Closing a Gap

[GoobyPls]

Not the 90's clothing stores, those seem to be closing on their own. No, I'm talking about ways to close up a gap that you want to prevent players from throwing.

One of the longer holes at my home course plays alongside a property line. As the course got popular this year, more and more discs started finding their way into a neighbor's (treeline-protected) yard. Mostly from casuals and coronavirus newbies. He put up a fence, and we opened up new gaps to the pin to stop players from throwing that way. But we just got word that there's damage to his fence from people jumping it to retrieve discs. He's already been in contact with the city to complain.

I think one of the biggest reasons people are still throwing over his fence is that the original, largest gap on the hole is maybe 40' from his property line. Miss your line and get unlucky enough to clear the trees, and you're in his yard.

Has anybody ever tried to close up a previously open gap? What did you do? For reference the gap is probably about 30' wide, with large mature trees on both sides.

 

[ray1970]

May not help with the newbies or outlaw types but a simple mando should suffice.

 

[Kegelexercise]

My first thought is re-locate the pin. Might make a cool long hole shorter, but hopefully it's just one hole. I personally feel like mandos in place to prevent stuff like this reeks of poor course design. That's just me though - I get it, sometimes they're a necessary evil.

A course that I play often had to re-locate a good 4 or 5 holes due to adjacency to neighbors & complaints from them.

 

[Steve West]

"alongside" any parallel line (neighbor, road, etc.) is the worst possible way to position a hole. You can't fix it. Close it or relocate it entirely.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Steve's right. Fairway parallel to the property line provides the greatest opportunity for discs to cross into their yard.

Moving the pin further away from the fence will likely result in fewer incursions, but as long as the disc's basic path is parallel and adjacent to, a decent length of their yard, and there's not a sufficient buffer between the fairway and the fence, it's foreseeable some # of discs will end up in the yard.... whether it's because they get flippy, or end of flight fade, or wind is the culprit.

That said, a decent overhead image might help the DGCR collective generate a few useful ideas.

 

[ru4por]

I also am going to agree with Steve. A disgruntled (rightfully so, it seems) neighbor is nothing but a threat to the entire course. Appease the threat and insure the future of the course.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Worth looking at alternatives to greatly reduce (if not completely eliminate) no likelihood of descending up in their yard, but if no suitable solution can be found....

Sacrificing the quality of one hole (or the hole itself), to ensure the course's long term viability might be the right answer.

 

[elmexdela]

all you need is one pissed off neighbor and some vandalism/litter to get that course pulled

 

[GoobyPls]

That said, a decent overhead image might help the DGCR collective generate a few useful ideas.

Here's an overhead, along with one of the suggestions for a redesign. There are now additional gaps directly to the basket, but a lot of players are still taking the original gap on the right, and throwing over the fence as a result. I'd like to move the teepad to the right, and move the pin shorter and farther left, just past the wall of trees. Still want to close up the gap on the right somehow if possible

 

[elmexdela]

Here's an overhead, along with one of the suggestions for a redesign. There are now additional gaps directly to the basket, but a lot of players are still taking the original gap on the right, and throwing over the fence as a result. I'd like to move the teepad to the right, and move the pin shorter and farther left, just past the wall of trees. Still want to close up the gap on the right somehow if possible

i like it

maybe dig the basket deeper in the woods towards the old pin spot

and have only one route towards the basket and then an exit trail since its hole 18

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Moving the key to the right, and the pin to the left, would route shots relatively away from the fence line.

I'm sure it would greatly improve the situation, especially for RHBH players, which should be the majority of shots.

Depending on the angle (some things you just kinda gotta see in person for yourself), and wind, it might still be foreseeable, it may make all the difference you need.

It looks like pretty bad LHBH and RHFH shots still have a chance of ending up there, but your proposal should greatly reduce that liklihood.

Suggest you find some players who throw like that and field test the new positions go get a feel for just how likely it is.

Is there any sort of prevailing wind you typically see on this hole? If so, what direction does it blow relative to the new positions? I could see R to left crosswinds or headwinds helping to reduce incursions, but L to R or tail winds making things worse for LHBH &RHFH shots.

 

[joecoin]

Golf netting.

 

[Rastnav]

Here's an overhead, along with one of the suggestions for a redesign. There are now additional gaps directly to the basket, but a lot of players are still taking the original gap on the right, and throwing over the fence as a result. I'd like to move the teepad to the right, and move the pin shorter and farther left, just past the wall of trees. Still want to close up the gap on the right somehow if possible

I assume that the gap you are trying to close is the gap actually shown as the proper line?

