How do you handle fast play/feeling rushed in tournament/league play?

[autocrosscrx]

It's nice when things just flow and it goes great. Nothing better than those rounds.
They feel so much more relaxed and you tend to play better.

LOL. It was probably the opposite. Played a heavily wooded course and the card in front of us lost a disc and had to re-tee on the first hole and we were backed up all day. Plus, each of my cards had multiple cart people, and cart people seem to move a lot more slowly shot to shot as they often have to take an indirect path.

 

[Sheep]

LOL. It was probably the opposite. Played a heavily wooded course and the card in front of us lost a disc and had to re-tee on the first hole and we were backed up all day. Plus, each of my cards had multiple cart people, and cart people seem to move a lot more slowly shot to shot as they often have to take an indirect path.

Cart people generally stand around their carts while the bag people are 20-30 seconds ahead of them. hahahah

 

[davetherocketguy]

Y'all are just jealous of our awesome carts.

 

[Sheep]

Y'all are just jealous of our awesome carts.

I sold my delta

Never used it after i got a pound bag.

 

[Steve West]

...

I, however, do believe the rules are written poorly. Very poorly. But this isn't rocket science either.

...

Has anyone else noticed that most everyone who says "the rules are written poorly" does not know the actual rules?

For example, there is no "addressing the lie" in disc golf. None, nowhere. There are so many errors in your version of the rules it's quite understandable that you think the rules are poorly written.

Here is the entire Excessive Time rule. Maybe actually read it, follow it, THEN criticize it.

802.03 Excessive Time
Last updated: Friday, December 31, 2021 - 15:50
________________________________________
A. A player has taken excessive time if they are present and have not thrown within 30 seconds:

1. After the previous player has thrown; and,
2. After they have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie; and,
3. After they are next in the throwing order; and,
4. During which the playing area is clear.​

B. A player who takes excessive time receives a warning for the first violation. A player who takes excessive time after having been warned for it during the round receives one penalty throw. See 811.F.5 for a player who is absent when it is their turn to throw.

C. A player may request extra time from the group to take a bathroom break. If the player does not return in a reasonable time, the player is considered missing for the hole and receives a score of par plus 4 for the hole.

As an exercise for the student, I'll let you discover for yourself all the mistakes you made in describing the rule.

 

[thecandydan]

Y'all are just jealous of our awesome carts.

So jealous that I just gave my cart away to a friend a few weeks ago after not using it for 3-4 years. Lol

Cart people are generally slower but not that bad. Now rangefinder people on the other hand . . .

Re: op's original question, if you occasionally count to 30 while playing you realize how long that actually is. It's a lot of time for 99.9% of us.

 

[Sheep]

Has anyone else noticed that most everyone who says "the rules are written poorly" does not know the actual rules?

For example, there is no "addressing the lie" in disc golf. None, nowhere. There are so many errors in your version of the rules it's quite understandable that you think the rules are poorly written.

Here is the entire Excessive Time rule. Maybe actually read it, follow it, THEN criticize it.



As an exercise for the student, I'll let you discover for yourself all the mistakes you made in describing the rule.

I see what you're trying to get at.
But here is the issue.
Addressing your lie is not defined.
Nor is "reasonable amount of time to arrive" before the 30 seconds starts.

The biggest issue is addressing your lie.

Cause you can hang back and figure out what your'e going to do, and that breaks the a.1 part.

We can all agree that stepping on the tee pad starts your 30 seconds. But when the disc is in the field. is when you get there, or when you place your marker? when you step to your lie?
When you're in 5 feet? 10 feet?

The thing to remember with players in disc golf, for some reason, is rules have to hold their hands.

The rules are poorly defined for those who don't understand what "reasonable" is.

I understand what it is, some of us in here might. But a lot of people dont.
So when there is weird grey area's, people use them to their advantage.

Most players approach their lie, set their bag down, talk a bit, think stand around. then actually step to their lie and then take the 30 seconds, or maybe they back off, then back on.

