2019 Pros Switching Sponsors Official Thread

[ThunderEagle]

The ONLY thing Paul would do if any of that turned out to be a true offer, would be to use that as a bargaining tool to get an even better deal with Innova. It would not surprise me one bit if we eventually see some kind of long term announcement where Paul is given a much higher stake in the company. It's to the point where Innova = McBeth = Innova imop.

Absolutely a possibility. I could also potentially see that Innova wouldn't want to give away that much of the store too. I don't know how much of a hit Innova takes loosing McBeth. Do they want to? Obviously not. Do I fee it is likely? Not really, but I could easily see something being possible as it could be worth more to Discraft to snag him than it is to Innova to keep him.

My whole point is, it isn't out of the question that something could be done. I watched this play out in Archery with the Greatest 3D Archer in the world when he moved from Matthews to Elite Archery, and several other top pros followed suite. Matthews is very much like Innova in the archery market place, been around forever, many fanboys who won't shoot anything else. It made a big splash, but ultimately after a few years, this archery moved back to Matthews. They may have paid to get him back, maybe it actually hurt, who knows. I just don't think you can say never to this being possible.

I DO think it would be crazy interesting to see if it was something like they would let him be heavily involved in the design of new discs. No idea if they would be any good, just curious as to what one of the greatest to play the game would come up with.

 

[DiscFifty]

Now....Wysocki to Discraft.. that might make more sense business wise for obvious reasons. Doss / Jenkins seem to be more interested in making beer than throwing frisbees, Johansen should be a master's age player by now. Ricky should be the #1 player in all the silly "Trilogy" marketing mainstream but he still doesn't seem to get a lot of media hype, at Discraft he could be the #1 franchise player. He would definitely stand out on Discraft's "Elite Team" page:
http://discgolf.discraft.com/team.html

 

[pearlybakerbest]

Hokom to MVP was my bold prediction. Saw her putting well with mvp plastic at the HOFC and the commentary seemed to get really awkward when talking about it. Especially Elaine King who is team MVP, and they just ended it by saying "we'll just have to wait and see" or something along those lines.

In the graham russel ITB he mentions some sort of relationship between legacy and mvp where players throw some of both brands. He was throwing outlaws as I remember but is mvp sponsored.

 

[roadtripstuff]

I'd love to know what Paul's thinking as he reads this thread.

Either thinking someone he trusted has a big mouth or that his plan to leak this before the seasons end is working.

 

[roadtripstuff]

In the graham russel ITB he mentions some sort of relationship between legacy and mvp where players throw some of both brands. He was throwing outlaws as I remember but is mvp sponsored.

I don't know about MVP players but Legacy players are allowed to throw a mixed bag. I think sarah also throws a jokeri. Wouldn't surprise me though if she switches, MVP seems to be trying to make moves as well with Elaine this season and taking over for Vibram as the sponsor at Maple Hill.

 

[JTacoma03]

Uli is probably my favorite player and commentator, so hoping whatever he does works out well for him.

Uli is legit funny on commentary, I like his wit. He just needs to work on his form and mic technique, he tends to kinda roll the words around in his mouth rather than project them, so he's hard to hear.




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As for McBeth...I'm not personally sold that he's leaving. I don't doubt that DC came at him with an aggressive offer. It's kind of an open secret at this point that they're shopping for a new face of the franchise anyway, since their A-squad doesn't tour as much these days. I just can't imagine Innova refusing to match an offer, and I can't imagine that Paul would sign with someone else without giving Innova a shot to match any offer presented. JMHO.

 

[roadtripstuff]

Uli is legit funny on commentary, I like his wit. He just needs to work on his form and mic technique, he tends to kinda roll the words around in his mouth rather than project them, so he's hard to hear.




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As for McBeth...I'm not personally sold that he's leaving. I don't doubt that DC came at him with an aggressive offer. It's kind of an open secret at this point that they're shopping for a new face of the franchise anyway, since their A-squad doesn't tour as much these days. I just can't imagine Innova refusing to match an offer, and I can't imagine that Paul would sign with someone else without giving Innova a shot to match any offer presented. JMHO.

