a little soreness in the right hip flexor but I think I've read that can be normal. Hopefully the mechanics can be smoothed out to be lower impact, because I'm really enjoying throwing right now!
Yeah I can see why your knee is angry - You are pivoting flat footed instead of on the heel(crushing the can to the heel in dynamic upright balance). You are also turning backward too early and not staying lateral enough. Also still swaying your butt to the left side of the tee instead of wiping your butt straight targetward/hogan power move and swiveling your chair from the rear foot/knee/hip into the plant. The butt sway keeps you from being able to plant more upright on the front foot/leg, you end up getting stuck behind/right tee side your front foot. Need to squeeze your footwork and posture more upright down the ladder or a skinny hallway more laterally. Your rear foot also should be squeezing forward into the front leg to the right --> after leaving the ground, it goes <--- out around instead, see Hershyzer rear foot going behind and Drag the Foot video in post #21 and Nate Doss video in post #2.
Yeah I was going to suggest crush the can. You are striding/drifting left instead of planting more closed at the last instant, underneath your body more. It all starts with the left in behind step, which I am fighting with as well. Your weight is too far past your toes on the left foot causing you to drift leftward instead of being on top of your legs/thighs and feet.