The reason the distraction rule was removed was because people kept using this as an excuse to take excessive time.
And with cards being self policing, you can, as a group, agree that it was a legitimate distraction or not. Before it was more or less the player up to bat making that decision.


If you want to criticize my statements, ask questions about what you're unclear of with my statements, dont proclaim i dont know the rules or follow them.

So again, the rules are poorly defined as players will make excuses based on "reasonable" and when its "their turn" or when they have "approached the playing area" of their disc.

It's not rocket science, but the main issue over this whole thing comes down to the lack of enforcement as a whole of the rules of disc golf in general.
Which is because rules are not enforced a majority of the time, those rules are pretty much not rules anymore.
And when they are enforced on anyone, they feel singled out and picked on because they have grown accustomed to breaking the rules time and time again.

 

[Steve West]

I see what you're trying to get at.
But here is the issue.
Addressing your lie is not defined.

That's because the timing is not based on addressing your lie. The term "addressing your lie" in not even in the rules anywhere.

Nor is "reasonable amount of time to arrive" before the 30 seconds starts.

That's because it relies on the judgement of the players in the group. They are on the ground and know how long things should take. The alternative would be a 1000-page tome listing all the factors that go into figuring out what a reasonable amount of time is. If two players can agree the thrower has clearly taken more than a reasonable amount of time, the rule can be called.

The biggest issue is addressing your lie.
Cause you can hang back and figure out what you're going to do, and that breaks the a.1 part.

If any of that were correct, it would be a problem.

Again, there is no such thing as addressing the lie.

You cannot hang back to get more time.

If you are hanging back. you've obviously had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie. If you are hanging back and it's your turn and the playing area is clear, the clock has already started.

The rule does not include "figure out what you're going to do" in the definition of when the 30 seconds starts. Just like it doesn't list "shoot and post a video".

We can all agree that stepping on the tee pad starts your 30 seconds.

No.

If you have stepped on the tee pad you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie. But, the clock would not start if it was not your turn, nor would it start if the playing area were not clear.

Also, the clock can start before you step on the tee pad. If you are standing just off the tee pad when it is your turn and the playing area is clear, you are burning your 30 seconds.

But when the disc is in the field. is when you get there, or when you place your marker? when you step to your lie?
When you're in 5 feet? 10 feet?

Any of those would usually indicate you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie. There would be exceptions. For example, if the last 10 feet crossed a chasm or something.

But the bigger point is that refusing to do any of them (when you could have already) does not delay the start of the clock.

The thing to remember with players in disc golf, for some reason, is rules have to hold their hands.

Yes, certain players seem to be in need of that. Fortunately, there are four players on most cards, and only two of them need to know how to enforce this rule.

The rules are poorly defined for those who don't understand what "reasonable" is.

The word itself? Or how long it should take to get ready to throw?

I understand what it is, some of us in here might. But a lot of people dont.

Everyone understands it in their own way, and that's OK. If two players both agree the thrower is taking an unreasonable amount of time, then the thrower can be called for it.

If there aren't two players who think so, it isn't clear, so no call is made. That's how the rule is supposed to work. It's not a hard-line shot clock that everyone needs to start at the same moment.

There is no buzzer going off at the end of 30 seconds, either. After the player throws, everyone assesses whether the thrower clearly took more than 30 seconds after the amount of time they should have needed. If they clearly did, make the call.

So when there is weird grey area's, people use them to their advantage.
Most players approach their lie, set their bag down, talk a bit, think stand around. then actually step to their lie and then take the 30 seconds, or maybe they back off, then back on.

None of that has to do with the judgement of "reasonable". That misuse is all due to the myth that the 30 seconds starts only when the thrower "addresses their lie".

I think most players would agree that the thrower has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie when they set their bag down by it. The clock SHOULD start then.

The rules as written are clear about that. The rules as people misheard them through word-of-mouth, maybe not.

The reason the distraction rule was removed was because people kept using this as an excuse to take excessive time.

