Innova can rest easy

[Parks]

Under 700 feet for the destroyer? Does that mean that the XS, TeeBird and Valkyrie are still the only discs (that I know of) to 'officially' go over 700 feet?

Throw ESP Flashes in there, too.

 

[TeeRexJJ]

Under 700 feet for the destroyer? Does that mean that the XS, TeeBird and Valkyrie are still the only discs (that I know of) to 'officially' go over 700 feet?

and isn't the valk the only one to go over 800? wasn't it 820ish?

and david wiggins throwing 577 for 13 and under is nuts. on the innova site it says ken climo's furthest throw is 550. i can't wait until this kid is about 20 years old. he'll be killing every distance record there is. (which to my knowledge is only 1)

 

[cojsmith08]

and isn't the valk the only one to go over 800? wasn't it 820ish?

Ken Jarvis threw a DX Teebird 810 ft.

 

[bortimus]

Ken Jarvis threw a DX Teebird 810 ft.

Did he make the putt? :lol:

Cheesy, I know.

I can't imagine what these throws look like.

 

[cojsmith08]

Ken Jarvis threw a DX Teebird 810 ft.

Did he make the putt? :lol:

Cheesy, I know.

I can't imagine what these throws look like.

I don't know how much left to right action, but I do know they have a considerable amount of height (40+)

 

[Parks]

I assume they record these distance events. I would like to see some crazy long shots, too.

 

[Working Stiff]

Here was a description on PDGA.com:

Erin Hemmings had a huge throw of 228 m. That was the longest throw of the weekend. He threw a 167 Star Roadrunner. About 100 feet high and screaming. The wind carried it perfectly.That was the only real big throw today.

 

[Seanzerelli1]

Wouldn't be surprised if they're compiling the videos to sell on a dvd, but I figure there would be some youtube footage at least, even if I can only see the first half second of the flight before the disc disappears into the low video quality.

 

[JR]

I saw an episode of Michael's travel show where he traveled in a bus in Finland among a lot of elderly people. They didn't look too pleased about the song. What a waste of breath those lyrics. Montains, ponies? What's he smoking?

On topic: Jussi wrote that a lot of the big names didn't make the cut to finals because they were trying too hard and failed. He was going for consistency because he was still learning to throw at that altitude and with those winds. He didn't nail any throws the way he would've liked. He hyzer flipped even though he thinks high annies would be better. He couldn't get them to work. He said he picked up a lot of new discs at Innova but wasn't specific about the discs actually used in the competition. I think there's a good chance assuming between the lines that he threw at least that 166 pro Destroyer from the batch he picked up from Innova on the way to the competition.

Does anyone else think the way the competition is set up is funny? I am stoked that top two open spots and bronze in the masters came to Finland but somehow throwing less than others and winning doesn't sound right to me. I mean WFDF arranged another event the day after Big D where just like in track & field events the best result wins. No matter when it was thrown. On the other hand there's a 2 meter per second rule nulling records achieved at higher than that wind speeds. Doesn't the fact that the WFDF event exists point out the need for the longest throw wins competition? And driving the point home they are held on consecutive days in the same place.

In any case DG long distance competitions are partly luck of the draw events where the person having the fastest winds pushing the disc and having lucky lifts in the flight at the right time gains advantage. That may not decide the winner but just as well may. The world record had three "towering lifts in the end". And faster winds than the 45 minute old Teebird world distance record before it.

It'd be interesting to see the results, disc selections and flight lines used by the top guns in calm conditions at sea level, at 3000' like Primm and 6000' IIRC where the a lot of the world's longest throws prior to last year had been thrown. Unless I'm totally off base with my memory of the altitude in a list of 20 longest throws to a few years back up to that moment were. What was the place Fort Collins???, Arizona if I recall correctly as being the venue for 18 of the 20 longest officially accepted throws up to that time.

