Pls don't add courses under construction

[EricW]

The top of the "Add Course" page says (in red no less)...

DO NOT add courses that are either planned, still being built or are otherwise unplayable, they will be removed. Once they are complete they can be added to the directory.

Besides the course not being ready with things like tee pads, consider that there might be safety and environmental items that need to go in before players do.

I'm kinda chapped because I have a promise to parks dept not to promote play until a safety walkthru is done, have random players trying to play through on work days, and then find out the course is already added here based on a Facebook post calling for volunteers...

 

[Improbably]

Disc golfers are the worst thing about disc golf.

 

[Noill]

yeah, I don't get that... the course owner, designer, or someone with the authority to do so should be the one listing the course... I have a course listed here that someone posted on PDGA. Now I get contacted through the PDGA which I don't want. I will ask the PDGA to delist but still...

 

[scarpfish]

The wiki nature of this site admittedly causes problematic issues like this. A lot of people not associated with DGCR don't seem to realize that often the party that adds a course here is often someone without any official clout in its creation.

 

[Noill]

well, this thread prompted me to contact PDGA... in about 20 minutes I got an e-mail from Cliff Towne saying that it was taken down... so atleast they are good about that

 

[DavidSauls]

yeah, I don't get that... the course owner, designer, or someone with the authority to do so should be the one listing the course... I have a course listed here that someone posted on PDGA. Now I get contacted through the PDGA which I don't want. I will ask the PDGA to delist but still...

Generally true, but not always practical. Sometimes the course owner, designer, or someone in authority is not on DGCR. Then, it would certainly be good to ask them before proceding. Sometimes that person can't be found. A lot of little 9 holers in small towns wouldn't be listed at all if some random disc golfer hadn't taken it upon himself to add it---and we're better off for it.

To your second point, I'm guessing you're talking about a private course? If you think keeping a course off sites like this and the PDGA is tough, you ought to deal with people adding them to various phone apps, or dealing with websites that just aggregate information. At least with DGCR and PDGA, the listings are easily found, may even appear in a google search, and contacting the sites is easy.

 

[DavidSauls]

The top of the "Add Course" page says (in red no less)...

DO NOT add courses that are either planned, still being built or are otherwise unplayable, they will be removed. Once they are complete they can be added to the directory.


Besides the course not being ready with things like tee pads, consider that there might be safety and environmental items that need to go in before players do.

I'm kinda chapped because I have a promise to parks dept not to promote play until a safety walkthru is done, have random players trying to play through on work days, and then find out the course is already added here based on a Facebook post calling for volunteers...

That sucks. Whoever listed it was trying to be helpful, of course. But for a course being installed, the person in charge shouldn't be hard to find, and certainly should be asked whether it's ready to be listed.

But the site guidance covers a range of conditions. Clearly, it should not be listed if it's unplayable. But if it's playable but incomplete, it should be up to the person in charge. If he is willing to have it listed while, say, teepads are still natural, awaiting installation, why not? I've played a course where we teed out of the wooden frames, and was glad to know about it.

(And, strictly speaking, I've got a private course that's been under construction for 12 years, and will never be "complete". We listed it when we got to 18 holes that were playable, even if a few tees were just landscape flags.)

From a site user point of view, if a course is playable and it's condition accurately described, I'd prefer it be listed. From a designer/owner/authority point of view, it depends on what they want---sometimes they'll list a course that's playable, but block reviews until it's complete.

(On one local public course, the designer refused to install the baskets until everything else was in place, which helped prevent this sort of thing, not to mention kept the locals motivated to help work instead of just playing).

 

[sisyphus]

...From a site user point of view, if a course is playable and it's condition accurately described, I'd prefer it be listed. From a designer/owner/authority point of view, it depends on what they want---sometimes they'll list a course that's playable, but block reviews until it's complete.

(On one local public course, the designer refused to install the baskets until everything else was in place, which helped prevent this sort of thing, not to mention kept the locals motivated to help work instead of just playing).

I concur here. It's definitely a double edged sword. DGCR has an achievement for listing courses, which motivates active users to share their discoveries (which keeps the excitement level for all of us course baggers). But there are definitely times when the course designer would prefer to wait on listing a new course (or maybe even choose not to have it listed at all).

When Osage Grove went in, Adam held off on placing the baskets for probably a year, or a year and a half. I refrained from listing it because he wanted to hold off. Eventually somebody put it on here. Zach's Black Bear course was listed by him, but he is holding off reviews until he feels it's more complete. I've played private courses where the owner asked to remain unlisted. Some eventually list themselves, but we should never open up a listing without trying really hard to find out the owner/designer's preferences on the matter.

Meanwhile, probably the best solution if you want to hold off on a listing is to store the baskets until you're ready?

 

[Noill]

Generally true, but not always practical. Sometimes the course owner, designer, or someone in authority is not on DGCR. Then, it would certainly be good to ask them before proceding. Sometimes that person can't be found. A lot of little 9 holers in small towns wouldn't be listed at all if some random disc golfer hadn't taken it upon himself to add it---and we're better off for it.

To your second point, I'm guessing you're talking about a private course? If you think keeping a course off sites like this and the PDGA is tough, you ought to deal with people adding them to various phone apps, or dealing with websites that just aggregate information. At least with DGCR and PDGA, the listings are easily found, may even appear in a google search, and contacting the sites is easy.

yeah private courses... public ones would be just fine to list by anyone who knows about them... some effort should be put in to contact the owner of a private course to see if it is OK to list.

 

[goosefraba1]

I concur here. It's definitely a double edged sword. DGCR has an achievement for listing courses, which motivates active users to share their discoveries (which keeps the excitement level for all of us course baggers). But there are definitely times when the course designer would prefer to wait on listing a new course (or maybe even choose not to have it listed at all).