I like the idea of a redesign, but since we are brainstorming. Cutting access to the existing basket from that side, by planting, for example, cedar bushes/trees, would also do a lot to discourage that line from being thrown. This would encourage the use of the new gaps. You could also plant some faster growing trees in the gap you don't want thrown.

But you'll get better result with a redesign would be my guess, fwiw.

 

[GoobyPls]

I assume that the gap you are trying to close is the gap actually shown as the proper line?

Correct, though the imagery Google used (and UDisc copied) is a little out of date. The wall of trees on the left used to have honeysuckle and vines blocking direct access to the pin, but the parks department cleared it all out for us recently. Now the mature trees are still there, but with very playable gaps between them. I'd like to see the pin moved 20-25' past the wall of trees, on the far left side. That and moving the tee right should convince even newer players to throw right at it.

 

[Jimb]

Correct, though the imagery Google used (and UDisc copied) is a little out of date. The wall of trees on the left used to have honeysuckle and vines blocking direct access to the pin, but the parks department cleared it all out for us recently. Now the mature trees are still there, but with very playable gaps between them. I'd like to see the pin moved 20-25' past the wall of trees, on the far left side. That and moving the tee right should convince even newer players to throw right at it.

With your redesign idea, is there any chance of moving the tee even farther to the right, slightly into the tree line? Maybe by doing so you could use an existing tree/trees to block off throws directed at the offending gap, forcing the use of the desired line.

 

[GoobyPls]

With your redesign idea, is there any chance of moving the tee even farther to the right, slightly into the tree line? Maybe by doing so you could use an existing tree/trees to block off throws directed at the offending gap, forcing the use of the desired line.

Not really. The trees are almost all on the other side of the fence.

Also, the drawn-on line in the attachment isn't mine. I'd like the tee moved to where the line indicates, but would like the pin moved kinda halfway between the current location and the "P" on the drawing

 

[BillFleming]

A mando really won't solve the issue...especially for newbies, etc....I know I've missed a few mandos. The quickest solution would be to put up a sign on the tee box saying something like this:

The fence is out of bounds and is not park property.
Climbing the fence to retrieve discs is trespassing.
If your disc does end up on private property, please go to the owner's house after the round and ask permission to retrieve your disc.

Does the course have a place to turn in lost discs? If so, you could ask the owner to turn in any discs to the lost and found - and put on the sign, that the owner will turn discs into the lost and found. Or ask the owner if he/she would call the owners of the discs to get them returned.

 

[GoobyPls]

A mando really won't solve the issue...especially for newbies, etc....I know I've missed a few mandos. The quickest solution would be to put up a sign on the tee box saying something like this:

The fence is out of bounds and is not park property.
Climbing the fence to retrieve discs is trespassing.
If your disc does end up on private property, please go to the owner's house after the round and ask permission to retrieve your disc.

Does the course have a place to turn in lost discs? If so, you could ask the owner to turn in any discs to the lost and found - and put on the sign, that the owner will turn discs into the lost and found. Or ask the owner if he/she would call the owners of the discs to get them returned.

The owner has been really good about working with us. He walks the fence every few days and picks up discs he finds, and works with a local player he knows who returns them. The regular players (including the guys who play in the league there) won't jump the fence, and will wait until their discs get returned. But casuals and newbies are jumping his fence and damaging it, and we don't have any way to control them. He's understandably running out of patience.

Sounds like the first thing we're going to try is adding a new pin placement short and left of the treeline, closer to the "P" in the drawing. We'll leave it there except for during league nights and tournaments, when more experienced players are throwing.

 

[elmexdela]

my idea with the pin placement and being deep into the woods was so only a certain path would be chosen to enter it vs multiple ways to attack the hole

which would hopefully help funnel the throws/traffic away from the private property

 

[BillFleming]

The owner has been really good about working with us. He walks the fence every few days and picks up discs he finds, and works with a local player he knows who returns them. The regular players (including the guys who play in the league there) won't jump the fence, and will wait until their discs get returned. But casuals and newbies are jumping his fence and damaging it, and we don't have any way to control them. He's understandably running out of patience.

Sounds like the first thing we're going to try is adding a new pin placement short and left of the treeline, closer to the "P" in the drawing. We'll leave it there except for during league nights and tournaments, when more experienced players are throwing.

I'd still put up a sign. Even if it is only a temporary plywood sign on a pole. Let people know the fence is not the parks and climbing it is trespassing. The owner will work to get discs back to them.

At least then you show the fence/property owner that you are doing all you can to stop the issue.