True.

And with cards being self policing, you can, as a group, agree that it was a legitimate distraction or not. Before it was more or less the player up to bat making that decision.

What? No.

It was removed, not changed into a group decision.

Even if the group agrees it was a legitimate distraction, the thrower does not get more time.

(The thrower does get more time if the playing area is not clear.)

If you want to criticize my statements, ask questions about what you're unclear of with my statements, dont proclaim i dont know the rules or follow them.

Fair enough. Now that I've had my coffee, done.

So again, the rules are poorly defined as players will make excuses based on "reasonable" and when its "their turn" or when they have "approached the playing area" of their disc.

Leaving "reasonable" to the judgement of the players is the only way the rule can work.

It's hard to imagine a player getting extra time by arguing it is not "their turn". That's something that can be resolved quickly.

The rules don't say anything about "approached the playing area". If someone is claiming they get as much time as they want to approach the playing area, the rules clearly don't support it.

Players do not get to wait for their birthday to throw. I think it is pretty clear the written rules don't allow for that, either.

It's not rocket science, but the main issue over this whole thing comes down to the lack of enforcement as a whole of the rules of disc golf in general.
Which is because rules are not enforced a majority of the time, those rules are pretty much not rules anymore.
And when they are enforced on anyone, they feel singled out and picked on because they have grown accustomed to breaking the rules time and time again.

I agree. One thing that would contribute to the solution is if each of us makes the effort to read, understand, and use the written rules.

Paraphrasing, passing along misinformation, and introducing concepts that are not in the rules just gives players another excuse to not enforce them.


Until then, keep in mind that it usually only takes one warning to get even the slowest players to play at a good pace. At least enforce that no-harm part of the rule.

 

[WD09]

Re: op's original question, if you occasionally count to 30 while playing you realize how long that actually is. It's a lot of time for 99.9% of us.

Many years ago a pro was making this point to me. He said, "Don't think about 30 seconds of your favorite song, think about those local car commercials where the guy is yelling at you the whole time. You will understand how long 30 seconds really is."

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

I think everyone makes good points as always...

What I have noticed is the trend with these arguments is that people that are heavily entrenched at the "pro I've read the rules for 20yrs level" have a fair understanding of the application of the rule and the history of its refinement.

There are many of us on DGCR that have read the rule and also debated it with people who are more savvy on the application of the "rule" historically and are now smarter than the average bear.

I agree that you need multiple tomes to clarify every situation. I also agree that there is a lack of clarity. Perhaps "arrive at and determining the lie" needs better clarification, like half a tome.

Look at the Corey Ellis thread.... On camera and to the majority of the public it seemed like he had taken way too long, debate ensues. MTL shows up and says hey I was the official and he timed in at 29.5 seconds. Debate probably continues haha since new posters didn't read the whole thread.

At a professional rule reading level the rule is apparently clear.

At a new player or standard league level there is apparently a ton of debate and misapplication.

My position is the same, I don't want to be rushed nor slowed horribly down. I've timed myself, by the time I catch my breath, focus and get in the zone I consistently burn 20+ seconds. I like to set my feet, take a quick practice swing then letter rip. I don't think 30 seconds is quite as gratuitous as some people think.

I think idiots running down the fairway deserve to be slowed down. If you want to play speed golf with your Bro-mies do it but not in a tourney/league setting. No one should be bunching up on the pad or running ahead.

I agree with autocross that its a difficult situation being back of the card when people are horny to time 30 seconds on you. Especially less than professional level golfers. This is exacerbated when you shank a few and it's your turn two or three times in a row, the "runners" have already had 2 or 5 minutes to plan their shots and are receiving an advantage by having that extra time.

After your second first available tree it would be nice to have a break to get a hold of yourself, shake it off, focus and not let your round get away from you without some Yahoo pointing at his watch.

