Shifting correctly makes bracing easy

[Mocheez]

So does the diagonal shift apply to sidearm throws too?

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

So does the diagonal shift apply to sidearm throws too?

No, because you can resist your forward momentum very naturally facing forward, just like a baseball pitcher.

 

[sidewinder22]

No, because you can resist your forward momentum very naturally facing forward, just like a baseball pitcher.

I disagree, you still shift to the plant foot closed or from behind you pitching/FH like the Hershyzer Drill which is actually a pitching drill. You can tell this shift is just like BH by how my rear foot everts behind the front leg just like BH, and also note my front foot is not completely facing the trajectory/apex and the delivery is more lateral/sideways across the front foot rather than over top of it. The difference between BH and FH is the lead vs rear shoulder you throw from vs the stance.

 

[RFrance]

HUB I was watching your video again and at the end (starting at 9:09) in the Heavy Recap you discussed the transfer of momentum. https://youtu.be/eULzMfHKyvA?t=547

So this got me searching the interwebs for conservation of linear momentum. I came across this video and in the beginning he has a demo of dropping a basketball with an apple sitting on top of it. For me this was a good visual of transferring the momentum from person to the disc. Also, the better the brace and form the better the transfer and conservation of the momentum and the faster the disc will go. (For lesser geeks all the good stuff is in the first minute of the video.)

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

The more I'm dialing in the direction of shift and the direction of plant-step, I'm finding that it's an interesting mixture of things.

1. I have the best results when I can step in the 20 degree left position, but keep my moment shift more targetward. The actual direction of momentum shift is tough to tell, but I'm guessing 5 degrees left of target.
2. As I'm throwing hyzer, with spine angled forward, I have the best ability to resist and thus transfer momentum to the disc. Flat and anhyzer feel less natural for getting that powerful resistance feeling.
3. My habit of getting off the ball of the back foot via being flat footed is going away, I'm more rolling ball of the foot through the instep - so I really feel like I never come off the "pitching rubber" flat footed anymore. Not sure this matters terribly - but I do like the extra momentum I get from dropping the whole way.

 

[RFrance]

The more I'm dialing in the direction of shift and the direction of plant-step, I'm finding that it's an interesting mixture of things.

1. I have the best results when I can step in the 20 degree left position, but keep my moment shift more targetward. The actual direction of momentum shift is tough to tell, but I'm guessing 5 degrees left of target.

HUB that is interesting. The other day I thought it finally clicked for me when I actually lined up in the diagonally stance (30 - 45 degrees left of target for RHBH) and trusted to actually shift in my body direction instead of the target direction. There was a big difference in power as the disc released target ward similar to an intentional grip lock. A real "aha" feeling. If I relapsed and went back to shifting more target ward the power decreased. I figure I had been crossing the momentum streams and losing power.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

HUB that is interesting. The other day I thought it finally clicked for me when I actually lined up in the diagonally stance (30 - 45 degrees left of target for RHBH) and trusted to actually shift in my body direction instead of the target direction. There was a big difference in power as the disc released target ward similar to an intentional grip lock. A real "aha" feeling. If I relapsed and went back to shifting more target ward the power decreased. I figure I had been crossing the momentum streams and losing power.

I'm still working out what feels best and what results happen , So I imagine there is quite a ways to go. It seems like there is a variety of momentum shift's and step directions That you can use to achieve different results. I'm glad that this is opening some doors and giving us some new stuff to play with!

 

[richardo-san]

Amazing thread guys. Just joined DGCR after someone pointed me here from reddit and there's so much good discussion and information going around here.

I found that taking what I learned from this thread really complimented the thread about using your lat for the pull, at least in particular the "Flapping vs lats" video here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HN0ZmV-29HY

After work yesterday focusing on those three things (directional shift, downshift style, and the flapping vs lats) I had a big aha moment where I felt like I was finally using my arm to fire the disc from my body vs still somewhat strong arming the disc. Really noticeable increase in power without throwing "hard" at all, especially with putters and mids. Was having a hard time not overthrowing holes with slower discs than I normally throw on them and I ended the day comfortably birdying a hole I haven't dreamed of birdying without a long throw in in the past.

