S.E.'s Bag...prepare to judge

[S.E.]

Let me start out by saying I've been playing for 8 months. I have a max drive distance of about 500' and good accuracy around 400'.

Overstable drivers
-DGA Proline Tsunami 173
-Innova Star T-Rex 175
-Innova Star Max 172

Stable drivers
-Discraft ESP Surge 173
-Discraft ESP Avenger 173
-Discraft ESP Flash 173
-Innova Star Orc 169
-Innova Star Firebird 171 (on its way out of my bag)
-Innova Star Destroyer 175

Stable control drivers
-Innova Star TL 171
-DGA Proline Riptide 171

Understable Drivers
-Innova Star Beast 172
-Innova Star Sidewinder 174
-Innova Star Roadrunner 168
-DGA Proline Rogue 171

Midrange
-Discraft ESP Buzzz 176 (does it all)

Putters
-DGA Proline Titanic 171
-Discraft ESP FLX Challenger 170

Putting is the bread and butter of my golf game, and I get asked every day what putter I use. The Titanic is hard, stable, and by no means what a good putter seems like it should be, but I will NEVER get rid of it. It's won me more respect and cash than anything else in my bag. It's my most suggested disc for people. It IS only a magnet, but hard plastic builds accuracy.

 

[Marmoset]

18 discs, 18 different molds- I can already tell you that the other posters will give you lots of flak for that.

The theory is that you can truly learn your discs by paring down the number of molds in your bag. See Blake's thread...
http://www.discgolfreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=640

 

[almiller]

Your pretty stiff on what platic you chose to use huh? Which I can actually appreciate, Im pretty steady on champion/z plastic with the exception of my few dx beater discs and high fliers.

 

[VictorB]

18 discs, 18 different molds- I can already tell you that the other posters will give you lots of flak for that.

The theory is that you can truly learn your discs by paring down the number of molds in your bag. See Blake's thread...
http://www.discgolfreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=640

^This.

It seems like you are doing nothing but depending on the discs to make a shot for you. Cut down to one disc mold for each of the basic mold categories:

-Distance driver
-Stable Fairway Driver
-Moderately Overstable driver
-Very Overstable driver
-Understable driver
-Midrange
-Putter

Your game will thank you for it later, because you will be learning how to shape lines, and make the disc do what you want, instead of the disc dictating what you can or cannot do as a thrower.

edit: DX/S/D Plastic is your friend. Embrace it, love it.

 

[ferretdance03]

I have a max drive distance of about 500' and good accuracy around 400'.

Putting is the bread and butter of my golf game, and I get asked every day what putter I use.

It would seem to me that you should be giving the advice...

 

[tushamajig131]

I have a max drive distance of about 500' and good accuracy around 400'.

Putting is the bread and butter of my golf game, and I get asked every day what putter I use.

It would seem to me that you should be giving the advice...

+1

edit: DX/S/D Plastic is your friend. Embrace it, love it.

+1

anyway, to the real point of the thread:

as some of you have become aware, i am a minimalist so this bag is burning my eyes and making my head hurt just thinking of 18 different molds with 18 total discs...

Stable Control Drivers: Teebirds here, if you like the feel of them. I say teebirds because you already have a TL, so get a TB for more stability.
-Innova Star TL 171
-DGA Proline Riptide 171

Distance Drivers: Pick one and get multiple copies in different weights, plastics, and stages of wear. They are all great discs, just pick one.
-Discraft ESP Surge 173
-Discraft ESP Avenger 173
-Discraft ESP Flash 173
-Innova Star Orc 169
-Innova Star Destroyer 175

Moderately Overstable Drivers: Pick one. I would go with TRex
-DGA Proline Tsunami 173
-Innova Star T-Rex 175

Very Overstable Drivers: Pick one. If you like the Max better, go with the max. otherwise, the Firebird is a great overstable disc (one of the best there is). Also, is your firebird an FX or FL? If its an FX, way better overstable driver. If an FL, makes a great stable control driver in the weight you have.
-Innova Star Max 172
-Innova Star Firebird 171 (on its way out of my bag)

Understable Drivers: Pick one of these molds. There is no way this many understable molds are necessary. By varying the amount of beat-ness (dont ask) on a disc, and the amount of hyzer, 1 mold should be plenty for this spot. Personally, I would go with the sidewinder.
-Innova Star Beast 172
-Innova Star Sidewinder 174
-Innova Star Roadrunner 168
-DGA Proline Rogue 171

Midrange: If one ESP Buzz is doing all midrange duties, i would imagine you are relying on your drivers for most shots that would normally call for a midrange (of course if you are throwing 500' then drivers and putters may be all you need). Think about what you do on a hole that is 300' long. With your power, do you just power down on a driver? I think you would find it easier to get a midrange out there due to the decreased chance of a skip/fly by. Perhaps adding a Wasp for overstable midrange duties and once this buzz is beat, add a new one. that way, you have overstable, straight, and understable midrange shots all covered. midranges are, in my opinion, way more important to be able to throw than distance drivers
-Discraft ESP Buzzz 176 (does it all)

Putters: If the Titanic is really your BnB putter and the Challenger is your upshooting disc, then i guess they can both stay. However, if the challenger is more stable than the titanic, i would learn to putt with those, or alternately, learn to upshoot with the titanic.
-DGA Proline Titanic 171
-Discraft ESP FLX Challenger 170

You should realistically be able to cut this down to 9 or less molds (TL, TB, FX, Orc (example), TRex, SW, Buzz, Wasp, Challenger and as stuff beats in, TB, FX, TRex, Wasp, Challenger)

Just something to think about

 

[garublador1]

I have a max drive distance of about 500' and good accuracy around 400'.