If I'm 45 and halfway to busted and I end up on a card with some 20yr old speed golfers I'm sure 2 of those guys would agree that I'm too slow, if I end up on a card with 2 grandmasters they will tell me I'm a fast player

 

[Sheep]

That's because the timing is not based on addressing your lie. The term "addressing your lie" in not even in the rules anywhere.

That's because it relies on the judgement of the players in the group. They are on the ground and know how long things should take. The alternative would be a 1000-page tome listing all the factors that go into figuring out what a reasonable amount of time is. If two players can agree the thrower has clearly taken more than a reasonable amount of time, the rule can be called.


If any of that were correct, it would be a problem.

Again, there is no such thing as addressing the lie.

You cannot hang back to get more time.

If you are hanging back. you've obviously had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie. If you are hanging back and it's your turn and the playing area is clear, the clock has already started.

The rule does not include "figure out what you're going to do" in the definition of when the 30 seconds starts. Just like it doesn't list "shoot and post a video".



No.

If you have stepped on the tee pad you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie. But, the clock would not start if it was not your turn, nor would it start if the playing area were not clear.

Also, the clock can start before you step on the tee pad. If you are standing just off the tee pad when it is your turn and the playing area is clear, you are burning your 30 seconds.



Any of those would usually indicate you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie. There would be exceptions. For example, if the last 10 feet crossed a chasm or something.

But the bigger point is that refusing to do any of them (when you could have already) does not delay the start of the clock.



Yes, certain players seem to be in need of that. Fortunately, there are four players on most cards, and only two of them need to know how to enforce this rule.



The word itself? Or how long it should take to get ready to throw?



Everyone understands it in their own way, and that's OK. If two players both agree the thrower is taking an unreasonable amount of time, then the thrower can be called for it.

If there aren't two players who think so, it isn't clear, so no call is made. That's how the rule is supposed to work. It's not a hard-line shot clock that everyone needs to start at the same moment.

There is no buzzer going off at the end of 30 seconds, either. After the player throws, everyone assesses whether the thrower clearly took more than 30 seconds after the amount of time they should have needed. If they clearly did, make the call.



None of that has to do with the judgement of "reasonable". That misuse is all due to the myth that the 30 seconds starts only when the thrower "addresses their lie".

I think most players would agree that the thrower has had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie when they set their bag down by it. The clock SHOULD start then.

The rules as written are clear about that. The rules as people misheard them through word-of-mouth, maybe not.



True.



What? No.

It was removed, not changed into a group decision.

Even if the group agrees it was a legitimate distraction, the thrower does not get more time.

(The thrower does get more time if the playing area is not clear.)




Fair enough. Now that I've had my coffee, done.



Leaving "reasonable" to the judgement of the players is the only way the rule can work.

It's hard to imagine a player getting extra time by arguing it is not "their turn". That's something that can be resolved quickly.

The rules don't say anything about "approached the playing area". If someone is claiming they get as much time as they want to approach the playing area, the rules clearly don't support it.

Players do not get to wait for their birthday to throw. I think it is pretty clear the written rules don't allow for that, either.



I agree. One thing that would contribute to the solution is if each of us makes the effort to read, understand, and use the written rules.

Paraphrasing, passing along misinformation, and introducing concepts that are not in the rules just gives players another excuse to not enforce them.


Until then, keep in mind that it usually only takes one warning to get even the slowest players to play at a good pace. At least enforce that no-harm part of the rule.

I think the point you're missing that I'm trying to drive home is because some of these things are not clearly defined, players are to stupid to enforce them regardless of reading the rules or not because they do not understand the rules.

Everyone's version of "reasonable" is different. And everyone's opinion of when the clock starts is different. Some people think it doesn't start until you approach your disc, set your bag down or whatever it is. This is where the rules are not good, as there is no definition of what to judge the rule on.

It's not a matter of you or I understanding the rule, it's a matter of others understanding the rules and trying to think in their shoes.

You and I both clearly understand how it works, but it's blatantly obvious that others do not as they continually break the rules themselves and don't enforce it.

