bodomdethllica
Birdie Member
yes thats how the game of golf is done...if there's room for it. disc golf doesn't get the same treatment as ball golf
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Are multiple tee pads always the best idea ?
- Thread starter Mando
- Start date
yes thats how the game of golf is done...if there's room for it. disc golf doesn't get the same treatment as ball golf
Thanks for writing this for me. Now I've got time to write the reviews of the two courses that I played today.
Although, I might replace "natural" with "carpet".
I say no. Not "always".
Multiple teepads for various skill levels are a nice feature on some courses. But they really need to be planned at the outset, not added as an afterthought. To the degree possible, they should be placed where the walks from basket to the next tee are roughly the same distance for the various tees.
There are other types of multiple tees---where both are for the same skill level, but they provide significantly different lines so add variety to the course. These, too, are nice to have.
But, as Chuck said, not all courses are best served by multiple tees.
Multiple teepads for various skill levels are a nice feature on some courses. But they really need to be planned at the outset, not added as an afterthought. To the degree possible, they should be placed where the walks from basket to the next tee are roughly the same distance for the various tees.
There are other types of multiple tees---where both are for the same skill level, but they provide significantly different lines so add variety to the course. These, too, are nice to have.
But, as Chuck said, not all courses are best served by multiple tees.
It goes back to the customer..... The designer has to first remove his/her ego from the equation and ask the customer (usually the land owner) what they want from the course. What are their goals, needs, wants and desires? What will the land support. Now develop a design that accomodates each of those factors to the highest level possible.
Some courses only need/should have, a single set of tees and pin locations. They have specific purposes and won't be used for other things. The customer may request that there be only a single set of tees and pins.
Other courses can, and should have multi tee and pin locations. These tools can help control errosion, aid in player flow through the course, player satisfaction, and perhaps most importantly when dealing with short budgets, serve the broadest user group possible.
Grouping Red and Blue, White and Gold together keeps that player spectrum pretty high. Having multi pin locations to work with using two (or more) sets of tees makes it easy to custom fit your course for what's happening at that moment. E.g. you can have a short A pin location for your Scout/school/church demos, a B pin for day-to-day play, and a wicked C pin for tourneys (or an alt day-to-day).
Personally, I prefer well built and mantained grass tees. Easiest on the feet, ankles, legs, hips and back. Nice look too. Concrete is probably the default for most courses and locations. But I think that world class disc golf courses will start using other surfaces, like the rubber/poly-fiber/concrete sandwiches that are now covering many playground surfaces. These drain well, provide good grip and are still are easy on the body.
opcorn:
Some courses only need/should have, a single set of tees and pin locations. They have specific purposes and won't be used for other things. The customer may request that there be only a single set of tees and pins.
Other courses can, and should have multi tee and pin locations. These tools can help control errosion, aid in player flow through the course, player satisfaction, and perhaps most importantly when dealing with short budgets, serve the broadest user group possible.
Grouping Red and Blue, White and Gold together keeps that player spectrum pretty high. Having multi pin locations to work with using two (or more) sets of tees makes it easy to custom fit your course for what's happening at that moment. E.g. you can have a short A pin location for your Scout/school/church demos, a B pin for day-to-day play, and a wicked C pin for tourneys (or an alt day-to-day).
Personally, I prefer well built and mantained grass tees. Easiest on the feet, ankles, legs, hips and back. Nice look too. Concrete is probably the default for most courses and locations. But I think that world class disc golf courses will start using other surfaces, like the rubber/poly-fiber/concrete sandwiches that are now covering many playground surfaces. These drain well, provide good grip and are still are easy on the body.
opcorn:
Cgkdisc
.:Hall of Fame Member:.
How do you know in advance what tees will be used and how much? Even designers don't really know. However, you can tip the scales by calling the short tees women and longs men or use am and pro instead of red and blue. You can put better tees and signs and benches on the longs so the shorts look like an after thought and don't get used. Ideally, you make the shorter tee areas as good or better than the long tee areas and you'll get more use from the shorter tees.
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2008
- Messages
- 2,233
Designers should figure this out by putting temp pads in and monitoring their use, before the money is spent.
Cgkdisc
.:Hall of Fame Member:.
Yes, temp tees first is always a good idea. But again, if the shorter temp set aren't obviously seen as the "main" tees, you skew the results towards longs. If you put in a good or better set of short tees, the players will come in sufficient numbers to make it worth the effort even if the culture in your area is biased toward longs.
Crooked Creek was originally designed and built with two sets of concrete tees, one much shorter than the other.
In the early years the short tees were rarely used, and often covered in leaves. Most players at the time were young men, who only wanted to play the longest tees.
Nowadays, the course is crowded with families and small kids and teenagers, and both sets of tees get heavy use.
I forgot my point here, but thought I'd mention it anyway.
In the early years the short tees were rarely used, and often covered in leaves. Most players at the time were young men, who only wanted to play the longest tees.
Nowadays, the course is crowded with families and small kids and teenagers, and both sets of tees get heavy use.
I forgot my point here, but thought I'd mention it anyway.
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2008
- Messages
- 2,233
yea, so you put in temp longs and temp shorts until you sort things out...easy solution.
People are weird...
We put in three sets of natural tees on a course and the park guys kinda willy-nilly drove fence posts in next to some tee on each hole. Sometimes it was the red tee, sometimes it was the white tee. On one hole it was the blue tee. We had all the tees flagged with surveyors flags, so they were all easy to see. The use pattern was that people went wherever the fence post was. People are so easy to influence that it is hard not to skew your data.
