Ok, this question is so elementary it has either been discussed a lot in previous threads (please show me the link) or I just don't get the most elementary things about the disc ratings.
How could a disc have a plus rating for turn? Where's the logic? Either it turns or it doesn't. There is no reversed turn that is the opposite to the usual turn. Turn is turn. On or off.
If a disc goes left directly after you release it (r.h/b.h), that means it has started fading immediately. A disc doesn't turn left and then fade left. What it does in that case is fading all the way. And if there is NO turn; isn't 0 a better way to symbolize "nothing" than to put a plus rating? (…even more nothing?) If a +1 on turn is showing that the disc is very high speed stable, then you could just as well give another disc -1 at fade to show how extremely well it resists fading. I think my Wham-O would qualify for a minus in fade, if it wasn't for the fact that there is no such thing as "reversed fade". Either it fades or it doesn't. Same with turn. Otherwise; can we have a glide -1 disc if it glides worse than a glide 0 disc? To me that sounds silly. So, why this strange way of dividing turn into plus and minus.
I'm looking for a logical explanation, and my best guess is that turn is mixed up with understable (nicely symbolized by a minus), and that the opposite of understable is overstable (plus). But unlike understable there is no opposite to turn. It's there or it's not there. Of course, nothing says that something is the opposite to something else just because it goes from a minus to a plus (a scale can start at any number), but if that is the case here then the highest number available would mean "not turn over", and the highest number I've seen for Turn is +2 (on Joes Flight Chart). A +1 would then mean "this disc could turn over" and 0 would mean "this disc can definitely turn over". So, if that is the principle here, then +2 is the closest we get to a zero turn today, but tomorrow we might have a disc with a turn of +3 (which would then be the zero turn disc). With the same method a -1 at speed would mean "this disc flies slower than a speed 0 disc", rather than "this disc goes backwards" (or in what other dimension it would travel into).
OR, could it be that the pluses on turn simply symbolize "going left" (for r.h b.h) instead of meaning a physical term for a certain aerodynamical force?
If Discraft rates a disc to -1 it's logical because it symbolizes an understable flight path as opposite to an overstable or a stable flight path. But Innova's +1 turn on Viper, or Joe's Flight Chart's +2 (also Viper) isn't logical because… well you guessed it: There's no opposite to turn, and turn is usually described with 0 or negative numbers, unless of course if it's based on a gliding scale across the pluses and minuses, where a plus isn't the opposite to a minus. That would mean a different way of using plus and minus than we use to describe overstable and understable (because there the plus and minus means two very different types of flight characteristics rather than being a measure of how much of something).
At Joe's it's h.s.s instead of turn, and I'm not sure about the difference between the two. I would say they mean the same, but if the h.s.s. of +2 at Joe's could simply mean "the first part of the flight path" rather than being a technical term or force. Then it would make sense. Then Viper could take off to the left, described with a +2, and then continue further to the left (l.s.s). I don't know the technical definition of "turn", but I see it as some kind of physical aerodynamic counterforce to the fade. For some reason it is measured in minus, and when it then goes from minus to plus the counterforce would become a helping force. And then we would be going in new dimensions again. It's just not logic!!
Please help me sort things out. How can turn be plus?
How could a disc have a plus rating for turn? Where's the logic? Either it turns or it doesn't. There is no reversed turn that is the opposite to the usual turn. Turn is turn. On or off.
If a disc goes left directly after you release it (r.h/b.h), that means it has started fading immediately. A disc doesn't turn left and then fade left. What it does in that case is fading all the way. And if there is NO turn; isn't 0 a better way to symbolize "nothing" than to put a plus rating? (…even more nothing?) If a +1 on turn is showing that the disc is very high speed stable, then you could just as well give another disc -1 at fade to show how extremely well it resists fading. I think my Wham-O would qualify for a minus in fade, if it wasn't for the fact that there is no such thing as "reversed fade". Either it fades or it doesn't. Same with turn. Otherwise; can we have a glide -1 disc if it glides worse than a glide 0 disc? To me that sounds silly. So, why this strange way of dividing turn into plus and minus.
I'm looking for a logical explanation, and my best guess is that turn is mixed up with understable (nicely symbolized by a minus), and that the opposite of understable is overstable (plus). But unlike understable there is no opposite to turn. It's there or it's not there. Of course, nothing says that something is the opposite to something else just because it goes from a minus to a plus (a scale can start at any number), but if that is the case here then the highest number available would mean "not turn over", and the highest number I've seen for Turn is +2 (on Joes Flight Chart). A +1 would then mean "this disc could turn over" and 0 would mean "this disc can definitely turn over". So, if that is the principle here, then +2 is the closest we get to a zero turn today, but tomorrow we might have a disc with a turn of +3 (which would then be the zero turn disc). With the same method a -1 at speed would mean "this disc flies slower than a speed 0 disc", rather than "this disc goes backwards" (or in what other dimension it would travel into).
OR, could it be that the pluses on turn simply symbolize "going left" (for r.h b.h) instead of meaning a physical term for a certain aerodynamical force?
If Discraft rates a disc to -1 it's logical because it symbolizes an understable flight path as opposite to an overstable or a stable flight path. But Innova's +1 turn on Viper, or Joe's Flight Chart's +2 (also Viper) isn't logical because… well you guessed it: There's no opposite to turn, and turn is usually described with 0 or negative numbers, unless of course if it's based on a gliding scale across the pluses and minuses, where a plus isn't the opposite to a minus. That would mean a different way of using plus and minus than we use to describe overstable and understable (because there the plus and minus means two very different types of flight characteristics rather than being a measure of how much of something).
At Joe's it's h.s.s instead of turn, and I'm not sure about the difference between the two. I would say they mean the same, but if the h.s.s. of +2 at Joe's could simply mean "the first part of the flight path" rather than being a technical term or force. Then it would make sense. Then Viper could take off to the left, described with a +2, and then continue further to the left (l.s.s). I don't know the technical definition of "turn", but I see it as some kind of physical aerodynamic counterforce to the fade. For some reason it is measured in minus, and when it then goes from minus to plus the counterforce would become a helping force. And then we would be going in new dimensions again. It's just not logic!!
Please help me sort things out. How can turn be plus?
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