I'm a black and white rules kind of guy when it comes to things. But I also have an understanding that the world isn't perfect, and that's the point of a group policing itself. Circumstances can be agreed upon as a group for officiating the rules in special circumstances.
But were talking special circumstances, not something that happens 2 or 3 times a round.

But otherwise, Players should be enforcing the time rule, they should be enforcing the foot fault rules as well as well as many others.
But if you were to just watch disc golf as it is without any knowledge of the rules, you'd not even think that most of these things are rules, because they are not enforced.

My personal opinion is TD's walking with these cards or rules officials on the course need to start warning/stroking players for not paying attention to their cardmates throwing.
The point of that rule is so you're watching for them to make an error, as well as to help them find their disc if they loose it.
If they are not calling the penalties and warnings, they must not have been paying attention.

Everyone cries for "officials on every card." That's not going to fix the issue, just make it worse. But unless players return to enforcing the rules like proper adults, it's never going to really get any better and these issues that we have had lately are going to become more and more of a thing.

It's like the "spirit of the game" thing people talk about.
It's not in the rules. There is no rule that says "if its in the spirit of the game, let it slide." It's more of a talking point of knowing when a rule can be broken as in, should not be enforced under special circumstances.

And another part of the issue is just the overall ability of players to not get dramatic over being called on breaking the rules. You watch people get warned, and they just go out of their way to be jerks the rest of the round. And players dont want to deal with that. SO they let things slide, and that should NEVER happen in either case. Your attitude at that point should be called out by the card, and your childish outbursts should get you warned, stroked and ejected if they keep up.

Having dealt with this crap at a major tournament, it was a huge PITA as a player basically bullied another person, and we had to have the assistant TD warn them and walk with the card.

 

[Sheep]

I think everyone makes good points as always...

What I have noticed is the trend with these arguments is that people that are heavily entrenched at the "pro I've read the rules for 20yrs level" have a fair understanding of the application of the rule and the history of its refinement.

There are many of us on DGCR that have read the rule and also debated it with people who are more savvy on the application of the "rule" historically and are now smarter than the average bear.

I agree that you need multiple tomes to clarify every situation. I also agree that there is a lack of clarity. Perhaps "arrive at and determining the lie" needs better clarification, like half a tome.

Look at the Corey Ellis thread.... On camera and to the majority of the public it seemed like he had taken way too long, debate ensues. MTL shows up and says hey I was the official and he timed in at 29.5 seconds. Debate probably continues haha since new posters didn't read the whole thread.

At a professional rule reading level the rule is apparently clear.

At a new player or standard league level there is apparently a ton of debate and misapplication.

My position is the same, I don't want to be rushed nor slowed horribly down. I've timed myself, by the time I catch my breath, focus and get in the zone I consistently burn 20+ seconds. I like to set my feet, take a quick practice swing then letter rip. I don't think 30 seconds is quite as gratuitous as some people think.

I think idiots running down the fairway deserve to be slowed down. If you want to play speed golf with your Bro-mies do it but not in a tourney/league setting. No one should be bunching up on the pad or running ahead.

I agree with autocross that its a difficult situation being back of the card when people are horny to time 30 seconds on you. Especially less than professional level golfers. This is exacerbated when you shank a few and it's your turn two or three times in a row, the "runners" have already had 2 or 5 minutes to plan their shots and are receiving an advantage by having that extra time.

After your second first available tree it would be nice to have a break to get a hold of yourself, shake it off, focus and not let your round get away from you without some Yahoo pointing at his watch.

If I'm 45 and halfway to busted and I end up on a card with some 20yr old speed golfers I'm sure 2 of those guys would agree that I'm too slow, if I end up on a card with 2 grandmasters they will tell me I'm a fast player

Lots of great points here.

That's why I argue the point of "when does the clock actually start."

The PGA rule is a bit better and would probably serve disc golf far better as well.

Which is essentially "You cannot cause an unruly delay."
AKA, stalling. Taking excessive time.