Finland, Finland, Finland
The country where I want to be
Pony trekking or camping
Or just watching TV
Finland, Finland, Finland
It's the country for me

You're so near to Russia
So far from Japan
Quite a long way from Cairo
Lots of miles from Vietnam

Finland, Finland, Finland
The country where I want to be
Eating breakfast or dinner
Or snack lunch in the hall
Finland, Finland, Finland
Finland has it all

You're so sadly neglected
And often ignored
A poor second to Belgium
When going abroad

Finland, Finland, Finland
The country where I quite want to be
Your mountains so lofty
Your treetops so tall
Finland, Finland, Finland
Finland has it all

Finland, Finland, Finland
The country where I quite want to be
Your mountains so lofty
Your treetops so tall
Finland, Finland, Finland
Finland has it all

Finland has it all

 

[JR]

Here was a description on PDGA.com:

Erin Hemmings had a huge throw of 228 m. That was the longest throw of the weekend. He threw a 167 Star Roadrunner. About 100 feet high and screaming. The wind carried it perfectly.That was the only real big throw today.

Jussi Meresmaa was too tired to get best possible results so he acted as a spotter for the rest of the Finns during round three of the WFDF competition. Names weren't mentioned but more than one person had cracked finger tips at the end of the event in the Finnish team alone.

 

[TeeRexJJ]

and isn't the valk the only one to go over 800? wasn't it 820ish?

Ken Jarvis threw a DX Teebird 810 ft.

are those the only known throws over 800 feet?

 

[cojsmith08]

and isn't the valk the only one to go over 800? wasn't it 820ish?

Ken Jarvis threw a DX Teebird 810 ft.

are those the only known throws over 800 feet?

those are the only two in competition

heres a list of the longest throws ever, might be a little dated
https://www.discgolfvalues.com/bigd_distance.htm

 

[Takeichi]

I never can find video of a drive going more than 600 feet, other than ones thrown off cliffs and the like.

there's a reason they hold the contest in the desert.

tons of PURE wind.

throwing deep
step (1): find minimum of 25mph wind
step (2): put the wind @ your back
step (3): throw an understable disc 4 your arm strength


i was told that if your an above avg arm without "distance competition" distance, one can easily add 120ft to your longest drive. those with more knowledge of the pure distance throw can tack on 200ft and beyond their longest throw.

also the elevation is 3000 ft so the air is thinner thus getting more speed from your throw

 

[JR]

On Zonedriven.com Avery Jenkins says in his blog that for Valarie Jenkins height difference between sea level and 3000' at Primm can add up to 25 % of distance for her.

Avery didn't mention anything more specific to allow speculation on my part which kind of flight lines and speed vs spin amount and other factors are in play with the distance increase. Not having thrown anywhere but at sea level or close to it I have no clue about height differences. And how they scale. Is increasing distance linear to the thinning of air and what else beside humidity makes a difference? And are the differences linear? And does that 25 % extra D only apply for 400' sea level throwers or is it the same increase for people of different drive lengths?

I never can find video of a drive going more than 600 feet, other than ones thrown off cliffs and the like.

there's a reason they hold the contest in the desert.

tons of PURE wind.

throwing deep
step (1): find minimum of 25mph wind
step (2): put the wind @ your back
step (3): throw an understable disc 4 your arm strength


i was told that if your an above avg arm without "distance competition" distance, one can easily add 120ft to your longest drive. those with more knowledge of the pure distance throw can tack on 200ft and beyond their longest throw.

also the elevation is 3000 ft so the air is thinner thus getting more speed from your throw

 

[garublador1]

On Zonedriven.com Avery Jenkins says in his blog that for Valarie Jenkins height difference between sea level and 3000' at Primm can add up to 25 % of distance for her.

The way I read it that figure includes the expected winds, too. I'm not sure all of that can be attributed to a 3000' elevation change.

 

[x-out1]

On Zonedriven.com Avery Jenkins says in his blog that for Valarie Jenkins height difference between sea level and 3000' at Primm can add up to 25 % of distance for her.

