[Axiom] Tantrum...throw one

[Streets]

Speaking of tantrums.......

 

[Moose33]

I think that for me if they just had the Octane/Mayhem and something like a Phase/Energy and one flippy slot for the folks that like that they would do just fine. As much as High Speed drivers sell we are into overkill territory here.

 

[Moose33]

I don't know about you guys, but I only throw my distance drivers 2-4 times per most rounds anyway.

 

[Halcón]

I don't know about you guys, but I only throw my distance drivers 2-4 times per most rounds anyway.

That's because you can throw over 400 feet. :|

I throw max D on almost every hole. And also on a few approaches. But it's totally course dependent.

 

[Streets]

That's because you can throw over 400 feet. :|

I throw max D on almost every hole. And also on a few approaches. But it's totally course dependent.

I want to play a round with you at some point and witness this

 

[Halcón]

I want to play a round with you at some point and witness this

Lulz. I'd love the chance to kick your butt all over the woods.

 

[GripEnemy]

To rain on everyone's parade:

DGCR isn't most disc golfers. They're a business and want the Chad's and neckbeards of the world to buy their **** instead of Bosses, Nukes, and Grooves.

 

[Moose33]

That's because you can throw over 400 feet. :|

I throw max D on almost every hole. And also on a few approaches. But it's totally course dependent.

Just curious, what do you throw for Max D? You've said, but I forgot. I don't throw MVP all the time, but the Motion and Fireball pretty much go 90% as far as the Phase for me, and the Volt does the same ish as the Octane/Mayhem backhand.

 

[Halcón]

Just curious, what do you throw for Max D? You've said, but I forgot. I don't throw MVP all the time, but the Motion and Fireball pretty much go 90% as far as the Phase for me, and the Volt does the same ish as the Octane/Mayhem backhand.

I don't have the arm for any of the big boy drivers. My go-to dependable (keep it in the fairway) max is a 150's Wave right now. When it's go for broke D, I'll flip the Orbital, but it's tough to hit the right angle every time.

150's Insanity is also a great distance driver for my arm. Fission Photon, too.

 

[PMantle]

I don't know about you guys, but I only throw my distance drivers 2-4 times per most rounds anyway.

9 times on our Purple course, and 8 on the Gold course.

 

[asc349]

I agree there is an abundance of high speed DD. I can't imagine they will have anywhere else to go with high speed once they make the 3 Axiom molds to compliment mvp's 24mm class. Maybe they're just getting them done while they're in that phase of designs and then focus on the other gaps that need filling in mids and speed 6/7 discs.

 

[BrotherDave]

They're just now getting decent pros sponsored by them. I don't blame them for fleshing out their distance driver classes to keep them happy and to help attract more big name players. They'll get around to making a brick for us duffers to muscle from rough to rough eventually.

Sucks it's going to be so wide, I'm tempted to get one just for punderful name.

 

[Letsgothro]

They did get approved by pdga for a disc called Deflector. It was weighted up to 179g I think. I was hoping to see that in their release this month. I was hoping it would be that os mid we all want.

 

[VLaForce2002]

I agree with the high speed overkill argument from the perspective of aging noodle arm (Vanish is my longest disc)... On the other hand I prefer the fancy colors of Axiom and will always pick an axiom disc with the same or similar flight path over the MVP equivalent. What looks like duplication is possibly a nod to some marketing principle based on brand/look loyalty (Ye olde fanboi principle).

OK, now let's get on with that Deflector, MVP!

 

[MonkeyGrass]

To rain on everyone's parade:

DGCR isn't most disc golfers. They're a business and want the Chad's and neckbeards of the world to buy their **** instead of Bosses, Nukes, and Grooves.

Then release what everyone has been asking for - not a dozen high speed drivers with barely any noticeable difference between them.

THAT is how they will get more business. If MVP/Axiom were to ever release the OS PnA/Mid we've been asking for - every single Gybroni on the planet would buy at *least* one or more of them (myself - 3 or 4). That's a lot of sales. These HS drivers appeal to a very small, very NOOB group of players. Counting on that group of Chad's to prop up your business model, instead of catering to the folks who already support your business, would be a very foolish decision. Coz Chad ain't about to spend $17.99 on a new MVP disc. That eats up wayyy too much of his PBR budget for the week. He's eyeballing that used Groove in the bin at PIAS for $8.

I'll pass on these un-usable high speed monsters, just like the last round (and same with the 4 other MVP/Axiom guys I play with). We play in the WOODS around here, folks. Not much opportunity for Max D 400+ shots. Give me a speed 4/5 resistor/fireball? I'm in.

 

[brutalbrutus]

I know at least one Gybroni who wont buy one...