I think they put a time limit on it for the other reasons I mentioned. People not being able to decide what is "unruly."

I've never ever seen or had any of the issues with rules, time and many other things in ball golf tournaments. I've never seen them as an issue working PGA events.

But Disc Golf? hahahah< it's like everyone has a 4th grade education when it comes to the rules, and everyone is entitled to break them at will.

Playing this game is super straightforward. Dont be a dunce, follow the rules and dont dilly dally.
I'm not asking you to run to your lie, I'm not asking you to not think before you throw.

But play with some vigor and enthusiasm that doesn't hold up the group.

The idea that some people take excessive time around those who play quicker should give the person who takes excessive time and is slow some idea that they are playing slow.

Which is the original start of this whole thread. He's basically asking "do i need to play faster?"

And this turned into a time discussion, which is great. cause when we discuss it, we all gain a better understanding.

But, the whole world doesn't read these, so only a handfull of us become better aware of the rules and other things. Unfortunate.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

It's like the "spirit of the game" thing people talk about.
It's not in the rules. There is no rule that says "if its in the spirit of the game, let it slide." It's more of a talking point of knowing when a rule can be broken as in, should not be enforced under special circumstances.

And another part of the issue is just the overall ability of players to not get dramatic over being called on breaking the rules. You watch people get warned, and they just go out of their way to be jerks the rest of the round. ....
........

Having dealt with this crap at a major tournament, it was a huge PITA as a player basically bullied another person, and we had to have the assistant TD warn them and walk with the card.

This is what I'm concerned about, giving people a purchase point to chink apart the game that I love with bad understanding of rules, messing with the "fair" spirit of the game and bad attitudes.

I'm an occasional pro level threat 1 tourney out of 10, rest of the time I'm just a chucker. I don't take it too serious, I don't get bent when I play with ams in doubles, but if I'm in a "good group" my game can absolutely catch fire. Historically if I'm in a cool, pro level group I have my best rounds... if I play with some bitter dip sh|t with a stopwatch all the time I might actually try that there devil stick golf I always here about.

I've been lucky to play with guys/gals that are "legends", they don't move real fast but they're not dogging it. I don't know think they fit the 30 seconds clock (more like 45 sec) but they have instilled in me an unmatched love of the game, knowledge of the rules and fair play. I wouldn't want to change.

I want to live in a world where autocross can play his/her game without idiotic distraction at a reasonable pace without persecution from some speed demons.

 

[Rastnav]

It's like the "spirit of the game" thing people talk about.
It's not in the rules.

It's literally the very first rule, 801.01 Fairness. It doesn't say what you seem to think is meant by the phrase, but it absolutely captures the idea of the spirit of the game.

These rules have been designed to promote fair play for all disc golfers. In using these rules, the player should apply the rule that most directly addresses the situation at hand. If any point in dispute is not covered by the rules, the decision is made in accordance with fairness. Often a logical extension of the closest existing rule or the principles embodied in these rules will provide guidance for determining fairness.

 

[davetherocketguy]

So has anyone actually timed other players to see just how long 30 seconds is in real world play? No? Well, I did a little bit of that tonight with players at our PDGA league tonight. Guess what, not one came anywhere near 30 seconds. Not even close. The longest was a putt that was a whopping 10 seconds. I challenge anyone here to submit a video of someone at a PDGA league or tourney going over the 30 second mark. I'm telling you 30 seconds is longer than y'all think it is.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

So has anyone actually timed other players to see just how long 30 seconds is in real world play? No? Well, I did a little bit of that tonight with players at our PDGA league tonight. Guess what, not one came anywhere near 30 seconds. Not even close. The longest was a putt that was a whopping 10 seconds. I challenge anyone here to submit a video of someone at a PDGA league or tourney going over the 30 second mark. I'm telling you 30 seconds is longer than y'all think it is.

When did they arrive at and determine their lie?

I clock 20 seconds on average, from the time I'd mark and throw on a simple putt/drive. It depends on whether you count the time it takes me to put my bag down and grab a mini... or look from my lie before I put it down. What about wiping the mud off it? Haha.