The way I read it that figure includes the expected winds, too. I'm not sure all of that can be attributed to a 3000' elevation change.

^---- i'd agree with that.

the elevation change (thinner air) does have an effect on the amount of extra flight. i think it's been covered by the MLB quite well, a la coors field.

 

[Johnnytothec]

Because I have so far been unable to support myself as a pro disc golfer (not many 900 rated players can), I become an airline pilot. If you are not interested in the theory behind why discs behave differently at altitude, just skip to the bottom. This topic has been touched on in other threads, and Bradley Walker's posts are pretty much spot on. But I will give it a go from the beginning with why discs fly and then how air density affects their flight.

There are basic forces that affect flight: lift weight, thrust and drag. Weight opposes lift and drag opposes thrust. When the disc leaves your hand it is at its maximum speed because the amount of "thrust" you produced in the pull far outweighed the parasitic (form drag from the shape of the disc) and induced drag (drag created as a byproduct of lift) of the disc and so the disc accelerated dramatically. At the moment the disc is released, the drag on the disc is at its maximum. The disc begins to slow because there is no force to oppose the drag.

When the disc travels through the air, some air particles go over the top of the disc, and some go underneath it. The air that goes over the top of the disc must travel a farther distance than the air that passes on the underside of the disc. This is because the air passing underneath the disc does travels in a straight line, while the air that went over the top of the disc had to travel in a curved path, tracing the rounded top of the disc. This does two things to the air, first it accelerates it, and second it lowers the pressure. Now, because there is a pressure difference between the bottom and top of the disc, there is an upward force acting on the disc to counteract gravity.

When you release a disc and it is traveling at 50mph that is the disc's air speed, not the ground. Airspeed is based upon how many air particles are passing over the disc-wing. The density of air, or density altitude, affects how many particles are in a given volume of air. If you threw a disc with a true airspeed of 50mph, then repeated that exact same throw in air that was 10% less dense, the disc would have the same airspeed, but 10% faster over the GROUND.

Because it is air density that matters, not just altitude, the other factors that must be considered when looking for ideal distance conditions are temperature, barometric pressure, and dew point. A high density altitude (low air density) not only affects the speed the disc travels over the ground, but also the amount of lift and drag. Because there are less particles for a given space of air, there are less particles to create the pressure difference that cause lift. Because there is less lift, there is less induced drag.
---

When throwing with high density altitude, you get a higher ground speed, less drag, and less lift. This is the EXACT same as throwing with a tailwind. I think the best way to adjust for playing in air of a different density than you are used to is to spend a practice session in a soccer field shaping different shots and adjusting your distances before playing a competitive round. If this is not an option, I came up with a rule of thumb that will get you in the ballpark of what to expect. For every 1000' of density altitude increase, throw like there is an additional 1mph of tailwind to the wind vector, or just add 1mph of headwind for each 1,000' decrease in density altitude.

 

[twisted discer]

Hey Johnny, sorry I don't have a clever comment to insert. 8) I enjoyed reading your well written explanation of disc aerodynamics. There is just one point though that I can't get behind.

You stated: "When you release a disc and it is traveling at 50mph that is the disc's air speed, not the ground. Airspeed is based upon how many air particles are passing over the disc-wing. The density of air, or density altitude, affects how many particles are in a given volume of air. If you threw a disc with a true airspeed of 50mph, then repeated that exact same throw in air that was 10% less dense, the disc would have the same airspeed, but 10% faster over the GROUND."

So here's my understanding: If you released the disc from your hand @ 50mph in zero wind, the disc would have an airspeed of 50 and a ground speed of 50 at that moment. Since the disc is now traveling through less dense air, it has less drag, and can travel farther with the correct throw. The only way the ground speed will vary one way or the other is with wind. No hard feelings.

 

[Johnnytothec]

I checked it out, and Twisted Discer...you win this round :lol: