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Form check 2023 - Sykern

Hi.

As I am continuing to work on form I am now seeing some improvement. I turned over my fresh Rive at will last round which was really motivating!

Form as of today:
https://youtu.be/q1haam3xsYU

I am feeling more coiled now and getting better weightshift which in turn lets me use gravity to swing around my center of gravity.
It helped tilting my shoulders more.

Also timing the backswing by using rythm to rock the body (Thanks for that video!) helped!

I see I need to improve on leading with the butt and shifting more from behind by getting my rear knee inwards sooner. For some reason this is really hard for me to get in.
Also the head kink occurs when I am not actively thinking of pulling with the shoulder so that needs to be addressed.

I will continue working with posture and try to update in around 2 weeks time for new update if I have had time to make meaningful progress.
 
I have had quite some time for net-fieldwork so i thought now would be a good time to evaluate where I am at currently.

What I see that I still needs to work on is getting the proper tilt for more of a inside swing. I also see some s-curvature in the spine still, that I think will get a bit better if i get more of a forward tilt.
But i see that i get better posture and timing on loading my posterior obliques before the heel hits the ground.

I have been working alot with Power of Posture and dinglearm and some with herzhyzer and loading the bow.
Now i atleast get my rear knee past my ankle before my front toes hits the ground, but still alot to gain there.

I think I still need to continue working primarily on posture and getting the right amount of tilt as well as continuing looking for more kneesqueeze.
My arm and upper body are just uncoiling natural now. The feeling i get of the arm uncoiling once the heel hits the ground feels really efficient, powerful and "slingshotty". So I think (hopefully) I am on the right track. It also looks like my weightshift and hip rotation is a bit better than it were 3 weeks ago.

Would you agree on my thoughts? Anything else I am not seeing/understanding?

90°


Behind:
 
Last edited:
I will continue with posture in general and the s-curve. Also look into the offhand. For me it feels equally downwards and forward, but I will take a note of it.
Thanks alot!
 
Been working on shifting from behind and correcting offhand. Think I finally figured out what shifting from behind means in the throw. Very visible in my standstills now. Also incorporated more of pushing the offarm and not swimming as it seems like an easier way to assist with arm speed and pushing down into the brace during the swing.

Still need to figure out the s-curvature. I can fix it by forcing myself to hunch, but thats not powerful. Also by stretching more in the backswing it feels less rubberband during the actual forward swing.

Standstill

90°

 
Last edited:
Sorry. Im noob at this. Fixed two. Here is the standstill:


Also worth mentioning that the xstep throws are around 25-30% effort
 
Last edited:
Hi.

I just started working on fixing my issue with rounding. Until now my throwing hand has been totally passive and I have hugged myself rather than the disc as have been stated here earlier. Now I am trying to work more on this. By getting the arm more out and away instead of behind has helped some, but now i also actively guide the arm in the powerpocket with the elbow up and out. I try to time the elbow in the pocket to when my offarm-hand reaches the body.

How active is throwing arm and elbow? Now as I am actively getting it into the pocket, my timing and aim is very off. Understandable, but if any can help me explain this it would be good. If my timing analogy is off please correct me also.

On a sidenote this seems to have helped with my s-posture.


 
Are you saying the disc should start out more flat and twist more into the pocket? A reverse of what is happening now?
 
sykern said:
Are you saying the disc should start out more flat and twist more into the pocket? A reverse of what is happening now?
Click to expand...

You can do either way at top of backswing, but yes your arm is twisting the opposite direction into the power pocket as you pull your elbow down/into your body, instead of sending it up/out away from body.
79gSO14.png
 
sykern said:
Ah. Gotcha! Thanks!
Click to expand...

If SW agrees I think the link he put above on the arm rotation point pairs very nicely with the part starting here. He's emphasizing the same fundamental action, and then it is helpful to start to learn do that in the context of what he's emphasizing here - swinging the arm with the body into the arm rotation he described above.

https://youtu.be/XC0LsBO_Wck?t=197
 
Wow!
Focusing on pronating while getting the elbow out made me feel the pocket for probably the first time.
I now get into the pocket by just basically bending the elbow and not using the scapula at any point. I also feel the swing outward and my fingers are sore by the disc ripping out.

Getting the posterior oblique activation by pulling the offarm inwards is also noticeable now which helps bend the elbow. I will continue focus on pronating and getting the elbow out.
Lastly thinking more of the inward swing also helped the swing feeling more bouncy and powerful.

Thanks for all the input so far!