What if the "rumors" are true that they are giving him his own line of discs, I would assume that would be at least 6 to 8 discs, do you think Innova would be willing to give him additional signature discs (not tour series) without winning worlds to match those discs. They've held pretty strongly to that stance for many years. I would also think that Innova would at least try to shut down these rumors since its growing so fast, more than the usual internet gossip. Lastly I think that Paul would now be worth more to another manufacturer more so than Innova. I don't think the hit they would take would be comparable to the boost in sales that Discraft would get.

 

[Putt for D'oh]

What if the "rumors" are true that they are giving him his own line of discs, I would assume that would be at least 6 to 8 discs, do you think Innova would be willing to give him additional signature discs (not tour series) without winning worlds to match those discs. They've held pretty strongly to that stance for many years. I would also think that Innova would at least try to shut down these rumors since its growing so fast, more than the usual internet gossip. Lastly I think that Paul would now be worth more to another manufacturer more so than Innova. I don't think the hit they would take would be comparable to the boost in sales that Discraft would get.

Why would Innova care to shut down the rumors? I would like to see what is happening with their disc sales right now with all these rumors. McBeth Sigs and stamps and McPro discs are they stagnant? Steady? or flying off the shelves with the possible news they will no longer be available? Let the rumor mill clean out there old inventory and come back with all new.

Besides Innova could easily come out with a new line of discs... wouldn't even need to get approval just run a new batch in similar plastic, change the arbitrary flight numbers so they seem like new discs and call the McRun... McRoc, MCTeebird, MCDestroyer...

 

[Royalhghnss]

Really? I don't know why, I met him in person once and even when I see him online, in pictures, etc, he just seems like he's a bit angry all the time...hmm...

Uli is one of my absolute favorite guys to film. So incredibly nice.

Wow, 22 pages of McFanboi-ism. At what point does the Kool-aid get passed around? opcorn:

22? You still running starter pack settings? 6 pages over here. Time to up your DGCR game.

 

[JTacoma03]

What if the "rumors" are true that they are giving him his own line of discs, I would assume that would be at least 6 to 8 discs, do you think Innova would be willing to give him additional signature discs (not tour series) without winning worlds to match those discs. They've held pretty strongly to that stance for many years. I would also think that Innova would at least try to shut down these rumors since its growing so fast, more than the usual internet gossip. Lastly I think that Paul would now be worth more to another manufacturer more so than Innova. I don't think the hit they would take would be comparable to the boost in sales that Discraft would get.

Logically I can't fault what you're saying, but as with everything in this thread it's based on a lot of "if's"

Here's how I construct those "if's" in my mind:

- Innova is waaaay bigger than Discraft. I don't buy the "Ultrastar money" hype. I think disc golf moves more now than Ultimate. I don't have figures, but this is just from me talking to people on both sides of the fence. So by that logic, Innova can outbid anyone.

- Innova and Discraft aren't what I'd call friendly, and Innova is a proud company. I'd be shocked if they let DC take their star player unless DC is significantly overpaying in order to outbid.

- McBeth moves more weight than anybody else, and it's not close. Innova knows it.


I'd bet that Innova came to Paul with a deal, Discraft sent a shot in the dark and it was more, and now Innova has to come back over top, and that's why the rumors continue to build.

I might be totally wrong, but that's my reading of the tea leaves.

 

[teemkey]

...
Doss / Jenkins seem to be more interested in making beer than throwing frisbees,
...

This may be the most salient manufacturer concern of the recruiting season. Seven rings that didn't play in Worlds or USDGC/USWDGC.

Not only does Discraft want a World/USA champion competing under their banner, how will they deal with their highest profile players not playing in the highest profile events.

 

[Putt for D'oh]

Either thinking someone he trusted has a big mouth or that his plan to leak this before the seasons end is working.

That's assuming it wasn't someone at Discraft that "leaked" the info from nothing but an offer.

 

[ru4por]

Man, I don't really care about all this sponsor stuff, but all this talk of numbers and ultimate has me reading through this thread for some reason. I would love to see a breakdown of things like market share on disc sales.

