Form: Self analysis?

[ChrisWoj]

I did want to talk about this more because my personality type puts me at risk of your dad's Ibuprofen spiral.

Having never been a throwing athlete or almost 40 before, I've had to learn all the maintenance stuff on my own.

Since I have some slightly banged up joints that I never experienced before a couple years ago, I've had to figure out how I can make progress without going overboard. I still can't tell what's optimal because being fully recovered and rested at almost 40 still doesn't feel the same to me as it did at 20. So I guess I don't know what my "baseline" is supposed to be now.

I did change a lot of workout habits which has helped, but figuring out the best cycle between form and field work, playing, active recovery, and full recovery continues to challenge me.

That's rough. But at least you're aware! I just know that the key with the anti-inflammatories and ice is (important: I am not a trained medical professional, lol):

If you are not going to do anything that is going to really strain the injury, you should avoid them. There's no real short term impact, its not like you're gonna go a lil overboard on one injury and wind up with permanent severe loss of pliability, so if you're at all worried that you might be stressing an injury through heavy activity - use it. It's the usage over years that gets you, to where when you're 60 you've got soft tissue that just doesn't stretch or bend well anymore.

The old RICE acronym has people terrified of inflammation. Pair that with the proportion of the population that works somewhat strenuous manual labor and you've got a pretty insidious escalating effect on the population where the huge number of people who DO genuinely need ice and anti-inflammatories to get through their work day without ripping apart swollen tissue makes everybody think they need to reduce swelling.

But remember: SWELLING. IS. GOOD. (at least for soft tissue injuries that are not impacting the nervous system) It is a sign that the body is sending fluids filled with all the good stuff you need to heal. When you impede the travel of those good fluids, you create a poor healing environment and the tissues have to make do with what they have.

 

[HyzerRoc]

I grapple with this a lot... is it better to reduce and reduce the stroke as you get closer to the basket, or is it better to have one repeatable full body motion that effectively works from 15-35? For me (as someone who can't make putts from anywhere anyway, so grain of salt), the more I try to practice a less-motionful 10-20 foot putt, the worse my 30+ foot putts get, and the more I practice the full body putt for 25+, the worse my 10-20 putts get (in the same way as you say, the body gets confused).

Granted it's only been a couple of months of serious putting practice and my putting form has changed on a near weekly basis since then so there is that...

Have some thoughts on that after playing a couple of tournaments and a lot of putting practice: my short answer is that it is best to not think about what you use when putting (just like driving) and just feel the weight of the disc in your hand and let the body use whatever to manipulate it.

Longer answer is that everything scales down in different ways when doing short putts. Weight shift is minimal (you dont want to hold everything stiff), arm action is less, less finger pop and so on. I think some of these can look like players dont use them but you can also shift weight from the ball to the tip of the front foot. Finger pop and wrist can get weird on short distances. One mistake players make is rushing the downstroke, wrist collapses and the putt comes out nose down and misses low. Another is standing too upright, resulting in hitting the band. And last O can observe is missing the finger pop resulting in right releases or again nose down.

@ChrisWoj how do you approach your putting practice? Im asking more in general as I have seen you talk about it in a lot of different places.

I think there is a tradeoff between putting a lot of times from the same position like your suggestion of throwing 5 and moving based on the makes and changing position for every putt. The former practices the stroke and if you do a lot of them also serves as a workout for hand/wrist muscles. The latter practices what happens in a tournament. How do you weigh those two in your practice? Do you do adjustments in technique in both practice modes?

On fiddling with ones putting technique: you mentioned the problem with your back leg in your first post. How do you know something like that is an issue in your putting stroke vs. just something weird that happens on a day or weak for some reason?

 

[ChrisWoj]

Have some thoughts on that after playing a couple of tournaments and a lot of putting practice: my short answer is that it is best to not think about what you use when putting (just like driving) and just feel the weight of the disc in your hand and let the body use whatever to manipulate it.

Longer answer is that everything scales down in different ways when doing short putts. Weight shift is minimal (you dont want to hold everything stiff), arm action is less, less finger pop and so on. I think some of these can look like players dont use them but you can also shift weight from the ball to the tip of the front foot. Finger pop and wrist can get weird on short distances. One mistake players make is rushing the downstroke, wrist collapses and the putt comes out nose down and misses low. Another is standing too upright, resulting in hitting the band. And last O can observe is missing the finger pop resulting in right releases or again nose down.