Putting is the bread and butter of my golf game, and I get asked every day what putter I use.

It would seem to me that you should be giving the advice...

That's what I was thinking. 8 months with 400' accurate drives and good putting. My advice would be to play pro in tournaments.

Is there anything specific you want another opinion on?

 

[S.E.]

Here's a thought...If you walk around with a bag full of teebirds, say 8 of 'em just for the point, and you carry all these varying weights and plastics, and in different stages of wear, then you're really just carrying around different discs. a 175 teebird will fly differently than a 165, it's just how it goes. So by carrying my 18 different molds with tiny differences between most of 'em, I'm doing the same thing. I just carry really tough plastic that doesn't wear very fast, that way nothing has to change. Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort. There's a tourny this July up here. I'm gonna try and make it happen.

 

[Mr. Wick]

WAAAAYYYY too many discs. Cut that way down and your scores will follow.
This is what I would do
Overstable - Tsunami
Distance - destroyers at various stages of wear
stable control - Teebird and Tl (whatever plastic you like)
Understable - sidewinder
Mids - you need more of these - Buzzes at diff. stages of wear
Putters - D Challengers at diff stages of wear.

 

[garublador1]

Here's a thought...If you walk around with a bag full of teebirds, say 8 of 'em just for the point, and you carry all these varying weights and plastics, and in different stages of wear, then you're really just carrying around different discs. a 175 teebird will fly differently than a 165, it's just how it goes. So by carrying my 18 different molds with tiny differences between most of 'em, I'm doing the same thing. I just carry really tough plastic that doesn't wear very fast, that way nothing has to change. Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort. There's a tourny this July up here. I'm gonna try and make it happen.

Read this:

http://www.discgolfreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=640

If you don't believe it I wouldn't expect that you'll get any answers that you like from this forum.

 

[AirMaxVang]

Why did you even post your bag in the Bag Critique section when it doesn't sound like you were open to it being critiqued in the first place?

Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort.

If you have 500' power then why wouldn't you just throw a Buzzz 350+.

 

[tushamajig131]

Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort.

If you have 500' power then why wouldn't you just throw a Buzzz 350+.

word

 

[VictorB]

Here's a thought...If you walk around with a bag full of teebirds, say 8 of 'em just for the point, and you carry all these varying weights and plastics, and in different stages of wear, then you're really just carrying around different discs. a 175 teebird will fly differently than a 165, it's just how it goes. So by carrying my 18 different molds with tiny differences between most of 'em, I'm doing the same thing. I just carry really tough plastic that doesn't wear very fast, that way nothing has to change. Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort. There's a tourny this July up here. I'm gonna try and make it happen.

This is not exactly true. A 175 and 165, in the same condition, will fly essentially similar stability wise. Weight has no bearing on the stability of a disc in almost all cases. The only difference in your example is being that the 175 will penetrate a headwind better due to its weight, and the 165 will glide a little better since it is a bit lighter.

The difference in your theory of golf and the one around here is simple. TO use a stick golf analogy, you are basically saying "I need 18 different big bertha drivers to do the job of a 3 and 5 wood". While it may be effective, learning everything about the 3 and 5 wood and how to perform multiple shots with those 2 clubs will make you a better and more complete player.

If that is a message that you cannot absorb or do not want to hear, then these are the wrong boards for you to be posting on.

 

[JR]

Here's a thought...If you walk around with a bag full of teebirds, say 8 of 'em just for the point, and you carry all these varying weights and plastics, and in different stages of wear, then you're really just carrying around different discs. a 175 teebird will fly differently than a 165, it's just how it goes. So by carrying my 18 different molds with tiny differences between most of 'em, I'm doing the same thing. I just carry really tough plastic that doesn't wear very fast, that way nothing has to change. Sure, I can throw my TL 350+ but I'd rather throw my surge or orc that will do the same with a little less effort. There's a tourny this July up here. I'm gonna try and make it happen.

This is not exactly true. A 175 and 165, in the same condition, will fly essentially similar stability wise. Weight has no bearing on the stability of a disc in almost all cases. The only difference in your example is being that the 175 will penetrate a headwind better due to its weight, and the 165 will glide a little better since it is a bit lighter.

The difference in your theory of golf and the one around here is simple. TO use a stick golf analogy, you are basically saying "I need 18 different big bertha drivers to do the job of a 3 and 5 wood". While it may be effective, learning everything about the 3 and 5 wood and how to perform multiple shots with those 2 clubs will make you a better and more complete player.

