[Question] Flat, overstable mid between a Zone and Tyrant

[ilmcgee]

Hyzerbomb Mortar is the beadless gator mold.

 

[pjhayes7]

Hyzerbomb Mortar is the beadless gator mold.

Yep, this seems like the answer if you want a true mid. Although I am not sure if the OP will see enough difference from a Zone. I would suggest stepping up to a speed 6 disc. Although it is technically OOP and maybe too overstable, the Trident seems to fit in between a Zone and Tyrant. Marshal Street still has some and even some X-outs for a bit cheaper.

I personally have never felt a true mid that felt good throwing forehand. So what I would do is try throwing your stable fairway driver (whatever you use slightly less stable than the Tyrant). Try a Teebird, Rival, Clash, etc with slightly less power than you throw the Tyrant. The disc will obviously not fly as far as at full power, but will also fade more since it is not up to full speed. This should duplicate the flight you need and also work on developing some touch in your forehand game other than short upshots. This is actually one of my major goals over the Winter to do.

 

[boostedvwjet]

I ended up picking up a Buzzz OS, a Verdict and a Comet (because, Comet). Both the Buzzz OS and the Verdict are in the bag and actually compliment each other rather well IMO. The Buzzz OS is EXACTLY what I was looking for to slot between the Zone and Tyrant. I can flex it out and trust it to come back the same way every time. The Verdict surprised me with how sneaky long it is, while holding a straight to fade shot better than the Buzzz OS for me.

Thanks for all the suggestions and I now feel my mid-range game is back on target. Currently rocking the Buzzz OS, Verdict, Glo Buzzz and the Comet. Have every shot covered with those 4.

 

[Pymm]

Verdict is my favorite mid. It fits the criteria you listed. I depend on mine for a lot of different shots.

 

[deyo7]

If it's alright, I'd like to piggyback off this thread since it seems I'm looking for somewhat similar help.

I throw Latitude Pure for approach (RHBH), which I really like. Though when it's windy or out of reach I currently throw a Buzzz (it's what I got). I'm planning on getting an Envy to compliment the Pure in order to get a more ideal setup.

I would also like to add an overstable putter/mid that I can forehand from any distance 200-250ft in (even 50ft if desired). I was eyeing either the DD Suspect or Verdict (I also want short rim depth). I'm guessing Verdict would be better compliment to the Envy but my understanding is Verdict is slightly longer than Suspect. Can you power down the Verdict as well as Suspect? Also can the Suspect handle a little more torque if I want to extend the line farther? I guess those would be my questions/concerns. Also was also curious about MVP's Matrix and how it might compare to the Verdict.

I am forehand dominant player.

Thanks!

 

[DG_Before_Breakfast]

Out to 200 I'd suggest the Zone. I chose it because the rim is similar to a Pure - beadless I guess is the word. But I totally love it in it's own right now. Great FH approach and shorter drives. Sometimes use it for a short overstable BH too. Lately I've played with different plastics to get a Zone that has less action on landing than my usual ESP. I'm liking Jawbreaker, which is less stable, goes a bit farther as a result, and seems to sit nicely. Elite-X should sit better, but I haven't liked the feel of it as much yet.

Longer than that, but not full distance, I use a Volt. Straight to fade for me, I can't really turn a Neutron Volt over if I throw it flat.

Full distance FH I'll use a Tern or Destroyer.

 

[ILUVSMGS18]

Buzzz OS especially if its flat.

 

[deyo7]

DG Before Breakfast, thanks for plastic experience breakdown as well.

 

[slowplastic]

The Verdict powers down forehand much easier than backhand for me, but it will fade a bit when thrown under 100' or so...whereas on 200' shots it's pretty much a laser with a bit of sweep. Keep in mind it's fairly fast so it will tend to skip a bit even on shorter shots...so it'll fit well with an Envy and Pure setup I think. On shorter 50-100' approaches when I don't want any ground action I'll FH a putter instead of the Verdict.

 

[Moose33]

I use a Harp here but it's deeper. Zone is a good call.

 

[slowplastic]

I use a Harp here but it's deeper. Zone is a good call.

Yeah Zone is fantastic for this as well, but it flies a bit more stable/less glide. Good feel in hand and flies reliably. Won't be as long as the Verdict, but I'd prefer it on the shorter shots.

 

[deyo7]

The Verdict powers down forehand much easier than backhand for me, but it will fade a bit when thrown under 100' or so...whereas on 200' shots it's pretty much a laser with a bit of sweep. Keep in mind it's fairly fast so it will tend to skip a bit even on shorter shots...so it'll fit well with an Envy and Pure setup I think. On shorter 50-100' approaches when I don't want any ground action I'll FH a putter instead of the Verdict.

Ugh, I need a bigger bag :doh: laser from 200 sounds nice but was wondering about shorter shots being too fast. I assume though I could do as u suggest and forehand the envy there if not too aggressive with the torque....