90°
https://youtu.be/Quob7XSMBW8
https://youtu.be/EegXv3npcOM

Behind
https://youtu.be/dYv14na0uA0
https://youtu.be/a-lDT8VNN4E
 
Brychanus said:
You have a couple big fish to fry my friend. I'm going to give you a lot, but in the end I recommend you focus on posture and standstills at least until you get some of the hip and posture stuff sorted out. Most of the people who ignore, don't understand, or don't take the time to learn and apply the posture advice (including me for quite some time) end up needing to deal with it later. I've seen a lot of people around here get stuck on it for months or years if they don't attack it head on. YMMV.

There it still looks like your brace is emphasizing stopping forward momentum, but your hips and legs and posture aren't getting the most powerful swing. You are in what I call "Flatville." Learn about The Hips. Use natural motions to break the flatness and get more curvature in the swing.


Keep redefining the way you think about the "brace" to be more "what legs and posture do for you when you land stacked on the plant leg." Right now you look like you get the common error in the form of a "horse stance" with a "collapsing pocket" ("rounding").

Like sidewinder22, I've learned within and become a fan of working in a full range of motion first. The idea is that you want to maximize what you get out of a full backswing and weight shift, then for upshots you can either (1) slow it down or (2) reduce the size of the backswing and shift (which is what most top pros tend to do). But I can point out the important points with your upshot form there. Here's you vs. Simon. Simon is throwing a ~250' upshot here.

0y99soi.png



1. You have too much S curve in your spine and too much anterior pelvic tilt. Simon's has a bit of natural curve. Your hips are too flat relative to the ground and your rear knee is leaking behind your rear ankle. Simon's body is leveraged ahead of the rear leg with his ankle outside his knee, and his body is drifting forward into the plant. Learn the Power of Posture.

2. Since you're coming off the rear side too flat, you end up overextending your plant leg to brace your momentum, which is moving too parallel to the ground. Notice how Simon is still canted more toward the ground with his leading knee just a bit ahead of his leading hip.
https://youtu.be/qwy1HNMfhbk?t=578

3. Next, your leading shoulder collapses and your rear arm drags behind, and you're slow getting off the rear foot because of the horse stance. Hips are mostly still sliding forward toward the target (watch your video in slow motion).

Beat the Power ("Horse") Stance


Probably will help to isolate the mechanics on the front leg and learn to drop and swing on a tilted axis:


And seek this in standstills and x-step.

4. Finally, you can see how much more action Simon gets against the ground leading his swing, whereas your body has kind of stalled out trapped behind the brace because you were never really "on top" of your leg like Simon is.


Also this:



Doing it with a medicine ball is good too. Weights help.
Click to expand...

This post makes more sense the more I read it now. Thanks so much for this great writeup. I have been obsessing over my form since I started this thread and I have crawled through pretty much every forum post regarding technique here more than one time.

I feel I have made great progress, but still have a lot of areas to improve.

I feel the shifting from behind, and rounding issue have been my biggest aha moments. I throw farther with less effort now due to actually bracing and getting body into more right positions than before. The quoted post also makes a lot more sense when I read it now.

Status now is that, yes, I still need to continue working on posture. Its alot better in my eyes, but not there yet. I have been looking at the drive leg with an effort to shift into the brace balanced on the front leg better. This have been something I have been working on along with pronating elbow, bending the disc into the pocket and trapping all momentum that I build up until i explode out into a wide swing.

So thanks so much Seabas22 and Brychanus for guiding me so far!

Me as of today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faa64YHfDdY&ab_channel=AndréRisinggårdSortland
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-hetZrpdt8&ab_channel=AndréRisinggårdSortland
 
Behind view - you are leaning too far over your toes - toward east/right tee side.
 
sidewinder22 said:
Behind view - you are leaning too far over your toes - toward east/right tee side.
Click to expand...

I guess your earlier point about not being afraid to plant the heel with the backfoot during the glide could help. Ill try it out.
If you don't mind me asking, so i understand it better for myself; Is this in regard to balance?

Thanks for all your continued help. Looking at my form development these last two months have been awesome !
 
Just a general perspective -

posture, balance, sequence etc. are all deeply related in DG or other sports throws/swings. You can do moves that have different tradeoffs in different balances and postures. If you force sequences through bad posture it usually backfires in one way or another (if not right away, then later).

What I think SW is trying to get you to do there is get your balance more "inside" your posture and centered relative to your feet. Then, as you make mechanical tweaks in that context it is more likely that you can achieve the more optimal sequence. More (consistent) power and easier on the body at the same time.

IMO/experience a lot of the "best" posture for DG feels way more relaxed and easier to move in general. It definitely still has athletic demands as you add momentum, but they always feel surprisingly easier when doing them than whatever I was doing before. Learning to embrace that surprise over and over is a good thing.
 
Makes sense. Thanks for the explanation.
I will throw in some more standsstills aswell in the coming days and week working on balanced in frame with good posture.
 
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