For ultimate discs, I would venture to say that Discraft has to control some monster number like 80-90% because the Ultrastar is the only disc worth its weight. I would personally put the Wham-O second and I can't even tell you the name of the Innova model because it's just that bad.

As a guy who has been a recreational player in both ultimate and disc golf for the last 20 years, I can safely say that I have more Ultrastar discs in my basement right now than any other brand of golf discs.

Stats are fun!

Dynamic Disc's Aviator is not a bad thrower. I have not put it to the "ultimate" test, but have thrown it around a field with a few buddies.

 

[JTacoma03]

Uli is one of my absolute favorite guys to film. So incredibly nice.



22? You still running starter pack settings? 6 pages over here. Time to up your DGCR game.

New Rumor time - Ian is starting a fantasy CCDG league for.

1 pt per round filmed
.5 pts per round commentated
.25 pts per shot thrown on Champs Vs Chumps

What order does the CCDG collective finish?

 

[roadtripstuff]

Why would Innova care to shut down the rumors? I would like to see what is happening with their disc sales right now with all these rumors. McBeth Sigs and stamps and McPro discs are they stagnant? Steady? or flying off the shelves with the possible news they will no longer be available? Let the rumor mill clean out there old inventory and come back with all new.

Besides Innova could easily come out with a new line of discs... wouldn't even need to get approval just run a new batch in similar plastic, change the arbitrary flight numbers so they seem like new discs and call the McRun... McRoc, MCTeebird, MCDestroyer...

Because of what Jamie said below, Innova is a proud company and if it wasn't true they would take the wind out of that discraft sail real quick imo. I feel like out of all companies, and jamie kind of confirmed it, that those are the two with the most "bad blood" between them.

As for their line of discs, Innova has always stated you don't get a sig disc (not tour series) unless you win worlds. They would have to back pedal on that pretty hard to give him 6-8 discs, could be more.

 

[JTacoma03]

Dynamic Disc's Aviator is not a bad thrower. I have not put it to the "ultimate" test, but have thrown it around a field with a few buddies.

Well since this is a rumor thread...


I've gotten to know a few people working on the Ultimate side of things this year, and they said that nobody wants the Aviator because it's too overstable for Ultimate compared to the Ultrastar.

 

[ru4por]

Why would Innova care to shut down the rumors? I would like to see what is happening with their disc sales right now with all these rumors. McBeth Sigs and stamps and McPro discs are they stagnant? Steady? or flying off the shelves with the possible news they will no longer be available? Let the rumor mill clean out there old inventory and come back with all new.

Besides Innova could easily come out with a new line of discs... wouldn't even need to get approval just run a new batch in similar plastic, change the arbitrary flight numbers so they seem like new discs and call the McRun... McRoc, MCTeebird, MCDestroyer...

I am guessing many overestimate how much Innova or Discraft care about facebook, reddit or DGCR speculation on who is going where. It all seems like free advertising to me.....and likely them.

 

[roadtripstuff]

That's assuming it wasn't someone at Discraft that "leaked" the info from nothing but an offer.

Seems like they do share their team info with the team more than Innova does for sure. Crazy to me that none of the Innova team seem to know what's up, or they are really avoiding talking about it. Lots of people from team discraft in a lot of these threads, even if some of them are back pedaling now.

 

[ru4por]

Well since this is a rumor thread...


I've gotten to know a few people working on the Ultimate side of things this year, and they said that nobody wants the Aviator because it's too overstable for Ultimate compared to the Ultrastar.

Pretty interesting, JT. Could be. Honestly, I have not thrown them side by side. Maybe this weekend I will break out the Aviator, Ultrastar and my old Wham-o. It might be fun to check out the flight comparisons.

 

[roadtripstuff]

I am guessing many overestimate how much Innova or Discraft care about facebook, reddit or DGCR speculation on who is going where. It all seems like free advertising to me.....and likely them.

I'm betting you they do care what's going on social media or they wouldn't have player signing contacts with social media requirements and some even with social media specific contracts.