When Osage Grove went in, Adam held off on placing the baskets for probably a year, or a year and a half. I refrained from listing it because he wanted to hold off. Eventually somebody put it on here. Zach's Black Bear course was listed by him, but he is holding off reviews until he feels it's more complete. I've played private courses where the owner asked to remain unlisted. Some eventually list themselves, but we should never open up a listing without trying really hard to find out the owner/designer's preferences on the matter.

Meanwhile, probably the best solution if you want to hold off on a listing is to store the baskets until you're ready?

It just depends on the designer. Adam's Osage Grove is within one of the mega DG towns in the US. Holding off on dgcr was probably a good thing while he was trying to install everything. Me on the other hand, Black Bear is in the middle of nowhere. If I can get a few people walking the holes, that cuts down on what underbrush i have to cut.

It will be ready and reviewable eventually. It just takes longer without the proper establishment of a large club. If Black Bear was in Cincy, the course would be finished by now.

 

[#19325]

Plain and simple. Do not install baskets until the course is ready to open. When the baskets are up there will be players checking out the course.

 

[Noill]

Difference being public and private... store the baskets until ready on a public... but a private course is different...

besides, if it's my land (for example) I'll put up baskets when I want to because it helps me envisage the hole... I built my course pretty much solo (had one other helping out) and it's a whole different thing to do it that way than to have a Parks & Recs dept, the locals, or the club doing it.

Public land is different and I don't see anything wrong with listing a public course without any approval if it is actually installed. Private land really should be up to the owner, designer, or someone with approval.

 

[goosefraba1]

Difference of opinion i suppose. I would have almost zero support without having posted it. Having posted it, I have had lots of support that ibeouldnt have had otherwise. Like I said before... a course in a set DG communtiy should wait as long as possible to post. A course in the middle of nowhere like mine... actually is helped by posting it. Literally an hour drive to the closest course from here otherwise.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Plain and simple. Do not install baskets until the course is ready to open. When the baskets are up there will be players checking out the course.

... store the baskets until ready on a public...

Public land is different and I don't see anything wrong with listing a public course without any approval if it is actually installed. Private land really should be up to the owner, designer, or someone with approval.

Couldn't agree more.
1) Don't list a private course without owner's permission.
2) Don't list a public course until the baskets are in. The truth of the matter is, once baskets are in, even if other work has yet to be completed (tees, signs, etc), the locals will be all over that thing like flies on ****.

That said, for the record: I'm not a proponent of baskets being the last thing installed.

I think tees should be the last thing installed. Baskets and tee markers are fairly easy to relocate as needed. Moving tees is a lot more work & $$. Not uncommon for things to work out differently in real life than they did when pencil was put to paper. Let people play the course for a few months with natural tees, and see if tee positions should be tweaked before pouring concrete (or other difficult to tees to relocate).

 

[EricW]

This is not about keeping people off the course. This is not about volunteers or players finding and playing a course under construction.

This IS about posting a course on this website and broadcasting that it is open for play.

Have some respect for this site's rules. Have some respect for the people who are putting in the time, money, and sweat.

Please let those responsible for the course, add the course. (Or at least reach out and offer help).

I'm asking not telling. It's going to take me (and Tim) more time to fix the bad entry, than if I put it in from scratch.

On a side note, the person who added the course is
-a site regular
-has a lot of reviews
-got the f'n course name wrong
-got other details wrong
-put up some lame screenshot map ripped from facebook
-and even reviewed the course with comments like rough, no signage, and tough to navigate

Well no s#!+, we broke ground a week before your review.

 

[JeremyKShort]

We debated what to do putting a course in at a local university. We didn't want to add it too early, we didn't want people showing up to a course that was roughing in a lot of places. But we also didn't want some one else adding and not having control over how it went in. We decided to add it once the baskets were in the ground. It wasn't finished, but we knew that people from outside our group wee starting to play it, so we put it at that point. But we were honestly worried that someone would add it before we were ready.

 

[Noill]

This is not about keeping people off the course. This is not about volunteers or players finding and playing a course under construction.

This IS about posting a course on this website and broadcasting that it is open for play.

Have some respect for this site's rules. Have some respect for the people who are putting in the time, money, and sweat.

Please let those responsible for the course, add the course. (Or at least reach out and offer help).

I'm asking not telling. It's going to take me (and Tim) more time to fix the bad entry, than if I put it in from scratch.

On a side note, the person who added the course is
-a site regular
-has a lot of reviews
-got the f'n course name wrong
-got other details wrong
-put up some lame screenshot map ripped from facebook
-and even reviewed the course with comments like rough, no signage, and tough to navigate

Well no s#!+, we broke ground a week before your review.

I'm guessing that you are the designer on this new course as well?

 

[EricW]

I'm guessing that you are the designer on this new course as well?

Lucky enough to get Craig's lead on the design. It's a little neighborhood 9-holer in a wedge of a regional park. I'm the builder (liason and parks approval pusher, pipe dream to reality conversion specialist, chief bean spender, #1 arrive-first leave-last shovel bringer, and exasperated forum ranter).

 

[chevis]

Listing a course here should be one of the last things. once the course is here ppl will review it in the state it is in. this means you could have a great course but not fully developed & the reviews you receive while under construction will be low & unfair to the course.

 

[DavidSauls]

Depends on the course, and the wishes of the designer/owner.

We listed our private course when we reached 18 holes, and it was VERY rough. Almost famously rough, at least regionally. But we wanted to let people know about it, and to have people visit.

Now it's 30 holes in two layouts, more or less, and those early reviews weigh it's rating down a little....but of no consequence. It's had enough reviews as it improved to mostly offset the earlier ones.