ya I surprised myself!! lol but a 172 star wraith and 175 star destroyer hit the fence, and a 175 champ wraith was the one that skipped into it. I was amazed that I got it that far! hah also was thrown with a 360 throw.. which I hadn't messed around with much until this week haha but it was awesome!
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Finally figured "it" out...
- Thread starter PerpetualNewbie
- Start date
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
Krinkncrank
Bogey Member
You and me both. The great thing about disc golf though is you can enjoy playing it for years and years, even if you're not hucking 500'
The Mad Cow
Bogey Member
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2014
- Messages
- 80
Ahhh, if only I'd found and picked up this game 20 or more years ago...
Amen to that
BUT... thru reading this forum and applying the info into my practice sessions.... I'm making the guys that I throw with pretty frustrated.The best part about that... they ARE 20 or more years younger
I set up targets 250 feet apart in my back lot. 10 discs, RHBH down and RHFH back. My intention was to work on control and accuracy by improving my form.
Working on weight transfer and throwing low and thru the plane is getting great results. On the course I'm enjoying the increase of distance that goes with it.
bfowler
Double Eagle Member
Amen to that
The best part about that... they ARE 20 or more years younger
It's such a great feeling on those tight tunnel shots when all your friends hit trees not even halfway down the fairway and you throw a laser that lands softly 5 feet from the basket.
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
Hey guys, I'm really glad this thread is helping some other people as well!
So I've found three "core" aspects of my drive that, if I remember them, make my form fall into place:
1. With my first step I step out and turn my left foot perpendicular to the target. When I get lazy or lose focus and don't do this my footwork gets off and I tend to spin out.
2. The "delayed" upper body turn/reachback that started this thread.
3. Keeping my upper body as straight as possible with no hunch/slouch, allowing my spin and follow-through to transfer the maximum amount of momentum and snap to the disc that I can currently generate.
When I do these three things...boom. If my drives start to break down it's always one of these things, and reminding myself before my next drive instantly corrects the problem. The long checklist I had made for driving form is gone, because if I do these three things then everything else happens completely naturally without my having to think about it.
I hope that with enough repetition and practice this summer muscle memory will begin to take over and I won't have to make these corrections.
I will admit to a bit of pride getting to this point, and throwing putters, midranges or fairways on shots where others I'm playing with are throwing distance drivers... but then later I watch video of McBeth, Feldberg, Schusterick, eMac and Locastro and give myself the ol' ego-check and remind myself I still have a lot of work to do
So I've found three "core" aspects of my drive that, if I remember them, make my form fall into place:
1. With my first step I step out and turn my left foot perpendicular to the target. When I get lazy or lose focus and don't do this my footwork gets off and I tend to spin out.
2. The "delayed" upper body turn/reachback that started this thread.
3. Keeping my upper body as straight as possible with no hunch/slouch, allowing my spin and follow-through to transfer the maximum amount of momentum and snap to the disc that I can currently generate.
When I do these three things...boom. If my drives start to break down it's always one of these things, and reminding myself before my next drive instantly corrects the problem. The long checklist I had made for driving form is gone, because if I do these three things then everything else happens completely naturally without my having to think about it.
I hope that with enough repetition and practice this summer muscle memory will begin to take over and I won't have to make these corrections.
I will admit to a bit of pride getting to this point, and throwing putters, midranges or fairways on shots where others I'm playing with are throwing distance drivers... but then later I watch video of McBeth, Feldberg, Schusterick, eMac and Locastro and give myself the ol' ego-check and remind myself I still have a lot of work to do
Krinkncrank
Bogey Member
Could you clarify by what you mean by 'first step'? Is this the step where you place your left leg behind the right in the x-step, or before that?
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
Before that, this is my absolute very first step. I start with both feet parallel and my entire body directly facing the target, then the first step is my left foot out and slightly to the left, and it plants at 90 degrees perpendicular to the target.
When the wind dies down in a couple days I will be taking some videos of myself and posting them in the form analysis/critique section... I'm sure that will help knock my ego down another peg or two as well
Krinkncrank
Bogey Member
How many steps are you taking after that first step?
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
I'm doing just 4... left, right, hop and land left on ball of foot, right comes down on ball of foot, right heel plants plants, "the move" happens, then I pull & spin and finally follow through.
Krinkncrank
Bogey Member
Gotcha!
Van1
Birdie Member
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2011
- Messages
- 415
This helped me today. I have always reached back and turned my hips "in one piece" to use an old term from ball golf. Delaying the reach until after the hip turn/weight shift and slowly getting my buttocks facing the target seems to be putting me into a better throwing position and leads to less rounding and less pressure on arm. Thanks all
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
Yeah, I think this little revelation has been a big key for several of us, glad it helped you, too.
I'm surprised that I don't ever recall it being explained this way though, either here or over on the discgolfreview forum... it seems like such a simple, plain-english way to describe the action and the way the "windup" of the core is built up...
Happy throwing!
The concept has been discussed endless times really. Its a matter of timing which cannot be truly taught and it goes with everyones style to an extent. Mechanics can only help you execute what is trying to be accomplished. If you are looking for the "way to throw" well, there isn't one.
We tried(outside of this thread I think you would find that info).. sorry the English wasn't clear?
We tried(outside of this thread I think you would find that info).. sorry the English wasn't clear?
bfowler
Double Eagle Member
Newbie, my drive has been 4 steps for a while now and it's exactly how you describe. If I try to add less or more it doesn't work as well (except for a stand still throw).
I stand facing the target. I take a very small step with my left foot. Like 7-8 inches small. I then step with my right foot perpendicular to the target. As I begin my X-step this is where I turn my hips so my right butt cheek is facing the target. My upper body is still inline for the most part. Right before the ball of my foot touches the ground on my plant foot I'm turning back.
