What is up with my form? (video)

[dorseymatt]

I've been playing for a year and have developed consistent 370-foot power, with occasional power up to 410 on a good day.

I took this video on a not-particularly-good day, and I figured that would be a good starting point, because I want to become more consistent and improve whatever it is that's lacking in my form.

Am I swooping? Strong-arming? Something else? My sense of perspective is all messed up. I'm at least happy to see I'm pivoting on the heel.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

The video has 4 throws using the following discs:

MVP Volt, 175 g
Pro Wraith, 168 g
Opto Flow, 170 g
Star Destroyer, 172 g

Conditions were slight tailwind. The Wraith and Flow went about 370, the other two a bit shorter.


http://youtu.be/RT1-fIpJW04

 

[apparition]

You kinda hop through your X step, but you still have pretty good body rotation nonetheless. You consistently throw with a hyzer nose angle, which isn't a bad thing depending on your intentions and disc selection. How do you do with more understable discs? I wonder if you could throw an understable disc with a strong hyzer angle and get a little more distance or if you'd overpower them.

Great video, though. I appreciate the good quality!

 

[dorseymatt]

You kinda hop through your X step, but you still have pretty good body rotation nonetheless. You consistently throw with a hyzer nose angle, which isn't a bad thing depending on your intentions and disc selection. How do you do with more understable discs? I wonder if you could throw an understable disc with a strong hyzer angle and get a little more distance or if you'd overpower them.

Great video, though. I appreciate the good quality!

Thanks! I do pretty well with more understable discs and use them pretty frequently (but occasionally turn and burn them, of course). The discs in the video, especially the Wraith and Flow tend to have a little more turn in them when not thrown in a tailwind, also.

I think you're right about there being something wonky with my footwork -- especially on the 4th throw.

 

[mreynolds24]

I would say about the same. Could straighten up a little, or something else to change the angle of the disc. You're getting a great pull on the discs, but I feel there is more distance to be had. Possibly something that will flip up more for you, or straigtening your back a little to throw those discs a little flatter.

Only other real thing is that you have a hitch in your run up, which isn't necessarily bad since you have good mechanics during the throw, but smoothing up the run up could at least keep things more consistent having less moving parts. If you look at most pros, their run up is very smooth, ensuring that their arm/disc stay pretty much on the same plane throughout. Just a thought.

 

[anborn]

you don't actually do an x step. you kinda hop your feet together, but the left foot doesn't actually go in front of your right foot. which is the motion that forces your hips to get into position so that they can unload when you step forward again with your right.

that's probably why it looks a little funky/fast. I'm no form expert but slow your feet and approach down.

ultimately, form is about consistency. even if you do the same exact "poor form" every time you can account for it. then its about accuracy. and if you are consistently accurate, who cares what form you have.

 

[Rocaholic74]

I always feel bad when responding to these because I don't want you to feel bad about your throw...this is just constructive criticism so here we go:

1) You are too fast going from run up to the point of when the disc rips from your hand....slow down..do everything about 75% power and speed...you need to feel the flow of the throw starting from the ground up;

2) Footwork needs a massive overhaul...your not getting your body in the proper position on the reach back to get the maximum momentum of your pull through and arm whipping motion..slow your footwork down a bit to ensure that you get your left foot behind your right foot causing your hips to rotate counter clockwise and when the right foot comes back in front your hips will open thus pulling your shoulders to an open position allowing for the pull through and snap:

3) I don't know if you were intentionally tryng to throw those discs with that much hyzer but be aware of the angle of your forearm and wrist as you do your reach back and pull through...make sure they are not changing or rotating in any way thus changing the angle of release;

4) I would try to straighten your back just a bit throughout your throw...it looks like you are bending a little too much which can stop you from really rotating and can reduce arm speed if too compact.

Remember, I'm not expert but that is what I noticed when I watched your video...Good job by the way of putting up the video and wanting to learn. I'd PM Sidewinding22....he's pretty knowledgable about this stuff.

 

[dorseymatt]

Good calls, guys. I definitely think I need to slow down a bit and really work on doing a proper x-step, making sure my left foot goes behind my right.

Regarding the amount of hyzer -- I do tend to throw with a bit more than most, but am also capable of a flatter release. It was more or less intentional here.

edit: Forgot to mention the bit about straightening up -- I will try that, also. I wonder if slowing down and improving footwork will fix that without even trying.