Or maybe zone is best overall fit covering full 0-200ish. DGbeforebreak, I notice zone comes in zflx as well...would think that might be nice, no?

 

[slowplastic]

Ugh, I need a bigger bag :doh: laser from 200 sounds nice but was wondering about shorter shots being too fast. I assume though I could do as u suggest and forehand the envy there if not too aggressive with the torque....

Or maybe zone is best overall fit covering full 0-200ish. DGbeforebreak, I notice zone comes in zflx as well...would think that might be nice, no?

I used to use the Verdict for every FH approach, and learned to deal with its speed/fade within 50'-100'. As I got cleaner I now FH an Anode even to 100'+ if I want a straight approach...so definitely an Envy would pair up with the Verdict and handle FH easily. The Envy feels very good in a FH grip. Basically, the Verdict can handle short FH approaches but isn't ideal if it's a fast green, and the Envy will handle all of the other situations. The Zone is a great approach disc but it may be overkill to have Envy, Zone, and Verdict. The Zone won't go quite as far, so it depends on if you would rather lean on the short shots or the midrange distances. Plus always remember with practice you'll have the clean form to forehand your Envy or even straight putters with a lot of confidence.

Edit: If you're definitely getting an Envy, then I think adding the Verdict will be less overlap. But you can also get the Envy and see how it does, then decide which to add. All three are great discs.

 

[jugg3rnautx]

The MVP Matrix does wonders for me. I run that with the envy/proxy combo and that seems to cover most of the situations I find myself in. I like the matrix because its flat and has a low profile and it is a very versatile disc. Its great for forehand approach shots.

 

[DiscinFiend]

I'd say a Mortar. It replaced the Gator in my bag. It's based on a beadless Gator (or is a beadless Gator?) but it's in regular production. I bag a Recon (Champion) Mortar. It's board flat. It is great backhand & sidearm. For some reason I have issues consistently throwing beaded mids forehand. I used a Gators for a long time. I'm having much better results throwing sidearm with the Mortar though. Nate Sexton even has one in his bag.

 

[deyo7]

I used to use the Verdict for every FH approach, and learned to deal with its speed/fade within 50'-100'. As I got cleaner I now FH an Anode even to 100'+ if I want a straight approach...so definitely an Envy would pair up with the Verdict and handle FH easily. The Envy feels very good in a FH grip. Basically, the Verdict can handle short FH approaches but isn't ideal if it's a fast green, and the Envy will handle all of the other situations. The Zone is a great approach disc but it may be overkill to have Envy, Zone, and Verdict. The Zone won't go quite as far, so it depends on if you would rather lean on the short shots or the midrange distances. Plus always remember with practice you'll have the clean form to forehand your Envy or even straight putters with a lot of confidence.

Edit: If you're definitely getting an Envy, then I think adding the Verdict will be less overlap. But you can also get the Envy and see how it does, then decide which to add. All three are great discs.

Read my mind, really, with everything.

Well, I was leaning toward getting an Envy simply because I'm more confident that I'll be able to throw it backhand than something more beefy like a zone for e.g. And realistically, I'll continue to approach shorter distances backhand. I've never thrown an Envy, just figured it would be what I want as a more overstable compliment to the Pure. Plus, I figured I could forehand it if desired at shorter distances. And again like you said, I was also thinking that if I did go the Envy route that a Verdict or something similar would be the better setup/less overlap (than e.g., Zone). What Plastic do you like for the Verdict? Lucid looks pretty but do I want a biofusion or other? Is Lucid comparable to Latitude Opto?

"You can also get the Envy and see how it does, then decide which to add" = logic.

Thank you!

 

[deyo7]

The MVP Matrix does wonders for me. I run that with the envy/proxy combo and that seems to cover most of the situations I find myself in. I like the matrix because its flat and has a low profile and it is a very versatile disc. Its great for forehand approach shots.

Might have to consider that too as the overstable mid. Can you put decent juice on it without turning it over, I assume? Wonder when these will be more readily available at retailers.

 

[jugg3rnautx]

It's pretty resistant to turn. The more you crank on it the longer it goes straight before the fade kicks in and I don't think even in the wind I've ever gotten it to turn much if thrown good and flat. I used to run a buzzz os but never liked how dumpy it was. With the matrix I can get more distance and glide out of it if needed.
Yeah it'd be great if they made it more available and in the different plastics they have.

 

[deyo7]

Yeah, I was just assuming it's not in production yet really and ones you might find online are those that were remaining from the circuit....
I haven't looked recently but when I did I found a couple in weight and color that I wasn't excited about. Was hoping more would come available. Sounds nice. Cheers.

 

[slowplastic]

What Plastic do you like for the Verdict? Lucid looks pretty but do I want a biofusion or other? Is Lucid comparable to Latitude Opto?

Lucid is the same as Opto, and it's what I bag. I don't have experience with the other plastics in this mold.