We put in three sets of natural tees on a course and the park guys kinda willy-nilly drove fence posts in next to some tee on each hole. Sometimes it was the red tee, sometimes it was the white tee. On one hole it was the blue tee. We had all the tees flagged with surveyors flags, so they were all easy to see. The use pattern was that people went wherever the fence post was. People are so easy to influence that it is hard not to skew your data.
This reminds me of one of my biggest gripes with new courses. The designers going gonzo over multiple tees before they clearly define the fairways and the actual playability of the hole. 3 sets of hastily put down tees don't do me any good if the hole plays like a jungle. Rockness suffers a lot from this, Highland Hills used to (haven't been there in a while).
But overall I'll echo the same sentiments many have stated. I like multiple tees if they are different in some way other than longer. Different angle/lower/higher/mando/water/some obstacle in play, just something besides longer.
I think the best way to keep multiple tees all used as equally as possible is making the transitions to them as equidistant as you can. Lazy people (read: majority of disc golfers) are going to play the nearest tee regardless if it's the longest or not because we're throw monkeys.
dudiablo
Par Member
Here in St. Louis, most every course has multiple pin locations; all of which are rotated on a fairly regular basis. The newest course that went in however has a only got natural pads for the time being, but it also has 3 (working on putting in a gold level tees as well i believe) which make it the most fun an interesting round (imho) to go play. The weekly leagues leave the pins in one place for 3 weeks, and the players shoot a round from the reds, whites, and blues, before the baskets all get moved to different positions on the 4th week.
On league nights this becomes an issue once in a while with casual rounders shooting from the reds when the league players are shooting from the blue tees, but its an issue that's well worth the headache when you consider all of the variety that the additional tees add to a round.
I can't stress how much i enjoy having not only the option of playing a course that can literally has 162 holes (don't get me started on the combinations or permutations of how many "COURSES" can be played out there) , but being involved in a league that forces someone to be familiar with everything that the park has to offer. :thmbup:
On league nights this becomes an issue once in a while with casual rounders shooting from the reds when the league players are shooting from the blue tees, but its an issue that's well worth the headache when you consider all of the variety that the additional tees add to a round.
I can't stress how much i enjoy having not only the option of playing a course that can literally has 162 holes (don't get me started on the combinations or permutations of how many "COURSES" can be played out there) , but being involved in a league that forces someone to be familiar with everything that the park has to offer. :thmbup:
When JB and Sioux went in, we didn't have the cash for concrete and had two to three sets of natural tees. It was nice in that when I showed up, I decided which course I was playing. After the tees went to one concrete pad and each hole had multiple pins, I played whatever course the course captain decided he wanted me to play by wherever he had the pins set. I kinda liked being able to decide for myself.
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- Jun 15, 2009
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- 4,060
I prefer multiple tees to multiple pin placements. As long as the tees provide a different challenge. Multiple pins, unless you have some way to let people know in advance what pins are currently in use (which most don't), just makes things frustating, especialy for non local players.
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2009
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- 6,854
In defense of short tees -
Short tees may be more important than the % they are used might indicate. Say a potential new player tries out disc golf. If he or she gets bored throwing 8 or 9 times on each hole, no new player. The short tees let new players play the game like it's supposed to be played – at least hoping for par.
After not very long, most players get better and leave the short tees behind. They'll play those long tees for many more years than they played the short tees. But, those players who are playing many more rounds on the long tees are players who wouldn't be on those long tees if it weren't for the short tees.
As to whether short tees should be "just shorter" – it depends on the purpose of the short tees. If they are there to provide a set of alternate tees for the regular players, then they should provide a different shot.
However, if the short tees are there so a Dad can play against his 8-year old daughter on a somewhat more even basis, then providing a similar shot would be more appropriate. They would be playing "the same hole" and can even use the "same" throw to get there.
But in all cases, the short tees need to be as high quality and the play from them as interesting (for the targeted players) as the long tees.
Short tees may be more important than the % they are used might indicate. Say a potential new player tries out disc golf. If he or she gets bored throwing 8 or 9 times on each hole, no new player. The short tees let new players play the game like it's supposed to be played – at least hoping for par.
After not very long, most players get better and leave the short tees behind. They'll play those long tees for many more years than they played the short tees. But, those players who are playing many more rounds on the long tees are players who wouldn't be on those long tees if it weren't for the short tees.
As to whether short tees should be "just shorter" – it depends on the purpose of the short tees. If they are there to provide a set of alternate tees for the regular players, then they should provide a different shot.
However, if the short tees are there so a Dad can play against his 8-year old daughter on a somewhat more even basis, then providing a similar shot would be more appropriate. They would be playing "the same hole" and can even use the "same" throw to get there.
But in all cases, the short tees need to be as high quality and the play from them as interesting (for the targeted players) as the long tees.
I'm with you there. I subsribe to the belief that the baskets should be the LAST thing to go into a new course ONLY when the course is DONE. I was very pleased to attend the grand opening of Roy G., here in Austin and the course was finished and ready to play on DAY ONE.
Dyoel182
Birdie Member
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2012
- Messages
- 275
Folks said that when they added a second position to our course baskets but it turned out to be a needless worry. They let us know what the pin positions are in advance before our weekly minis but otherwise all you have to do is look at the post for the two basket positions and then look out to see if a basket is there or not.
chrishysell
* Ace Member *
When travelling out of town to play in a tournament it's always nice to be able to play all of the tee pads to a fixed basket. There is no way to practice multiple pin placements unless the course has extra baskets. I prefer multiple tees.
