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Form Check

sidewinder22 said:
Getting closer. You still like to lean back too much and trying to create extra weight back in the x-step instead of moving forward in athletic balance.

Frame 1 - note how you haven't driven all your mass forward of trailing right foot.

Frame 2 - note how you are leaning behind trailing left foot and starting backswing behind foot. Hershyzer 1 foot into wall, Hershyzer 2 head into wall.
Click to expand...


When you talk about leaning behind are you referencing the hip angle moreso than the shoulder angle?
 
texasissouth said:
When you talk about leaning behind are you referencing the hip angle moreso than the shoulder angle?
Click to expand...
Center of gravity/mass behind rear foot pressure point. If you look at Will in frame 2 his CoG is either stacked right over rear foot or even forward of it.
 
I chopped it up a little more for clarity
NLDOmj8.png
 
That video about pressure v weight was like a small lightbulb.
Good news: I can crush a standstill and it feels great, but it's harder to hit lines without the momentum drawing you towards a target.

Bad news: I cannot for the life of me figure out how to integrate this into a kinematic motion or three step or anything. And now I can outdrive a walkup with a standstill.
 
I made some progress with my backhand by vastly shortening the left step in the right-left-right final three steps. However everything getting shut down and other events sapped a lot of my will so I'm still rusty-ish and haven't been working on form diligently.
What has come along well recently is my forehand, which looks like this. Unfortunately I hurt my shoulder at WVO so I can only throw hyzer and flat forehands and no overhands. I'm probably gonna get it looked at this winter.
 
Injured shoulder on FH?

Note how your upper arm is really moving back and forth from the shoulder socket a lot into the backswing, probably moves 90 degrees from straight out of chest abducting horizontally to straight out side inline with shoulders.

I feel like my upper arm barely moves horizontal abduction, it starts like 30 degrees forward of the shoulder line(elbow leading), and then maybe abducts 20-30 degrees getting pulled back in transition forward from backswing inertia/lag and externally rotates in the socket while lower arm supinates back.

You can still do the windmill backswing but it should basically only be the lower arm swinging around, while the upper arm only moves a little horizontally, while it rotates externally around so the elbow leads and the whole arm is loaded/cocked back. You can see me doing that lower arm windmill in my standstill in the side view and then I go into pendulum.


 
sidewinder22 said:
Injured shoulder on FH?

Note how your upper arm is really moving back and forth from the shoulder socket a lot into the backswing, probably moves 90 degrees from straight out of chest abducting horizontally to straight out side inline with shoulders.

I feel like my upper arm barely moves horizontal abduction, it starts like 30 degrees forward of the shoulder line(elbow leading), and then maybe abducts 20-30 degrees getting pulled back in transition forward from backswing inertia/lag and externally rotates in the socket while lower arm supinates back.

You can still do the windmill backswing but it should basically only be the lower arm swinging around, while the upper arm only moves a little horizontally, while it rotates externally around so the elbow leads and the whole arm is loaded/cocked back. You can see me doing that lower arm windmill in my standstill in the side view and then I go into pendulum.


Click to expand...

I've always had a.. loose shoulder, basically if I raise my arm above my head it will, and always has, pop out of socket. I threw too many thumbers at WVO trying to stay competitive and escape the woods and made it way worse.

FH doesn't bother it one bit as long as it's a neutral-to-hyzer angle. Anything on anny hurts.

I will avoid the windmill and draw back along the line for shorter touch ups or not full power FH, but the full windmill to get the disc behind me generally causes less soreness and helps me load up the wrist. Having the disc that far behind me doesn't seem to negatively impact power a lot and it helps immensely with the load placed on the shoulder. If I do a full rip with my upper arm not abducted back, it will hurt.

I do realize it's a lot of excessive motion, and looks frankly a bit ridiculous.
 
I would just start with the upper arm more back. You are doing like the mirrored motion pattern of the lead arm in this AMG vid, Pros are doing less work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FllwDHWGxk#t=7m55s

Also you do a FH x-step which ok, but your pelvis is open the entire time so your legs are all sorts of twisted up. Should be striding/gliding forward with the pelvis more closed so the rear leg can more easily step behind unrestricted by the pelvis and lead leg. This should also help with reducing your need for more arm movement and power giving your more rotational momentum from the hips actually closing and then opening.
 
sidewinder22 said:
I would just start with the upper arm more back. You are doing like the mirrored motion pattern of the lead arm in this AMG vid, Pros are doing less work.

Also you do a FH x-step which ok, but your pelvis is open the entire time so your legs are all sorts of twisted up. Should be striding/gliding forward with the pelvis more closed so the rear leg can more easily step behind unrestricted by the pelvis and lead leg. This should also help with reducing your need for more arm movement and power giving your more rotational momentum from the hips actually closing and then opening.
Click to expand...

I think I've actually watched that video in another form thread, but about rounding on backhand haha. I would agree that it's not peak efficiency to have that extra abduction, however I think sacrificing some power to provide a longer time/distance for my forearm pronation helps a lot with how low impact my forehand feels muscle wise. Keeping the upper arm in does give more power, but also puts a quicker twisting force on it and does leave me sore. It's kind of how the reverse W compared to a M pitching motion is tougher on the joints because you have to quickly go from unpronated to pronated and back vs neutral to pronated. Obviously any motion which adds time will reduce explosiveness. But since my shoulder is a weak point, and I can still hit 330 FH, which can be competitive in MA1, I'm willing to make that trade off.

I will agree I need a lot of work on closing off the hips. The x step is merely for comfort - I found success in terms of hitting lines and repeatability by simply imagining a reverse backhand and trying to copy it. This is an area I can for sure add power without the concerns listed above. I have had success making sure to plant a little more closed, but without the chain behind it, simply forcing yourself to plant more closed can sometimes just end up more awkward feeling.
 
Note how your rear foot is pointed targetward, your toes are leading underneath and restricting the pelvis from turning further back. My rear heel leads the toes underneath allowing the pelvis to turn further back freer.

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How is the Roost? I'm guessing you have been to Jenkins Mt too?

Your body is too far behind your feet/x-step or your feet are moving too far ahead of your body instead of moving/gliding forward more centered.
 
I still find it hard to get body/hips forward/rotated without ending up on that left heel. I should take slow mo of just trying random stuff to see what it looks like. I've really liked my standstills once I watched that Clements video where you kind of "push" with the left foot during the back swing, though sometimes it can mess with my already sketchy bracing. So I've been trying to cheat some and adapt that into my x step and kind of throw x steps like standstills since I can't figure out how to push off with the right foot.

I only played Talon at RR, but I will say it is if someone designed a long course specifically to punish the type of driver shots I'm bad at. Its a lot of downhill shots with no room to swing a hyzer. I'm already bad at downhill, I think I still have a slight nose up release, and not being able to cheat and throw a wide hyzer makes it twice as difficult. Super well designed, like all Biscoe courses, not often I play ball golf courses where I have multiple tee shots with mids and run the whole spectrum in my bag off the tee of mid, fairway, driver.

Jenkins mt is also good, and now supplants the second closest course to me from Rockland. Though Rockland will always have a place in my heart for drastically improving my game. I think it's designed by the guy who used to run Revolution bags or something? Its one of the few courses I get to throw drivers on a lot of tee shots that I don't think is boring, a lot of fun elevation changes and interesting landing zones.
 
Yeah, you get nose up because you are too far behind your front foot.
 
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