Then without turning my upper body I push off my inner inside of my left foot as I'm planting my heel. My upper body is straight and my whole torso moves forward without turning as I shift my weight. It's like I've grabbed a big rope and I'm pulling something heavy. Be careful not to bend your torso forward. It's not a weight shift up as much as it's a balanced weight shift forward. I imagine my whole spine staying erect and moving forward.
After, let me repeat, AFTER my heel planted that's when I turn, the pull and explode.
With the butt check forward it keeps my knees slightly bend and my balance back and centered so that when I do turn and pull I'm braced. Try doing it at a stand still too. That helps.
Another thing I did that's helping is I changed up the timing on my pre-motion swing. I used to point with my disc through the X-step and as my plant leg started forward my arm started backwards. Now, I point in conjunction with my first small step. This helped line up my timing for when I turn back and to not pull until my heel hits.
I stand facing the target. I take a very small step with my left foot. Like 7-8 inches small. I then step with my right foot perpendicular to the target. As I begin my X-step this is where I turn my hips so my right butt cheek is facing the target. My upper body is still inline for the most part. Right before the ball of my foot touches the ground on my plant foot I'm turning back.
Then without turning my upper body I push off my inner inside of my left foot as I'm planting my heel. My upper body is straight and my whole torso moves forward without turning as I shift my weight. It's like I've grabbed a big rope and I'm pulling something heavy. Be careful not to bend your torso forward. It's not a weight shift up as much as it's a balanced weight shift forward. I imagine my whole spine staying erect and moving forward.
After, let me repeat, AFTER my heel planted that's when I turn, the pull and explode.
With the butt check forward it keeps my knees slightly bend and my balance back and centered so that when I do turn and pull I'm braced. Try doing it at a stand still too. That helps.
Another thing I did that's helping is I changed up the timing on my pre-motion swing. I used to point with my disc through the X-step and as my plant leg started forward my arm started backwards. Now, I point in conjunction with my first small step. This helped line up my timing for when I turn back and to not pull until my heel hits.
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
The concept has been discussed endless times really. Its a matter of timing which cannot be truly taught and it goes with everyones style to an extent. Mechanics can only help you execute what is trying to be accomplished. If you are looking for the "way to throw" well, there isn't one.
We tried(outside of this thread I think you would find that info).. sorry the English wasn't clear?
Please don't take my comments as criticism to the many players and forum posters who have spent a lot of time attempting to explain things. Believe me, I greatly appreciate what they have done and continue to do.
It's just that so often the posts seem to be written from a level of biomechanical understanding that I, as a 40-something lifelong non-athlete, just can't effectively translate or make sense of in relation to my own body movement.
That's a big reason why Sidewinder's photo breakdowns and youtube videos have been so helpful, they make it easier to either visualize or feel what is supposed to be taking place.
The missing piece, though, was still putting it all together: the timing of everything. I have read all the forum posts and watched as many instructional videos on driving that I can find and I've never seen or heard it described simply as "don't turn your lower body and upper body at the same time, let the lower body turn first and resist the urge to turn the upper body and reach back until you absolutely have to."
Of course to others that might be just as ambiguous as terms like "weight shift", "closed hips", etc. are or have been to me, but from the responses on this thread this type of description seems to have helped at least a few people. Kind of like "Disc Golf Driving for Dummies" or "Disc Golf Driving for Non-Athletes", I guess, lol...
As others have pointed out, similar discussions have been on these forums for some time.
However, it sometimes takes a different perspective or different terminology for it to "click" with someone.
I think this is case here. When I read the OP, the line
"resist turning the lower body during the run-up/x-step until you absolutely have to"
really resonated. I tried it next time out, along with slowing down the whole approach. It really did feel different to me! More snap, and better overall throws.
I have read very similar things in the past, here and other places. I have watched countless videos. But until i read the line above, I didn't GROK it.
Thanks. :clap:
Also, I have tried a modified approach in the past with some decent results. Stand with your back to the target. Take one step toward the target with your plant foot. Turn and throw. I think it could be a great alternative to the X-Step when footing is bad or just to get the timing "right".
However, it sometimes takes a different perspective or different terminology for it to "click" with someone.
I think this is case here. When I read the OP, the line
"resist turning the lower body during the run-up/x-step until you absolutely have to"
really resonated. I tried it next time out, along with slowing down the whole approach. It really did feel different to me! More snap, and better overall throws.
I have read very similar things in the past, here and other places. I have watched countless videos. But until i read the line above, I didn't GROK it.
Thanks. :clap:
Also, I have tried a modified approach in the past with some decent results. Stand with your back to the target. Take one step toward the target with your plant foot. Turn and throw. I think it could be a great alternative to the X-Step when footing is bad or just to get the timing "right".
PerpetualNewbie
Birdie Member
Ok, put together a quick graphic that visualizes what I'm describing using screen-shots of the video that BirdieMachine posted earlier in this thread. Tried to represent the upper and lower body with the different colored boxes, someone tell me if this makes sense (or not...)
Uploading it as an attachment kind of butchered it, so I'll just link to it on one of my web sites instead:
Uploading it as an attachment kind of butchered it, so I'll just link to it on one of my web sites instead:
Last edited:
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
I'll also point out that in that photo-break-down you can tell he's on his toes. Everybody gets there via different paths, but for me it was emulating an x-step where I don't let my heals touch the ground until the plant foot. That connected with me driving more with my hips - pulling lower - and being in the right places at the right time.
Yeah its hard to have an "athletic stance" being flat footed on your heels...
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