If that is a message that you cannot absorb or do not want to hear, then these are the wrong boards for you to be posting on.

There's plenty of room for differing opinions in cyberspace. I agree that it takes longer to learn 18 molds and using them optimally for any given shot than it takes to learn a couple of molds and how to make them fly on different lines. The same goes for the unmentioned part about covering all the possible ways a disc can fly and the skills of the player to throw them all. If he's not in a hurry to learn to be a better thrower... No skin off my nose.

I do have to disagree about disc weights of 165 vs 175 in the same mold. It doesn't take a very experienced player to be faced with the situation that a light version starts to turn over when the same mold at max weight is still perfectly adequate for headwinds. As long as they start out with sensible discs like putters and mids and then slow understable to stable drivers.

That 10 gram difference results in a faster initial speed which tends to flip the disc over once the power and form of the thrower improves. Can't keep a 166 Teebird straight when new but on best throws can get almost fadeless flight and farther shots with 150 TB. Even better without the flashing. Almost 400' with a broken in Star 166 Wraith and not being able to really control a new 12x Star Wraith 175. On many lines that is but still useful for some situations. May be my best wind long distance disc with the flashing still on. Will see when I get to throw in the wind next time.

 

[VictorB]

Well, it seems that the pros don't have much problem with turning over true stable discs at 150 class versus their max weight discs....see the Japan Open. As long as your technique is sound they will fly the same, with the noted differences I stated above. That's a discussion for another thread though.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, it seems that the pros don't have much problem with turning over true stable discs at 150 class versus their max weight discs....see the Japan Open. As long as your technique is sound they will fly the same, with the noted differences I stated above. That's a discussion for another thread though.

Just because they can make them fly the same, doesnt mean they are throwing them the same. Im sure they would be toning down their power when throwing 150's.

From my experience, lighter weights always fly less stable. Im not saying they're way flippier but its definitley noticable.

 

[JR]

Well, it seems that the pros don't have much problem with turning over true stable discs at 150 class versus their max weight discs....see the Japan Open. As long as your technique is sound they will fly the same, with the noted differences I stated above. That's a discussion for another thread though.

Just because they can make them fly the same, doesnt mean they are throwing them the same. Im sure they would be toning down their power when throwing 150's.

From my experience, lighter weights always fly less stable. Im not saying they're way flippier but its definitley noticable.

I'm no pro. In calm weather a 150 TB with flashing can take 360' from me no problem and even without the flashing it's pretty reliable to that distance.

When winds pick up things change. No matter how pro you are if you throw a 150 anything like there was no wind and the disc hits a gust of wind you didn't hear, feel or see moving the trees the disc is gonna flip. If you were going for distance. Meaning giving it a lot of power.

JO is usually windy I've been told. The fact that pros flipped 150 discs doesn't prove much. It may be the archer not the arrow or the wind. Rick Voakes uses 150s all the time everywhere. He probably knows them as well as Japanese players. He probably reads the wind better than most and takes off power accordingly. He's not the most powerful thrower around.

 

[garublador1]

No matter how pro you are if you throw a 150 anything like there was no wind and the disc hits a gust of wind you didn't hear, feel or see moving the trees the disc is gonna flip. If you were going for distance. Meaning giving it a lot of power.

I have a couple 130 or so gram S Spirits that won't flip into a wind. They get batted around like a mofo, but they don't flip.

 

[schla104]

The difference between having 18 molds and having 8 is that you no longer rely on the disc. More of the outcome is placed on you and the line you put that disc on. Most people that carry 18 different molds are throwing them one way....FLAT. And yes, when you throw everything flat you need to carry 18 molds. I know, I was one of them. I realized after reading the article and thinking about why I had been disc golfing worse and worse and how I used to play better when I only had 1-2 discs. The thing that changed was that I had all these discs and instead of mastering one, I was mediocre with all of them.

When you really begin to get to know your discs and work on your line shaping, that's when you become a better disc golfer. It becomes about what you can do and not just hoping that the disc does what it should. Plus, it eliminates bad choices. If you have three different molds that are all a bit different but close to the line you want to take, say understable, you will pick one and it may end up being what you want or it may not. When you have one understable driver you know exactly how it flies and exactly how you can get it where it needs to go. It will take a long enough time to learn 8 molds well. And after you learn those 8 then you can add in a disc or two to see if you like something better than what you have. It really is sound advice and I would highly recommend it.

EDIT: Look through some of the Pro's bags. They aren't Pro's because they are lucky. They know what they are doing and they are doing what works.

 

[JR]

No matter how pro you are if you throw a 150 anything like there was no wind and the disc hits a gust of wind you didn't hear, feel or see moving the trees the disc is gonna flip. If you were going for distance. Meaning giving it a lot of power.

I have a couple 130 or so gram S Spirits that won't flip into a wind. They get batted around like a mofo, but they don't flip.

Constant wind it sounds like for you. New or with tuning my 130 S Spirit gets regularly flipped mid flight. First 200' straight then whamo. It' so bad around the ever changing swirling and gusting winds here with constant direction changes that I can't use it on windy days.