If I can get there before it's my turn I can: Launch in 10...9...

I guess I support slower play, are y'all playing only in open fields? And what kind of tournament is ever rushed? Any tourney I play takes forever haha, there is absolutely no point in rushing when there's already two groups waiting on the next pad, sooner you get there sooner you go cold.

I'm totally behind autocrosscrx on this one.. I hope the tournament went well.

 

[autocrosscrx]

I was worried about my pace before I did any tourneys, so I filmed a round.

I'm about 23 seconds on a putt from when I mark my disc. Mark disc. Remove old disc. Take 3 or 4 steps back. Take a breath. Bounce dry bag in my hand a bit. Walk up. Take a stance. Couple of practice "swings". Let it go. I got up to about 27 or 28 seconds on a few tougher putts. Under 10 seconds on obvious layups or stuff within about 15 feet. More like 15-20 seconds on stuff from like 15-25 feet.

Tee pad? Under 10 seconds.

Approaches are a lot more complicated. It could be anywhere from under 10 to about 40 depending on how you define determine lie. And everybody takes over a minute on those shots where it is a challenge to get your foot to your disc, then you have to find a line and then determine if you can actually have an arm swing.

 

[mojorooks]

I was worried about my pace before I did any tourneys, so I filmed a round.

I'm about 23 seconds on a putt from when I mark my disc. Mark disc. Remove old disc. Take 3 or 4 steps back. Take a breath. Bounce dry bag in my hand a bit. Walk up. Take a stance. Couple of practice "swings". Let it go. I got up to about 27 or 28 seconds on a few tougher putts. Under 10 seconds on obvious layups or stuff within about 15 feet. More like 15-20 seconds on stuff from like 15-25 feet.

Tee pad? Under 10 seconds.

Approaches are a lot more complicated. It could be anywhere from under 10 to about 40 depending on how you define determine lie. And everybody takes over a minute on those shots where it is a challenge to get your foot to your disc, then you have to find a line and then determine if you can actually have an arm swing.

From the way you are describing it, if I was on your card it wouldn't bother me. In fact, I probably wouldn't notice any issue.

I would never call someone on time. Bad Karma. I would be paranoid of my own time the entire rest of the round. I putt relatively fast but I know if I was better at slowing down and taking my time I might get better.

 

[ru4por]

From the way you are describing it, if I was on your card it wouldn't bother me. In fact, I probably wouldn't notice any issue.

I would never call someone on time. Bad Karma. I would be paranoid of my own time the entire rest of the round. I putt relatively fast but I know if I was better at slowing down and taking my time I might get better.

I DO understand your hesitation. BUT, this is the very problem with this entire discussion. It is your responsibility to make ANY calls as they happen. It is not personal attack. It is a job you sign up for at registration. Getting calls against us, is also part of the understanding agreed to at sign up. It is to make the tournament play on a level playing field. It ensures fairness to EVERYONE. By ignoring calls, we are intentional giving a player an advantage.

I have NEVER called a time violation. It is never really on my radar. Honestly, you could take two minutes and I would not notice. I am in my game. Focused on my headspace. It is simple to watch for things like foot faults, it is casual observation. I do not have ANY kind of timing device with me....no watch, phone, stopwatch, sundial....nothing. I DO think the infraction, has a foundation in repeated violation and reputation. But, you reap what you sow, in this case.

In using "you" here, I am speaking about all of us, really.

PS...I think y'all are watching WAY too much YouTubes, if you are taking this kind of time. I have a careful pre putt routine and I think I am in the chains in about 7 seconds.

 

[autocrosscrx]

PS...I think y'all are watching WAY too much YouTubes, if you are taking this kind of time. I have a careful pre putt routine and I think I am in the chains in about 7 seconds.

I think most people that I've played with take at least 7 seconds to mark their disc and then clear out loose rocks/limbs/twigs/etc from underneath their footing.