@elmex...

 

[hugheshilton]

Then release what everyone has been asking for - not a dozen high speed drivers with barely any noticeable difference between them.

THAT is how they will get more business. If MVP/Axiom were to ever release the OS PnA/Mid we've been asking for - every single Gybroni on the planet would buy at *least* one or more of them (myself - 3 or 4). That's a lot of sales. These HS drivers appeal to a very small, very NOOB group of players. Counting on that group of Chad's to prop up your business model, instead of catering to the folks who already support your business, would be a very foolish decision. Coz Chad ain't about to spend $17.99 on a new MVP disc. That eats up wayyy too much of his PBR budget for the week. He's eyeballing that used Groove in the bin at PIAS for $8.

I'll pass on these un-usable high speed monsters, just like the last round (and same with the 4 other MVP/Axiom guys I play with). We play in the WOODS around here, folks. Not much opportunity for Max D 400+ shots. Give me a speed 4/5 resistor/fireball? I'm in.

I think your view that the majority of disc golf buyers are people like yourself and your buddies who support a single company and don't throw anything faster than a Volt is rather skewed. I think the point GripEnemy was making is that you and your 4 buds are actually the minority. Newbie players and those who don't know a lot about disc golf who tend to buy lots of high speed drivers (because, FAST) are actually the majority, not people like us. They tend to play in small, open park-like courses and throw their bosses 200 feet or less, and they definitely outnumber people who know what they're doing. And if they go to a Dick's and are confronted by an $18 champion Groove and an $18 Proton Tantrum, they might very well buy the Tantrum based solely on the looks (and of course SPEED). That's purely hypothetical since I've never seen a big box store carry MVP, but having more high speed drivers does make you more appealing to that crowd.

I think that MVP probably knows their own business, and if they thought they'd sell boatloads of overstable mid/putters/tweeners, they probably would have already made one. The reality is that even among experienced players, those aren't huge sellers. A lot of people bag one as a utility disc, but it doesn't necessarily get thrown a lot and rarely gets replaced because it's mostly thrown on upshots or short drives where there's little danger of losing it or having it lose stability from hard collisions.

 

[MonkeyGrass]

I think your view that the majority of disc golf buyers are people like yourself and your buddies who support a single company and don't throw anything faster than a Volt is rather skewed. I think the point GripEnemy was making is that you and your 4 buds are actually the minority. Newbie players and those who don't know a lot about disc golf who tend to buy lots of high speed drivers (because, FAST) are actually the majority, not people like us. They tend to play in small, open park-like courses and throw their bosses 200 feet or less, and they definitely outnumber people who know what they're doing. And if they go to a Dick's and are confronted by an $18 champion Groove and an $18 Proton Tantrum, they might very well buy the Tantrum based solely on the looks (and of course SPEED). That's purely hypothetical since I've never seen a big box store carry MVP, but having more high speed drivers does make you more appealing to that crowd.

I think that MVP probably knows their own business, and if they thought they'd sell boatloads of overstable mid/putters/tweeners, they probably would have already made one. The reality is that even among experienced players, those aren't huge sellers. A lot of people bag one as a utility disc, but it doesn't necessarily get thrown a lot and rarely gets replaced because it's mostly thrown on upshots or short drives where there's little danger of losing it or having it lose stability from hard collisions.

First off - MVP is a *new* business in this game, and they've made plenty of mistakes. They've created multiples of discs that overlap all over each other, major holes in their lineup, and they are learning as they go. They release discs in the same class in bunches, and flood the market with similar discs. This all common knowledge, and a regular point of discussion - it's not anything groundbreaking here. Same ole stuff. So no - MVP really doesn't know their business all that well yet. They are still figuring it out.

Keep making assumptions about my game and my crew. You don't anything about either of them. And you know what they say about making ASSumptions...

I happen to throw plenty of speed 12 drivers. I even have a couple 13's in the bag - but I don't need 6 of them. And they are the least-used discs in any of my bags. I also throw discs from plenty of other companies. There's no freaking real world difference between speeds 12-13-14 unless you've got a Lizotte 500+ arm. And a wide open field to throw them in. Around here? We don't. You get trees. Everywhere. In the middle of darn near every fairway, and having to flex utility discs around obstacles is a HUGE part of NC golf. It cannot be understated. Also, your assumption that theses discs don't get replaced frequently, is also dead wrong. A BT Harp or DX Gator can only take so many tree hits.. and when you throw them nearly every hole as an upshot - they have to be cycled frequently as they lose all stability if you use them as a primary driving putter or upshot disc. Don't get me started on water approaches... Ugh.. I lose Harps all the freaking time because it's my driving putter/upshot/short water approach disc. I throw one on almost every hole that requires anything other than a straight, 150' or less upshot. That's a lot of throws, and a lot of chances to lose a disc.

