Will we ever see another McBeth or Pierce?

[BillFleming]

Possibly. But someone needs to put all their time into disc golf. Two 'McBeth-isms' I've heard and one I saw (on YouTube).

1. For a tournament, some pros were staying together at a local pro's house. One showed up and asked where the video games were. Paul showed up and asked where the practice basket is.

2. Paul was asked if he parties and he said something like: "I'll have time to party when I'm no longer playing disc golf".

3. (On YouTube), Simon Lizotte showed up at Paul's house at 1 AM and Paul was already up and working out on the treadmill before practicing throws.

That's dedication to his sport. His focus is entirely on being the best. I don't know enough about Paige, but I expect it is similar for her. Will there ever be another player at their level....sure, but only if they put in the same effort and time to perfect their game.

 

[araytx]

To set the record straight, it looks like the first meeting between McBeth and Climo was the 2008 Memorial. At that time Climo was the defending world champ, having won the 2007 Championship by 11 strokes.

'07 World Champion MPO was Doss. His 2nd. Champ won '90-'98, '00, '02 & '06

 

[Countchunkula]

I think plastic compounds will continue to evolve. The premium plastic today, may become the base plastic of tomorrow.

I really hope you're wrong on this. I have a really tough time getting a good grip on most of the premium plastics.

I think if the plastic compounds were to evolve, it would be a happy accident if one of the new types was good for DG. No one's formulating custom blends for disc golf manufacturers.

 

[Mando]

'07 World Champion MPO was Doss. His 2nd. Champ won '90-'98, '00, '02 & '06

If that's the case, the list of Climo's career wins on the PDGA site is wrong...

 

[ChrisWoj]

I can't agree. Without Climo, the PDGA would have likely fallen by the wayside, as far as having any relevance with the next generation of disc golfers. McBeth=Mike Trout.

Nah. The "next generation" of disc golfers at that point had no way of even learning who Climo was... for most people he was just a name on a disc and not even that until after he had already won the majority of his titles.

I'm not sure what you mean by that. McBeth, who I consider the next generation,played against Climo as early as 2011 at the Memorial.

I am talking about the fact that when Kenny was winning the majority of his titles we were all sitting at home waiting for the next issue of either DGWN or Disc Golf Journal to arrive periodically.

Oh. So you are saying McBeth probably didn't even know who Ken Climo was before the 2011 Memorial ? Nah.

Your statement was "without Climo, the PDGA would have likely fallen by the wayside." This statement only fits the 1990s - by the 2000s that period was done. I think the major disconnect here is that the entire conversation is surrounding McBeth. Climo WOULD have had an influence on the next generation of disc golfers at that time, but he WOULD NOT have been influencing McBeth et al. at that time. He would have been influencing the generation of disc golfers that are just entering Masters now and in recent years. We should be referring to the generation of players probably best represented by Avery Jenkins.

To set the record straight, it looks like the first meeting between McBeth and Climo was the 2008 Memorial. At that time Climo was the defending world champ, having won the 2007 Championship by 11 strokes.

The defending World Champion at that time was Nate Doss. Climo's last world title was in Georgia, which was in 2006. In 2007 Nate Doss won his second Worlds at Highbridge Hills in Wisconsin.

 

[Three Putt]

Nah. The "next generation" of disc golfers at that point had no way of even learning who Climo was... for most people he was just a name on a disc and not even that until after he had already won the majority of his titles.

I'll always remember getting the 7X KC Pro discs and listening to people go "Who is Ken Klee-mo?" over and over. The vast majority of my customers only knew of the PDGA because "PDGA Approved" was stamped on their golf discs.

Disc golf at that point was growing because of the boots on the ground; the guys getting course installed and the volunteers promoting disc golf on a local level were the main drivers at that point. The fact that we had the PDGA was a bit of a "cart before the horse" situation; we had professional disc golf before we had amateur disc golf so there was a long period where we had a house, but we were still building the foundation under it.

Climo was King at this time when the PDGA was still a bit of an illusion; we acted like we were running a big-deal sport but you would get to an A-tier and it was a bunch of dudes milling around a park pavilion like we were going to have a local 5/10K run or something. It made the boots on the ground feel like we were "right on the verge of something big" to get Disc Golf Journal or Disc Golf World News and read about these events like they were an actual big deal, so it did help motivate the growth. Climo by himself really couldn't move the needle, though. Pro disc golf was too much of an illusion at that point.

Part of the "burnout" factor with TD's in that period was the disillusionment that came with having the curtain of Pro disc golf pulled back; you really got to understand how much of the effort was loaded on your back when you started TDing events. It took a special kind of person to carry that weight, and a lot of people like myself turned out not to be all that special.

 

[Jay Dub]

100% spot on!
I spent two whole summers working on TDing, that was enough for me so yeah, I wasn't all that special either.

I'll always remember getting the 7X KC Pro discs and listening to people go "Who is Ken Klee-mo?" over and over. The vast majority of my customers only knew of the PDGA because "PDGA Approved" was stamped on their golf discs.

Disc golf at that point was growing because of the boots on the ground; the guys getting course installed and the volunteers promoting disc golf on a local level were the main drivers at that point. The fact that we had the PDGA was a bit of a "cart before the horse" situation; we had professional disc golf before we had amateur disc golf so there was a long period where we had a house, but we were still building the foundation under it.

Climo was King at this time when the PDGA was still a bit of an illusion; we acted like we were running a big-deal sport but you would get to an A-tier and it was a bunch of dudes milling around a park pavilion like we were going to have a local 5/10K run or something. It made the boots on the ground feel like we were "right on the verge of something big" to get Disc Golf Journal or Disc Golf World News and read about these events like they were an actual big deal, so it did help motivate the growth. Climo by himself really couldn't move the needle, though. Pro disc golf was too much of an illusion at that point.