You guys rock.

 

[T-Birdz]

Love this!!!
Do you guys use this way of bracing on upshots to or is it more of a 80%+ thing?

 

[slowplastic]

Love this!!!
Do you guys use this way of bracing on upshots to or is it more of a 80%+ thing?

I just try to always keep my momentum going a consistent direction throughout the shot. I think I feel like I stride less of an angle or diagonal direction on lower power, but it also may just feel less drastic because there is less pace and less width to the steps. Basically once you trust your shots are a bit closed from your positioning the aiming becomes pretty natural.

 

[RFrance]

I've started using it on my standstill upshots. The diagonal line up for me is a little less (about 20 degrees left of target) but I include a little compression and pump in the swing. My accuracy is a lot better. It is also easier to get a feeling of the concept with the slower pace of upshots.

 

[RocHucker]

In the golf video, Clay talks about how lag in the club is essential to harnessing the shift in momentum. Is the forearm the disc golf equivalent of the club? So then the disc golf equivalent of Clay's hands (which pull away from target to create parametric acceleration of the club) would be the elbow? So is the importance of the "power pocket" simply that it sets up the "club lag" of the forearm lagging behind the elbow?

 

[slowplastic]

In the golf video, Clay talks about how lag in the club is essential to harnessing the shift in momentum. Is the forearm the disc golf equivalent of the club? So then the disc golf equivalent of Clay's hands (which pull away from target to create parametric acceleration of the club) would be the elbow? So is the importance of the "power pocket" simply that it sets up the "club lag" of the forearm lagging behind the elbow?

Yeah I'm kind of thinking of it that way. It's not exact but more similar than thinking of the disc as the club.

So when you swing a golf club it's easy to feel its weight and how it wants to lag back. In disc golf....got to feel your arm's weight and not just tense it up and tell it where to go. If you feel how your arm is heavy and has its own momentum, then it will lag back naturally and on camera you will appear to have that elbow bend and power pocket position. If you try to get your elbow forward and make the power pocket, usually you end up telling the arm to bend and where to go so you don't get the same lag/bend and natural extension.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

I'll agree with SP, it's easier for me to feel when I think of the arm as a double pendulum. It bends, and the elbow goes forward.

Thinking, "move the elbow forward" seems to create a disconnect between my body's momentum and the disc.

 

[sidewinder22]

Double Pendulum or Reciprocating Dingle Arm:

 

[centervolume]

Slight pause at height of momentum then pull away from the target - genius

 

[crd 81]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVMLLvLsAdc#t=32m09s

Check around the 32:10 mark where Kevin and Calvin briefly talk about the brace.

Kevin- "It's all about exerting that force into that step"

 

[sidewinder22]

Dr. Kwon explaining how vertical motion creates torque.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEUYTYDqGBA&t=35m20s

 

[smoothplayer]

Diagonal stance, diagonal and vertical shift, and rotational bracing:
Upshot:

Full Swing:

When I was tossing the hammer I was pulling it 20 feet right on a 70 foot hammer throw. Do I simply need to be closed stance more or closed shoulders longer into the throw? I also plant my right foot a bit open too which is also likely a cause of losing any leverage.

I max out at 400 feet on a great throw. I am inconsistent though with slipouts. Not getting a good rip off my index consistently. Like marginal.

Should the hammer be going down the line?

 

[sidewinder22]

When I was tossing the hammer I was pulling it 20 feet right on a 70 foot hammer throw. Do I simply need to be closed stance more or closed shoulders longer into the throw? I also plant my right foot a bit open too which is also likely a cause of losing any leverage.

I max out at 400 feet on a great throw. I am inconsistent though with slipouts. Not getting a good rip off my index consistently. Like marginal.

Should the hammer be going down the line?

Close shoulders more to target, which probably means also closing your stance. Hammer/disc should release relatively straight from about a 20 degree left diagonal swing path.