@ChrisWoj how do you approach your putting practice? Im asking more in general as I have seen you talk about it in a lot of different places.

Looking specifically at what @ninjabq said - I would say that it is best to have a single putt that works for a wide range of putts. I like having a putt that feels the same from 15-36. I like to call it a 27 foot baseline putt. And the pop that it gives me, as it doesn't have a lot of vertical motion, is also useful for putts from that 8-15 foot range when its windy and I just want to move the disc through the wind quickly before it can be too impacted.

I think there is a tradeoff between putting a lot of times from the same position like your suggestion of throwing 5 and moving based on the makes and changing position for every putt. The former practices the stroke and if you do a lot of them also serves as a workout for hand/wrist muscles. The latter practices what happens in a tournament. How do you weigh those two in your practice? Do you do adjustments in technique in both practice modes?

I address, really, pretty much all of this here: Perfect practice makes perfect | Disc Golf by Dynamic Discs

The link is to an archive of a blog post I made for Dynamic Discs a while back, it is a three parter but all 3 parts are on that page - so it's a lil long. Part 1 is mostly an intro, and Part 2 starts to get into it a little, but Part 3 is where I really address what you're asking. Let me know if you have any questions about that.

On fiddling with ones putting technique: you mentioned the problem with your back leg in your first post. How do you know something like that is an issue in your putting stroke vs. just something weird that happens on a day or weak for some reason?

Short answer to 'how do you know': Reps on reps on reps.

Long answer: There really isn't a "vs" in there, in my eyes. If it's something weird that happens on a day or a week for some reason, well, that IS an issue in the putting stroke. It's just that if you're working regularly you can identify ways to fix it during the pre-shot routine, and make it something that won't happen (though, surely, something else will always come up! But again, that's where the reps come in - that's where you find the source of the inconsistency). It's like you said in response to ninjabq - I want to eliminate the need to think about it, by establishing a base that the putt consistently emerges from in my pre-shot routine.

Appreciate you tagging me. This game is so fun to talk about.

 

[HyzerRoc]

Getting back to you a little late here. Thanks for linking that post, I like the more analytical approach, trying to differentiate different modes of thought when playing. And the writing is also really clear and enjoyable

I think your answer to my putting practice question really is to do both. Mastering the stroke so it becomes second nature (or part of the cerebellum, although I hope that is not just some pop-science) and practicing the ability to assess different throws from different distances, angles and heights. My colleagues research education in a school context and they really say something similar you are saying about quizzing here: practicing for a test improves the retention of the material you are learning. Maybe I should incorporate some kind of litmus test into my putting practice to have something more specific I want to improve on and can also fail on improving on.

The differentiation between the two selves has lately become really apparent to me as I have kind of taken a break from trying to improve my throw and instead try to improve my lines and play. During the pre-shot routine, when putting or driving there really is little difference between both, I assess the angle, height, disc choice and so on. Then I try and forget all of that and just think of the line. Not think about my angle at all, how to move my body and so on. On days im well rested and manage the switch well it really gets into a flow state I have previously only experienced when I still used to play a lot of league of legends. Just effortlessly recalling the stuff I can already do and applying it during the round.

On the last point you made here: I'm routinely really tired after work and when going out to putt the motion can feel really off at times. I'm wondering if I should just call it quits on these days to not practice and reinforcing a motion that if off that day and come back when I'm more focused. Maybe to approach this differently: do your drives/approaches/putts feel differently to you depending on the day and your state of mind? Do you feel the need to focus on different aspects on them depending on the day to execute them? And on tournament days, do you just try and replicate whatever you felt during practice or do you go out for practice throws and putts at the start of it and make adjustments based on how those feel for the tournament day and account for likely missis based on your form on that particular day?

Let me know if this is taking the thread in a different direction than you meant this thread to take. I dont want to hijack this one

 

[GeezerGolfDFW]

We should learn how to adjust our "strokes" for various conditions. Sometimes the condition to adjust is the condition of our body or mind. I played doubles this morning in the heat and humidity. After about fifteen holes all four of us were dragging. I deliberately stopped to center myself and breathe on the tee of the 15th hole. I got one of my longest most accurate holes. I also notice I am over "wristing" with my understable drivers. I need to adjust my positioning and throw for certain discs and conditions such as wind. Playing when tired is just one more condition to adjust when playing.