 

[sidewinder22]

That's some whacky form there. Slowing down and smoothing out is in order. It looks like you have some decent rhythm, and work into the backswing nicely. The bad is when you go down to your rear heel and push off the rear heel instead of the instep of the foot, that kills hip rotation and pushes your weight forward early. When your front foot lands you are almost in a crazy horse stance with knees facing opposite directions, but you do have nice heel pivot, it's just a matter of staying off the rear heel and not lunging forward too far and early which is making you pull the disc through different planes as compensation. The other main issue the pull line, you are throwing a hyzer there but the pull line is more suited for anhyzer. It's basically rounding the pull line and you need to pull more from the inside-out through the body, instead of outside-in around the body. The path your elbow swings(too far to the left, going from right to left) compared to your throwing line(hyzer- left to right) are opposite directions. Fixing the elbow line will also help get your elbow more forward from the shoulder. Working from a standstill with Comets are great for learning inside-out hyzer pull lines.
These should help you lead with the hips better:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu4vLOEthM4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvh-wqkgEYo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggLTM9bfD54
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwNHCRPd3ow

 

[notroman]

Dude, you definitely need to slow down. Way too jerky jerky. Smooth is far.

You start your pull way too high and open up a bit too soon. You are releasing everything with an air bounce because you start your pull so high you are actually bringing the disc down as you pull, so you're not pulling the disc on the same line that you want to throw it. Also during your run up you suddenly plant your foot way left and not on the line you initiated the run up so you immediately set yourself up to throw exactly where those discs went.

All your drives pretty much have that pull where you start up high then force the disc down under your arm pit.

 

[TalbotTrojan]

You do not have what I have heard described as good athletic position. In your run up, all your steps are flat footed. The good news is that you turn on your heel, but that is because all your weight is on your heels the entire time.

The problem with this is that makes everything from start to finish loose smoothness. Even Dave Feldberg has said that smooth is far.

Your arm motion is like turning on a ceiling fan rather than starting a lawn mower. You kinda dip the disc down and back up a little bit as you bring it through. In Tennis you are supposed to hit low to high because the racket can be pulled through at a quicker pace. Tim Tebow (and yes, I am a fan of Tim Tebow) will never be a descent starting quarterback in the NFL because his motion causes the ball to take way too much time to get from the start of the motion to the end. Your form is as good or better than the three guys getting help in this video but he talks about this idea of what your arms should be doing with the disc as you pull through.



To sum up:
1. Athletic Position
2. Be Smooth
3. Better Pull Through

 

[tarel]

do you just practice hyzers?

your not giving enough height in wide open space if you want that "oh wow distance" look up philo's video where he talks about hyzer flex shots this may benefit you if you stop air bouncing.

 

[Redbone1412]

your definitely a little to herky jerky so try to smooth it out some. It may help you to smooth it out by slowing down a little to just work on form. Also, it looks a little to me like you are cupping the disc a little when you throw. in other words, it looks like your wrist is bent in towards your forarm instead of straight. try keeping it straight. But honestly, its not a bad form overall, dont think that you have all these things you need to change in your mechanics. be yourself out there. Everyone is unique in what works for them.

 

[dorseymatt]

Thank you all for the tips over the past couple days. I've been doing some field work and have been making some improvements in my footwork already. It was helpful to slow down and to eliminate the unnecessary step to the left that I was doing -- just fixing that made it easier to properly do the x-step. I've already thrown a coupld 400-ish foot drives with this method, and my throws in general seem to be more consistent.

I need more work, though. And I need to address the ceiling fan syndrome that I apparently have. Should be able to post a video very soon, hopefully showing progress.

Thanks again.

 

[Uncle Dougie]

I don't mean to derail, but could someone go into more detail about eliminating air bounce? Is this kinda of like "bad hyzer-flipping" in a sense?

 

[Fortuna]

I'd say straighten your torso up. Seem to hunch quite a bit in your run up causing more hyzer than wanted. Also I looking for more D in the open, figure out what you like throwing more, either understable, stable or overstable. Learn that flight. Also, your follow thru is just that, you need to follow all the way thru with the pull line. You seem to be short arming a little bit.

 

[dorseymatt]

I'd say straighten your torso up. Seem to hunch quite a bit in your run up causing more hyzer than wanted. Also I looking for more D in the open, figure out what you like throwing more, either understable, stable or overstable. Learn that flight. Also, your follow thru is just that, you need to follow all the way thru with the pull line. You seem to be short arming a little bit.

Thanks, Fortuna. Yeah, I've been trying to straighten up a bit, and when it works, it works very well. When it doesn't, I throw the disc very high and very right. I think it's a matter of just getting used to doing it that way, which I should, because it seems that when I do it correctly, I can feel the proper pull of the disc (hard to explain).

I think that the hunched-over thing is an unintentional compensation for the air-bounce issue -- it was my way of keeping the disc a bit lower.

Once I get the footwork under control, I definitely need to focus more attention on my pull line and follow-through.