Part of the "burnout" factor with TD's in that period was the disillusionment that came with having the curtain of Pro disc golf pulled back; you really got to understand how much of the effort was loaded on your back when you started TDing events. It took a special kind of person to carry that weight, and a lot of people like myself turned out not to be all that special.

 

[araytx]

If that's the case, the list of Climo's career wins on the PDGA site is wrong...

Which list?

This one (pro open champions by age group and year)?

-OR-

This one (PDGA awards, see multiple Worlds Champions below)?

-OR-

perhaps this one (list of Ken Climo's 229 career wins)?




Certainly not the 07 Worlds results page.

Help me find it.



See, I am going by my own recollection -- I didn't have to look anything up, but wanted to clarify. Maybe you were looking at the US Championship instead of Worlds. Champ did win the USDGC in 2007.

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

Even though I believe we'll have dominant superstars in the future, we won't have what Climo did in 1995 ever again. 26 tournaments, finished 2nd three times...and won all the rest. In two of those second-place finishes, it was by a stroke.

I can't imagine that level of domination ever again.

 

[Mando]

Which list?

This one (pro open champions by age group and year)?

-OR-

This one (PDGA awards, see multiple Worlds Champions below)?

-OR-

perhaps this one (list of Ken Climo's 229 career wins)?




Certainly not the 07 Worlds results page.

Help me find it.



See, I am going by my own recollection -- I didn't have to look anything up, but wanted to clarify. Maybe you were looking at the US Championship instead of Worlds. Champ did win the USDGC in 2007.

Go to the pdga site,seach Ken Climo,scroll down and hit the career wins button

 

[captain jack]

Kona Panis has potential.

 

[scooby snack]

I really hope you're wrong on this. I have a really tough time getting a good grip on most of the premium plastics.

I think if the plastic compounds were to evolve, it would be a happy accident if one of the new types was good for DG. No one's formulating custom blends for disc golf manufacturers.

Not certain on this, but Innova formulating new blends, was how champion plastic was developed,.

Anyway, as plastics develop for other manufacturing processes in the future, I wouldn't be surprised if disc nanufacturers adapted to the latest plastics if it benefits them.

 

[Nick Pacific]

It makes me think this is an interesting question: Is Paige Pierce more like the Ken Climo or the Paul McBeth of FPO?

Isn't the FPO of 2021 in terms of numbers/pool where the MPO was in the 1980's? Edit - actually way less than the 1980's. Probably have to go back to the early beginnings.

 

[Jugular]

Isn't the FPO of 2021 in terms of numbers/pool where the MPO was in the 1980's? Edit - actually way less than the 1980's. Probably have to go back to the early beginnings.

There are lots of reasons why comparisons become difficult. The one that stands out to me is that FPO players today almost certainly spend a great deal of time watching and training with MPO players, which is not the kind of talent pool in opposition/reference that MPO players in the 1980s had.

Equipment, video resources, payouts, sponsorships and theory now produce a different landscape than was the case for Climo.

So perhaps it evens out a little such that the FPO today is still comparable to the MPO of the 80s in terms of depth of the competitive field.

 

[araytx]

Go to the pdga site,seach Ken Climo,scroll down and hit the career wins button

I did dude. It's the third link above. It does not show Climo winning the 2007 Pro Worlds.

 

[ChrisWoj]

Even though I believe we'll have dominant superstars in the future, we won't have what Climo did in 1995 ever again. 26 tournaments, finished 2nd three times...and won all the rest. In two of those second-place finishes, it was by a stroke.

I can't imagine that level of domination ever again.

Considering the competitive era.... maybe he didn't do it, but this year by Paul was DAMN CLOSE: https://www.pdga.com/player/27523/stats/2015

26 events
21 1sts
4 2nds
1 3rd

2 playoff losses, and losses by 2, 4, and 5 shots.

EDIT: ****, somehow I missed the Aussie Open single rounder at the top... 20 1sts only, 2 3rds, and that was a single round loss by 4. My bad. I only caught it bc I went back to see if he played any C Tiers like Climo. Which.. he did, 1 to Climo's 3. Definitely played fewer small events than Climo overall among C and B tiers.

 

[Emoney]

My theory is the next Paul Mcbeth will be more difficult.

I dont think they have made disc golf difficult enough to create the space for someone to dominate.

If 100 players in the future are capable of -15 rounds consistently, how can 1 person stand out?

Disc golf is still a baby of a game.
More money brings more players, it also starts future pros out much earlier in life to aquire skills and consistency.

With the womens division so small, they have much more room to grow. So we can definitely see another Pierce.

 

[DiscFifty]

If 100 players in the future are capable of -15 rounds consistently, how can 1 person stand out?

Pretty much sums up the entire op. :thmbup:

 

[Jugular]

If 100 players in the future are capable of -15 rounds consistently, how can 1 person stand out?

By shooting -16 consistently.

I wonder, have you read the rules of the sport recently? :thmbup:

 

[Jay Dub]

My theory is the next Paul Mcbeth will be more difficult.

I dont think they have made disc golf difficult enough to create the space for someone to dominate.

If 100 players in the future are capable of -15 rounds consistently, how can 1 person stand out?

Disc golf is still a baby of a game.
More money brings more players, it also starts future pros out much earlier in life to aquire skills and consistency.

With the womens division so small, they have much more room to grow. So we can definitely see another Pierce.

This is all assuming disc golf will be seen as a serious pro sport in the future to people who do not play disc golf.

I don't think that will ever happen.