Two of my closest friends, manage retail disc golf stores. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I know the sales figures on what sells. And what doesn't. I don't need "hypotheticals". I have actual information. Relevant to this topic. But please - feel free to keep creating hypothetical situations that support your point. It's quite amusing.

Yeah right the Harp is a total "niche" disc that nobody throws. Ricky hardly touches his...
Same with a Gator. :wall: Get real, dude. It's one of the most thrown discs in anyone's bag, if they use that mold. It's also consistently sold OUT in both stores. Both Harps and Gators are literally impossible to keep in stock around here. Ya know why? Coz of the courses we play.

I think *YOU * are suffering from the delusion that all disc golfers are like you - and regardless of who is right or wrong in this particular debate, I see absolutely ZERO reasons to make disparaging remarks about my game and my friends. Good stuff there boss. :thmbup: Keep it up.

Damn near every person who enjoys the gyro, has been begging for an OS PnA for the last 2 years - IRL and on DCGR and the MVP FB groups. I don't recall a single MVP thrower starting a thread asking for MORE HS drivers. Do you? I'll wait...

...

...

...

MVP in Dicks and big box athletic stores... Yeah, you've got a real good grip on the DG market, I can tell. :doh:

 

[brutalbrutus]

I don't recall a single MVP thrower starting a thread asking for MORE HS drivers. Do you? I'll wait...

Well... not since the Photon class came out...

The only disc I have thrown above the Photon class is a nitro. I am not really sure why its still in my bag at this point other than crazy wind because I cant throw a FH over 150ft anymore...

So that makes 13 out of 14(Assuming Axiom does 3 in the 24.5 class) discs I've never thrown and have zero desire to...

 

[hugheshilton]

First off - MVP is a *new* business in this game, and they've made plenty of mistakes. They've created multiples of discs that overlap all over each other, major holes in their lineup, and they are learning as they go. They release discs in the same class in bunches, and flood the market with similar discs. This all common knowledge, and a regular point of discussion - it's not anything groundbreaking here. Same ole stuff. So no - MVP really doesn't know their business all that well yet. They are still figuring it out.

Keep making assumptions about my game and my crew. You don't anything about either of them. And you know what they say about making ASSumptions...

I happen to throw plenty of speed 12 drivers. I even have a couple 13's in the bag - but I don't need 6 of them. And they are the least-used discs in any of my bags. I also throw discs from plenty of other companies. There's no freaking real world difference between speeds 12-13-14 unless you've got a Lizotte 500+ arm. And a wide open field to throw them in. Around here? We don't. You get trees. Everywhere. In the middle of darn near every fairway, and having to flex utility discs around obstacles is a HUGE part of NC golf. It cannot be understated. Also, your assumption that theses discs don't get replaced frequently, is also dead wrong. A BT Harp or DX Gator can only take so many tree hits.. and when you throw them nearly every hole as an upshot - they have to be cycled frequently as they lose all stability if you use them as a primary driving putter or upshot disc. Don't get me started on water approaches... Ugh.. I lose Harps all the freaking time because it's my driving putter/upshot/short water approach disc. I throw one on almost every hole that requires anything other than a straight, 150' or less upshot. That's a lot of throws, and a lot of chances to lose a disc.

Two of my closest friends, manage retail disc golf stores. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I know the sales figures on what sells. And what doesn't. I don't need "hypotheticals". I have actual information. Relevant to this topic. But please - feel free to keep creating hypothetical situations that support your point. It's quite amusing.

Yeah right the Harp is a total "niche" disc that nobody throws. Ricky hardly touches his...
Same with a Gator. :wall: Get real, dude. It's one of the most thrown discs in anyone's bag, if they use that mold. It's also consistently sold OUT in both stores. Both Harps and Gators are literally impossible to keep in stock around here. Ya know why? Coz of the courses we play.

I think *YOU * are suffering from the delusion that all disc golfers are like you - and regardless of who is right or wrong in this particular debate, I see absolutely ZERO reasons to make disparaging remarks about my game and my friends. Good stuff there boss. :thmbup: Keep it up.

Damn near every person who enjoys the gyro, has been begging for an OS PnA for the last 2 years - IRL and on DCGR and the MVP FB groups. I don't recall a single MVP thrower starting a thread asking for MORE HS drivers. Do you? I'll wait...

...

...

...

MVP in Dicks and big box athletic stores... Yeah, you've got a real good grip on the DG market, I can tell. :doh:

Wow, I guess we're in the right thread here. Cool story. U mad bro?